# Angel Fish Eggs?



## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

I came home tonight to my surprise to think that gravel somehow got pushed up onto the leaf..upon furthur inspection I was SHOCKEDand happy?

Can someone please let me know, as this is my first with angels..are these fertilized...are they not?
How can I tell if my other angel(Used to be 3 now down to 2) is a male/female?...
The one in most of the photos is very protective of the eggs so far....

I don't know what to do with the eggs?Should I take them out, is it to early to tell if it's worth it..because I know for sure they will get eaten.
This is suppose to just be a grow out tank haha..did not plan this..

I was trying to add more angels but those three were rescues and went into the tank together..now every time I try and introduce one no success...

I've also attached a short clip of her/him around the eggs...Sorry for the awful pictures.video...I still have no idea how to take a decent photo ect of fish in a tank..booo lol

Thanks again


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

oppsie...


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

Random other thought...

Even if these eggs don't survive...
I was planning on heading out today after work to purchase a 20 gallon tank for possible future eggs.

I heard you need airstone, spongefilter?(is another filter acceptable if it has an adjustable flow rate?),heater..and to use methylene blue....2-3 drops per gallon? to prevent fungus...does anyone know if that's good to use and where I can generally aquire this?.

Also, everywhere talks about moving the slate slab from the origional tank..but, I didn't have one set up and clearly they bred on a live plant leaf..how would I move the eggs over safely?

Thanks.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Adding angelfish to an established group (even if only 3) frequently ends in failure as you have mentioned. Angels are territorial fish, and they consider the tank theirs. It varies, but the dominant fish in a group will frequently drive any intruders away, to the point of killing them. Unless you move them to a completely different tank with a new environment, I would not attempt adding more fish to the group. And even this does not always work.

Fertile eggs will be translucent, somewhat amber-coloured. Infertile eggs are white. Sometimes a few eggs within the clutch do not get fertilized and turn white. The parents will remove these by eating them. They constantly fan the eggs to prevent fungus which can also kill the egg.

Female angels have been known to lay eggs with no male present, and tend them, at least for a while.

Wild-caught angels tend to make better parents right from the first spawning. Commercially tank-raised angels frequently eat their first several spawns, usually during the egg stage. It takes about 60 hours for the eggs to hatch. If the parents are stressed by anything, they will often quickly eat the eggs or the young fry if they have hatched. It is a natural instinct. The idea seems to be better they get the nourishment than a predator. It can take several spawnings before tank-raised fish are successful.

Having other fish in the tank is a risk if you want to successfully rear the fry. Once fish know eggs are present, or fry if they should hatch, they can be very determined in getting them. And while the parents may manage to protect them during daylight, it is at night they often fail, when nocturnal fish (any catfish for example) will have a feast.

It is fascinating to watch the parents guarding their eggs and then shepherding the fry around the tank. If only they are in the aquarium, this could be successful (eventually, bearing in mind the above). If you want to ensure success, either move the parents (only) to a spawning tank which can be a 20g high, or remove the eggs to a small tank, a 5g or 10g will work. Place the leaf [slate works better but this usually means a bare tank except for a piece of slate on which the eggs will be laid] next to an airstone with a fine spray; this replicates the parents' fanning to keep the eggs clean. Methylene blue can be added to the water to prevent fungus, or acriflavin is sometimes added too. A sponge filter will keep the water clean and not trap the fry once they hatch. They will enjoy picking off bits of plankton and food from the sponge. Food for fry is usually newly-thatched brine shrimp.

Byron.


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

Byron said:


> Adding angelfish to an established group (even if only 3) frequently ends in failure as you have mentioned. Angels are territorial fish, and they consider the tank theirs. It varies, but the dominant fish in a group will frequently drive any intruders away, to the point of killing them. Unless you move them to a completely different tank with a new environment, I would not attempt adding more fish to the group. And even this does not always work.
> 
> Fertile eggs will be translucent, somewhat amber-coloured. Infertile eggs are white. Sometimes a few eggs within the clutch do not get fertilized and turn white. The parents will remove these by eating them. They constantly fan the eggs to prevent fungus which can also kill the egg.
> 
> ...


O yes,I know they are very territorial and I haven't tried adding any newbies in forever. I'm content with just the two.

I'm planning on heading out asap to purchase a 10-20 gallon to move the eggs over into..as I don't want to move the parents over.


I can just pluck the leaf off the plant? and move it over?..do i just place it directly on the floor of the bare bottom aquarium ?
I just don't want the leaf blowing all over the place..I have slate I could place on a corner of the leaf to hold it down...
I'll also be placing a peice of slate in the grow out tank with the angels for next time..unless of course they use another plant haha..

Obviously I'll treat the water for the tank but, how do I cycle it in time for the fry?Aren't they very sensitive. Is it okay because of daily water changes?

---Just went home for lunch...some of the eggs that were white this morning(a couple)...were eaten and the other eggs were clearish...only about half of the eggs are left now as last night they got eaten but.. I didn't notice until later on in the evening .Do they even look fertalized or..do I just move them and wait and see i nthe next couple days to see if they become white ect..indicated infertal?


Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks so far!


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

kattty said:


> O yes,I know they are very territorial and I haven't tried adding any newbies in forever. I'm content with just the two.
> 
> I'm planning on heading out asap to purchase a 10-20 gallon to move the eggs over into..as I don't want to move the parents over.
> 
> ...


It has been a while since I spawned angels, early 1980's that was, but the procedures haven't changed I don't think.

If they are eating white eggs, that is good; they know. Personally at this stage I would leave them. You may lose the eggs/fry, but they will spawn again.

If you move the eggs, the leaf has to be stable, with the airstone sort of under or near by to create a constant gentle current over the egg cluster. Eggs that go white should be picked off (tweezers) because adjoining eggs can be affected by them. Methylene blue in the water helps control fungus, but eggs will still sometimes turn. Siphon water from the existing tank to fill the bare tank, and it does not need to be deeep, just a few inches.

If the parents/eggs are separated, the parents can spawn soon, I think it is a couple weeks...sorry, forgotten now, someone else may know. Lisa had angels spawning, if she sees this.


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

Byron said:


> It has been a while since I spawned angels, early 1980's that was, but the procedures haven't changed I don't think.
> 
> If they are eating white eggs, that is good; they know. Personally at this stage I would leave them. You may lose the eggs/fry, but they will spawn again.
> 
> ...


 
Ooo..Okay thats perfect
Yeah I've read once they spawn,they often will spawn often....every couple weeks like you mentioned.

I jsut figure I'll try it out and see..and meanwhile, after I take teh eggss out tonight I'll go buy some slate and deal with getting that prepped for the other tank

Thanks again..It won't kill the plant to take that leaf off?..do I take it off right where the leaf meets the stem or..do I take the stem and all..


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

> Thanks again..It won't kill the plant to take that leaf off?..do I take it off right where the leaf meets the stem or..do I take the stem and all..


No it won't hurt the plant, and remove the entire stem & leaf.


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

Byron said:


> No it won't hurt the plant, and remove the entire stem & leaf.


 Perfect..Thank you very much


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

soooo..they laid another batch again the other day.(12th)...I was ready with the other tank...(20 gallon which I set up from the intial batch..

I did the dosing with methalyn blue ect..and now..we have free swimming babies

Don't know how many will survive thsi stage as I've made a few rookie boo boo's but...Hopefully:0Cute little buggers...

Does anybody know how long once they become free swimming they ahve to eat newly hatched brine shrimp? I was reading 2 weeks and then begin to add finely crushed flake food..should I do this ,suppliment it with something else or...any suggestions would be great!

Thanks!


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

kattty said:


> soooo..they laid another batch again the other day.(12th)...I was ready with the other tank...(20 gallon which I set up from the intial batch..
> 
> I did the dosing with methalyn blue ect..and now..we have free swimming babies
> 
> ...


I believe it is around 3 weeks when they can start taking larger food, but if they are eating the shrimp I would finely powder some flake food, soak it in a saucer of tank water to get it waterlogged, and squirt it (a baster or similar) gently into the shoal of fry. They will likely eat it. I like to get fish onto prepared foods soon only becuase it is easier for me;-).


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

I figure I'd wait a week ro sobefore crushing up some fine flake food..is there a good brand with high nuturtional value that may benefit these guys over something else?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Omega One and Hikari seem to get good reviews from most members.


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## kattty (Jul 22, 2010)

Can someone possiblly tell me what the colour on these guys is/maybe called??
Sorry for the bad video..taken with my blackberry
Thanks..


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