# 29 and 5 gallon tanks



## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok so thanks to the help of the many great people here, I finally started my two tanks. 

Here is my first thread as a refrence point if interested.
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-aquarium/please-help-new-guy-his-new-48529/

My main tank is a 29 gallon. Cascade 700(rated 65gallon) canister filter. Substrate is Eco-complete (both tanks have a 40lbs combined, may need more) 20watt 6500k GE daylight bulb. Using Prime and Flourish









My second tank is a 5 gallon Tetra starter kit from walmart. All I added was a tetra 15w heater and a 14w 6500k light bulb. It will house a beta and 3-5 corys.












So far the 5 gallon heater stoped working and the 29 gallon heater is still warming the tank up too 81. So I need to take a trip to the store. Other then that my plants should be here within the next couple hours. I will keep you updated

btw once i find my actual camera I will use that instead of my cell phone. And I need to clean the outsides of the tanks


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

81 degrees? Which fish did you decide on for that tank? Are they both black finish on black cabinets? It is hard to tell with the light. They both look fantastic thus far, can't wait to see them with the plants and decor, not to mention fish.


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## kitten_penang (Mar 26, 2008)

yeah the tanks looks good even without fishes.but with the whole set done i bet it will be amazing


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Looking good. With your 5g, is that shelving unit from IKEA? If so, I I have the same exact one but with doors. If it is from IKEA, I'd reinforce the top shelf from the weight of the 5g. The IKEA furniture is not solid wood. What I did is simply cut some 2x4's to the size of the shelf and wedge them under the shelf below the tank to relieve some of the pressure on the shelf. Just a heads up.


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## kitten_penang (Mar 26, 2008)

do 5g really get that heavy or is the wood umm... sorry to say this. of lower quality?? coz it looks sturdy to me


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks everyone. No stock decided for the 29 except zebra loaches. But te heater is set on 78 and i have never seen it go off and now it's at 81. And yes everyhthing is black on black

Lisa, the shelf is from walmart and is not solid wood but it seems fine. I think in the picture I took it looks like it's bowing but in person it does not and it's perfectly level. I may use 2x4s anyway. Thanks for the heads up.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

It looks fine in the picture. Just thought I'd mention it since it's 60+ pounds with gravel and a thinner shelf. I just reinforced because I was nervous it could collapse over time and thought I'd pass the idea on to you


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## kitten_penang (Mar 26, 2008)

oic no wonder..thats very nice of you =)


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Love the black on black. What kind of heater do you have that is over heating? Something to think about before putting fish in there. over heating can certainly be a health risk for your fish. My heat heats to the temp and then shuts down. As soon as temps drop, it turns on again. Temps should stay within a degree or two, not just continue heating. 

Placing your heater under the outflow of water might help to circulate the water a bit and get a more even temperature through out the tank.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

heater is a hydor. ill grab a new on tonight.

Here is the pics with the wood. They kinda suck, still looking for my camera


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

do you remove the black pots for larger plants or plant them?


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Remove and disgard the pots and all foam that is included in the pot.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I am so excited to see your plants. Hurry, Hurry!


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

That was alot of work. My nana and java fern are sitting in a bucket under a daylight bulb for now cause i need somehing to attach it with,

I like how ir looks but i donno if I did anything wrong so please help
the vals on the left are being pushed around by the current


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I think they look awesome. You can just use fishing line to tie plants to the wood. You are going to be amazed at how fast that fills in.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Looks awesome. Inga is right. Just wait until it fills in! If you don't have fishing line, use simple sewing thread. You'll be able to remove the thread in about a month because the fern and anubias will root itself to it. Nice job, neighbor! ;-)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

there is somthing I dont like about it. I donno what it is, i hope the water clears by the morning. The heater in the 29 gallon is fine.

I HATE working in the 5 gallon. I need more substrate but not a whole bag. Can i just keep the extra in a bucket with water?

Java fern is a pain in the butt lol. I love the nana

So tomorrow ill tidy everything up, get the new heater for the 5 gallon and finish my stock list. Wensday its a trip to petland for buy one get one, and hopefully a beta! (should the beta or corys go in the 5 gallon first?)


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I am sure you will change your mind a few times about which plant is your favorite and which you maybe don't like so much. In my case, I am just someone who has to putz so I change things around a bit too often. I think my fish are used to it though, they don't seem overly stressed. In fact, they tend to swim right around my arm when it is in the tank, watching what I am doing as though they want to make suggestions. lol

I wasn't a fan of the Java Fern in the beginning either but all of a sudden it took off and sent out a bunch of daughter plants which was nice, makes the log look a bit more full. I am not a fan of the whole trying to tie things on. Admittedly, I am tending toward Swords as they are so easy to deal with and in my opinion, they look nice too. 


I can't say for sure and maybe someone will chime in but if it were me, I would start with the Cory's in the five gallon. You will be getting Dwarf Cory's though, right? Most of the other species require a larger tank for Cory's, I think a minimum of 20 gallon long for a group of Cory's. The Dwarf profile says small group in a 5 gallon. I know the Oto Cats can go in a 5 but again, you need to wait for the tank to get a bit of algae for them or they will starve.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

OK, I moved everything around so here it is as of now, also added 2 java ferns and the A. nana. Let me know if anything is to close or is positioned wrong. Also are all the plants all right? I see yellowing/signs of wear, but everything should bounce back right? I gave them extra light yesterday and today but going to put it on for 8 hours starting tomorrow, if that is enough. I’m not sure how to prune each plant yet, so I don’t know if there is anything that should be removed now.
Temp is 78, pH is 7, ammonia was .00-.25, didn’t have a chance to check nitrites or nitrates. The water is still cloudy but I am getting more substrate tonight so I expect to stay dirty. My filter is on full force and creating a nice current for the plants (especially the vals and sprite). Is this ok just until it clears or will it damage them?
If the water clears will I be able to get fish tomorrow? I may hold off anyway because hurricane earl MAY hit us in some way over the weekend.























































Also most of my plants have this white stuff on them. DOnt know how well you can se it in the pic. There is some hairlike stuff and other stuff that looks like eggs


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I am sure some experts will chime in soon. To me, they look awesome. Have you added any of your Seachem's Flourish Fertilizer? Byron says they need it right away which makes sense. They have been stressed from shipping and might need a little extra TLC. Don't freak if some of your plants start turning yellow and dying as they say this is normal and the plants should still bounce back. It is from the air getting to the leaves. My Huge Swords that are extremely green in my tank right now did that and I was sad thinking they were dying but all of a sudden new leaves grew and they are huge now. 

The things that look like eggs, might be just that. Snail eggs. Byron also assured me, they won't eat your plants and that having snails in the tank is actually a good thing. They eat all the dead plant material, extra food and some algae in your tank. So... I guess no need to freak about that. 

I had to go back and add a bit more Eco after adding it originally. I didn't want to mess up the tank so I was careful in the handling. I filled a small plastic container with it, then lowered it down into the water where I wanted it and dumped it slowly and carefully. It didn't fog up my water hardly at all. 

I don't see why you could not add fish right now. That little bit of foggy stuff in the water is no issue. Your plants should help with any ammonia and all looks great. Just don't add a huge amount all at once. Start with 2-3 and then wait a week to add more.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks, yes I added the ferts. Snails are fine with me, and Im sure they will be fine with the loaches too 

I keep going back and forth on my stock list other then the zebra loaches, but either way I should only add 2-3 fish at first even if its a schooling fish? I guess their size matters too.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I believe so. When I first got my Tiger Barbs, I got 3 then a week later, 3 more then a week later, 3 more. One died which left me 8 and now several months later I lost one more so I have 7. I think some folks have added more of a schoal of really small fish to an established tank but I think you would be best off adding a few at a time.

Wait! I just read the profile and it says that Zebra Loaches should be in a tank that is a minimum of 48 inches long. Are you going to be upgrading in the next year? It says they can get each around 4 inches long. Any interest in any of the dwarf varieties? The Banded Dwarf loach has that cute stipe look and stays smaller and would happily fit into a 29 gallon with a nice size schoal.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Bryon and others said 5 zebras should be fine. I dont usually see any of the dwarfs near me, just yoyos, zebras and clowns, and zebras are the smallest of those 3.

I cant find more substrate. The hidden reef is out, I wonder if nemos has any. I feel like my plants are worse then they were earlier today, can i over dose on ferts or should I just stop worrying?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I got another heater for the 5 gallon and same thing. its supposed to be set at 78 and can be plus or minus 2 degrees but the tank is like 70 and the heater is not on.............annnd i just broke my thermometer:evil::evil::evil::evil:


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

bigehugedome said:


> I got another heater for the 5 gallon and same thing. its supposed to be set at 78 and can be plus or minus 2 degrees but the tank is like 70 and the heater is not on.............annnd i just broke my thermometer:evil::evil::evil::evil:


 
Kind of sound like how I started out. It seemed everything was not working out right. As far as the plants, just relax a bit and give them a little time to bounce back. You don't want to add more fertilizer as that can throw off the balance which could cause greater issues. The plants have been stressed and will take a little time to start looking really good again.

If Byron said it is alright with the Zebra's then go for it. I just noted the profile and wanted to point it out incase you hadn't noticed it. As far as the heater goes, maybe try a different brand? I don't know what to tell you on that. I think a heater is very important and you don't want to either fry your fish or have them having big changes in temp which could cause them to get sick, stressed or even kill them.

Will you be getting some Loaches today? Maybe having a few in your tank will help you to relax and feel better about all your hard work thus far. Also, they add to the needs of the plants too.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok so the temp in the 5 gallon went from 70 to like 75-76 so this should be good, allthough it seems like its much colder. I guess I will get the corys first, we saw juli corys (spelling??) that we really liked. I guess 3 of them would be fine. 

Still dont know what I want in the 29 gallon. Other then the zebras, Im stuck between a combo of:
Rosy barbs
cherry barbs
black ruby barbs
rasbora vulcanis (they looked so nice and so active)
I really like rummy nose tetras but dont think they would be good to add first
hengel rasbora
cardinal tetras
some yellowish tetra I forget the name haha

Im thinking the showpiece for the bottom would be the zebras and the rummy noses for higher up then maybe hengels and cherryy barbs cause they are smaller. But im just not sure. If anyone has any specific ideas of fish that would work well with any of those listed above please let me know. Im going to a L(ish)FS tonight to get the rest of my substrate and I would love to get some fish tonight. I was thinking I would float the bag on one side of the tank while i add substrate. 


If anyone has any more ideas on corys for the 5 (good with betas) or any fish to go with the ones listed above please let me know.

PS. the cloudiness in the 29 gallon looks like its just coming from the wood


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

What L(ish)FS are you gonig to? Nemo's? Check to see if they have the Eco first. Last I went they didn't have the substrate. They have pgymy cories that would be good for your 5g. I'm not sure you have enough room for the Julii cories. Might want to run it by Byron in a PM.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Wont add loaches first cause they dont have scales so I wanna make sure the water is perfect before they go in. Thanks for the advice, Im sure everything will be fine.

Yes im going to nemos, I did call and they do have it!!! Such a relief, and id figure I could get some fishies there. and cool I will check out the corys allthough I think Im gonna wait a little while longer for them since Im having issues with that tank.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Hm, I don't know, I never had any cloudiness from my wood when I added it. Did you soak or boil it first? I usually did but I am not sure that it makes that much difference because one piece I didn't and it didn't cloud up. Are you referring to sort of a "tea coloring" in the water? If so, that is just the tannins being released from the wood and that doesn't hurt anything. It should go away after a few water changes. The color won't hurt your fish our your plants, so if that is what you are referring to, no worries. 

I can't wait to see your new fish. I have a feeling you will just feel so much better once you have a few in your tank.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Inga said:


> Hm, I don't know, I never had any cloudiness from my wood when I added it. Did you soak or boil it first? I usually did but I am not sure that it makes that much difference because one piece I didn't and it didn't cloud up. Are you referring to sort of a "tea coloring" in the water? If so, that is just the tannins being released from the wood and that doesn't hurt anything. It should go away after a few water changes. The color won't hurt your fish our your plants, so if that is what you are referring to, no worries.


 
yea thats what i ment. No i did not soak it, to impatient


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

bigehugedome said:


> yea thats what i ment. No i did not soak it, to impatient


LOL Be careful from here on out though. The aquarium game is one of patience. lol Something I too, am sadly lacking in. I swear I was checking my plants every single day expecting to see some huge growth. lol Heck, if they could keep up to the weeds in my yard, I would be thrilled. The tannins are a non issue. If you notice a white fuzzy stuff down the road, you might want to remove the wood and boil it at that point as some folks have done. I did that once too but honestly, I think it is just sap and not an issue either. I have not had an issue with any of my other wood pieces. The huge piece of Mopani wood that I got was too big to fit in a kettle to boil so I skipped it and had a little coloring but no other issue. With a few water changes, it is clear as can be now. My fish LOVE hanging out around the wood and hiding under it. I won't have a tank without wood from now on.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I hear ya, I love the wood, and the only reason I was scared about the color of the water was because I didnt realize It was coming from the wood. Can I boil it tonight and throw it back in once its cooled or do I have to soak it still?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Had to read through the entire thread in case I missed something. I have a couple comments.

First, back on the heater issue, it is usual for many (even very good) heaters to not be exact on the set temp. It takes a bit of testing, which is why in a hew tank with new equipment I always suggest leaving it overnight before adding fish. Just to ensure the heater and filter are working correctly. I have a couple heaters that keep the temp at 78 when they are set at 75. As long as they are constant in the temp, all's well. And in small water volume like the 5g, it is easy for heaters to overheat, so watch that one especially.

Second, the wood; I would leave it. It will leech tannins, yes; they are completely harmless and in fact good for the plants and fish (soft, acidic water fish like you are getting and the plants). It is probably already attracting bacteria (not meaning just the nitrification bacteria, all the other good bacteria you need).

Third, the Zebra loaches. This is a 29g, I assume 30-inches long? Five zebra loaches max. With that wood [they will just love that, esp if it has tunnels or you can create small hiding spots near the substrate--I find using a flat piece of rock under one end will help in this, the rock unlike the substrate won't shift] and plants they will manage.

Fourth, corys in the 5g. Three max of the julii--if they are true julii as this is a smaller species--or a group of 6 of one of the dwarf species. But corys should go in last; they are particularly sensitive in new tanks, esp the dwarf species. I have previously always lost most of them in new tanks, but never lose one in established tanks, so I've learned the hard way.

Fertilize from the first as Inga (I think) said. This looks very nice, the 29g is going to fill in and be a lovely aquascape. Well done.

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks so much I feel alot better just reading everyones comments. Thinking about it I kinda like the tannis, its more natural. I mean streams are not crystal clear so why does my tank need to be (unless its something harmful thats making it dirty).

So i will get the beta first for the 5 gal. As for the 29 gallon Im just gonna get something Out of that group that I like and then base the rest of the tank around them and the loaches. I would guess that rummynose tetras are not good to add first? Those are like the only fish I know I want other then the loaches lol.

Thanks everyone!


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

So I just got home and the new heater for the 5 gallon had bubbles all around it, I looked and it looks like there is a small crack in it. Do i need to take everything out and clean it again? Im not sure how the heaters work or if it leeched anytging bad into the tank


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

If it is actually cracked, I would take it back and get another; you just bought it I recall. Other than that nuisance, not a problem.

Rummynose should not be added to a new tank; wait for it to become established, a few weeks (plants cycle it immediately, but the whole biological thing still has to settled down). What other fish do you intend?


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

They both look very nice. How about a group of Harliquin Rasbora they look very nice swimming in a group.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

On fish, I would like a combo of what i put in post #26. I 100% want rummy noses and zebra loaches, both of which should not be added right away so I donno what else to get. Still thinking of cherry barbs, or hengel rasbora, but too much orange and redish. I cannot decide what I want and its killing me, I love them all

I added extra substrate and its looking better.My vals are just wilting and wilting, they look worse every few hours, i hope they bounce back. The sprout from the darf lilly really grew so Im excited for that.

I HATE my 5 gallon. For one thing the java fern is way too big already (i had to use the rubber bands they were shipped with in order to attach them. is this ok?) But i hate everyting else. I dont know what to do. Ill post pics later, maybe you guys can help me. Im going to try and just keep everything the way it is for now and hopefully decide on fish tomorrow.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Odessa barbs (spelling?) looked nice too but they may be too big. Idealy I would like:
5 zebra loaches
9 rummynose tetra
# of some kind of barb
# of some kind or rasbora

If I get a bigger barb i would assume I shouldnt get any rasbora, same thing if I get a bigger rasbora (valcanis) i would assume i shouldnt get any barbs, So maybe # cherry barbs and # harliquin or hengel rasbora.

And why did Nemos have an alligator Gar, that thing scared me


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I must first caution you on barbs. Most are fairly active and "large" by comparison to the smaller tetra (such as rummynose) and rasbora. And they need space, more I would suggest than a 29g when other fish are included. Barbs, rasbora, tetra and danio are all shoaling fish, so always remember this means 6+ of each species you may decide on. And in a 29g the space is limited. Esp for barbs. Temperamentally, the medium-sized (except for the Tiger and its variants) are generally peaceful if not kept with sedate fish with fins or very small fish (the dwarf rasbora, etc). Several barbs are included in our profiles, please have a look, they are under "Cyprinids."

Rasbora and tetra generally do well together, they are very similar in requirements, behaviours, etc. Another nice feature of the rasbora is their shoaling behaviour; if you want a group of fish that really does swim together as a group more often--what many refer to as "schooling" thought not technically correct but it gives the idea--nothing beats the rasbora. I have or have had several species, and all shoal almost constantly. Rummys are good for this among the tetra, probably one of the best tetra for shoaling together.

I don't know if your water parameters have been mentioned, but a caution on rummynose: they should not be in a pH above 7, same as cardinals (these species are frequently sympatric, = found in the same habitats). Neither species (which are still wild caught most places) last long in basic harder water. Again this is noted in our profiles.

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

pH is 7.0 and its the same from the tap so the wood should lower it. How long does this take to happen and does it loose its effects after water changes?

Ammonia is between 0-0.25. nitrite and nitrates both 0.

Hardness should be between 7-8dGH.

Thats why i figured harliquin or hengels since they are smaller and cherry barbs. would i be able to do
5 zebra loaches
9 rummynose
7 cherry barbs ( 4 females, 3 males)
7 hengels rasbora

This is basically what i had in my other thread (page 11, post 108 http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-aquarium/please-help-new-guy-his-new-48529/) And if I do his I will add the cherrys tonight.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> pH is 7.0 and its the same from the tap so the wood should lower it. How long does this take to happen and does it loose its effects after water changes?
> 
> Ammonia is between 0-0.25. nitrite and nitrates both 0.
> 
> ...


I really do not like suggesting fish to others:| as your aquarium should have what you want in it--provided they are compatible of course and on this aspect I am free with my comments. No compatibility issues here, but a personal preference, I would have either the cherry barb or the rasbora. And thinking of the colour of the rummys, the rasbora suggest themselves over the cherrys. Esp the true hengel rasbora (Trigonostigma hengeli) which around here is very rare; I have a shoal of these in my new 70g stream tank, and this is the first I have ever seen them in stores. And in a few stores, so they must be "in season." They are frequently confused with the very similar T. espei, so be careful; our profiles with photos makes the distinction clear.

I am also thinking that with all the possibilities in shoaling fish available with your water [more on that question momentarily], the rasbora firs, then the loaches and rummys, then later on you may come across something you really like that is very distinctive and a good match. It's always nice to have some "room" available.;-)

On the water, this sounds very good. With wood and low hardness, the pH should be below 7 within a couple months and maybe sooner; the condition of the wood will affect the rate this occurs, plus the fish and bacteria actions once they are in there, and water changes (minimal, say 30% weekly).

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok, I will get the rasbora tonight. Looking at the diferences I woul say they are hengels and not lambchops, but they were also very small so I will have to look again tonight. My only issue is there was not alot of them where I saw them and there may have only been 3-4 so I will just have to see tonight


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Ok, I will get the rasbora tonight. Looking at the diferences I woul say they are hengels and not lambchops, but they were also very small so I will have to look again tonight. My only issue is there was not alot of them where I saw them and there may have only been 3-4 so I will just have to see tonight


Three or four is better than none. I often rescue such fish. The hengeli is very distinctive, that flash of copper around a very small dark blotch can't be missed.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Now I gotta figure out what store had them lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

The more i look at the two (lambchop and hengel) i feel that the ones i saw were lambchops.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Another fishless night. The one store was half down cause of ich and the other did not have hengels. They are gonna order 4 for me. Hopefully they will be in next week. I was gonna get harlys but I donno. I have no luck.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Who has Ich? I want to try to find Cardinals this weekend. Did you happen to see any?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Petland does, they have a whole section closed off. Luckily the loaches are on the other side, cant wait to get them.

Pretty positive the hidden reef has a tank full of neons and a tank full of cardnials. They both looked really nice to me, but i didnt really check them out. 

I was thinking about cardnials too but I donno if they would work in my tank, at least at first. Maybe neons, I donno. Im ordering the hengels through the hidden reef, hopefully they get them next week. If not im just gonna get harlys


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Cool . Thank you. I love Cardinals. They add such beautiful color to the tank.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Do you think I could keep them? Or would I do better with neons? 

Gosh maybe I should get harlys. Jeezeee decisions decisons.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Neons would work in your water. If the pH lowers enough to be in the low 6's cardinals would be OK. But never cardinals in new tanks. Most cardinals ares till wild caught so they are finicky. Are rummynose intended? Sorry, too many threads, I forget. If yes, then cardinals and rummys do very well together; they are sympatric in their habitat so require same parameters.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

I just want to add I have a group of 10 Neon in my 55 gallon and they are stunning when swimming together.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Well hopefully my fish come in next week. Ill get what I planed on so far (yes i want rummynose) and then later decide on neons or something else. If I dont hear from the fish store next wensday then i will reconsider harlys. If I can get the 5 gallon going maybe I will get a beta this weekend

Since im not adding fish right now should I be doing something to keep ammonia levels up (a little) for the plants and bacteria?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Well hopefully my fish come in next week. Ill get what I planed on so far (yes i want rummynose) and then later decide on neons or something else. If I dont hear from the fish store next wensday then i will reconsider harlys. If I can get the 5 gallon going maybe I will get a beta this weekend
> 
> Since im not adding fish right now should I be doing something to keep ammonia levels up (a little) for the plants and bacteria?


I wouldn't. First, there will be fewer bacteria with plants, and the plants grab ammonia faster usually than bacteria once there is some. As for the plants, it is amazing how well they will manage in fishless tanks. I have elsewhere mentioned my 33g that for several months was only excess plants, no fish, and the plants remained green and while they did not grow as much as in the fish tanks, they did not die or even die back. I personally would not go adding ammonia other than via fish. Do fertilize though, with Seachem's _*Flourish Comprehensive Supplement for the Planted Aquarium*_. It does actually contain a trace amount of nitrogen--ammonia is one form of nitrogen, as is ammonium, nitrite and nitrate; plants prefer nitrogen as ammonium, but nitrogen is nitrogen.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Got a beta (yay) he seems to be doing fine exploring his tank. Ammonia is between 0-.25 and is planted so i hope he will be ok. Also found a single snail! Hope I dont get too many of them. I dont wanna kill them but i wont mind extra loach food down the road.

So none of the cats cared one bit about any of the tanks untill now. The one cat (who is suspected would be the troublemaker) has already been caught numerous times STANDING on top of the 5 gallon. He already ripped the tape off the spot I covered by the filter. I hope he learns Im not playing around when it comes to this. WIsh me luck.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I am pretty sure your Betta will eat snails as well so that shouldn't be an issue. Good Luck with your cat.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I think your right, I saw him attacking the snAil last night haha. 

I guess he is doing good because I woke to small bubble nests in every corner!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

So where's a picture of the new guy? ;-)


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

His bubble nest









He fights his reflection










Is his face ok?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

just noticed how bad my 29 gal is. My Ludwigia ovalis, crypts, and vals keep rotting. My red melon i turning yellow and black. However the pennywort, sprite and dwarf lily seem fine. I hope everything will be ok

dwarf lily









its just rotting, i was red when i got it









Wont even stay planted but if i touch it it falls apart


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

just tested water in the 29 gallon.

ph- 7.0-7.2
ammonia 0
nitrite .5
nitrate 5


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

sorry for the triple post, 5 gal water :
ph 7-7.2
ammonia 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 5

do i need a water change in the 29? I have been doing small ones every other day when i remove dead plant material. both tanks get 10 hrs light per day. dose with flourish monday and friday. 5 gal temp is 75, 29 gal is 79.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Again, I am not a plant expert by any stretch but I will tell you that when I first got mine, I had the exact same problem. The bulk of my plants were literally melting in my hands when I would touch them and the stem plants kept floating. I felt like I spend a bunch of money and I may as well have flushed it down the toilet. Time helped that issue a lot. Plants I thought were goners actually came back to life. Plants that were yellow, went back to green and they finally took off growing. It is possible you will lose a few of them but don't panic just yet. Give them time, keep dosing with fertilizer and light. I would still do some small water changes of maybe 25%. Basically, wait it out.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

I agree with Inga just be patient with the plants. And the water change is a good idea to.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

The nitrite at .5 in the 29g is a concern. Nitrite should always test zero once the tank is cycled. A partial water change for this is in order, if that reading is accurate (test again to make sure).


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Be patient with the plants and try not to mess with them too much until they have a chance to acclimate to your tank and root. I'd also raise the temp in your 5g a few degrees. Bettas do better between 78-82, IMO. I keep mine at 79-80.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok I hope the plants do ok. 

I did a 30% water change in the 29 and the nitrate levels didn't go down so should I do another one?? Tap water has 0. I double tested and shook the bottle well. Everything else is the same as above. The ph from the tap was slightly higher though.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Ok I hope the plants do ok.
> 
> I did a 30% water change in the 29 and the nitrate levels didn't go down so should I do another one?? Tap water has 0. I double tested and shook the bottle well. Everything else is the same as above. The ph from the tap was slightly higher though.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I would keep a close eye on the fish, if there is no sign of abnormal behaviour (rapid respiration, lethargy, near the surface, gasping at the surface) it may be a false alarm.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> sorry for the triple post, 5 gal water :
> ph 7-7.2
> ammonia 0
> nitrite 0
> nitrate 5.


Your latest reading gave a nirtIte of 0. Is this correct? A nitrAte of 5ppm is fine.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Jeeze those 2 words suck. Afrer the change my NitrItes were 0 but my nitrates were high (not 5 high but not 0). After sitting a dat everything was fine. And everything is fine in the 5 gallon. 

I just got 5 black neons. I know I know i shouldnt of got them first, and maybe 5 is too many, but my rasboras wont be in this week and I fell in love with the black neons. I hope everything goes ok. Ill post pics later. Thanks for your help

So my stock list will be:
7 black neons
7 hengel rasbora
9 rummy nose tetra
5 zebra loaches.

For the 5 gallon, i really like the julii corys (bryon I believe you said sometimes they are named wrong in stores, i can post a pic of the ones I saw if you could identify it) so 3 of them. Also could i get a gold inca snail?


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

With nitrAte, anything below 40ppm is safe. NitrIte should always be 0 in a planted tank.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Jeeze those 2 words suck. Afrer the change my NitrItes were 0 but my nitrates were high (not 5 high but not 0). After sitting a dat everything was fine. And everything is fine in the 5 gallon.
> 
> I just got 5 black neons. I know I know i shouldnt of got them first, and maybe 5 is too many, but my rasboras wont be in this week and I fell in love with the black neons. I hope everything goes ok. Ill post pics later. Thanks for your help
> 
> ...


As Lisa subsequently said, nitrate at 5 is OK. We have photos in our profiles, check the Corydoras julii first; the profile mentions the similar species, check their photos too. That should tell you. For your 29g the stocking is fine.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Cool every one thanks. Tetras are having fun swimming together. So what brand of food does everyone use. Right now I have wardly betta food( small floating pellets) and for the 29 I have wardly advanced nutrition flakes. Is this ok for one brand, and I can get a different brand and switch everyday?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Cool every one thanks. Tetras are having fun swimming together. So what brand of food does everyone use. Right now I have wardly betta food( small floating pellets) and for the 29 I have wardly advanced nutrition flakes. Is this ok for one brand, and I can get a different brand and switch everyday?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Variety is the spice of life, or so they say. I alternate between 4 different brands of flake and sinking foods (4 flake, 4 sinking) so the fish get something different 4 days running before it repeats. One of the 4 flake foods is always veggie based. Pellets are said to be better than flake; I so far haven't been able to get my characins to eat or even look at pellets. Then there are frozen foods like brine shrimp, bloodworms, daphnia.

For brands of flake/sinking I use Omega One, Tetra (interestingly, I notice the Tetra flake is the absolute favourite of all the fish), Nutrafin, OSI, Hakari, maybe one or two others.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

So i have to post this because I am not too well at identifying fish, but to me this looks more like a Three Line cory then a julii. The ones I are looking at are from Petco.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

That looks like a three line cory to me.


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## redchigh (Jan 20, 2010)

Indeed. 

I would leave out the barbs...

Whats your ph?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I agree, Corydoras trilineatus.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

3 of them would still be ok right?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> 3 of them would still be ok right?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, minimum 3, or 4-5 if space (like the 29g). This is a nice species.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Yea I still like them even through they are labeled wrong. And they look healthy. Ok
So 3 cause they are for the 5 gallon. Maybe 2 weeks untill I add them? As long as everything stays normal that is.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Yea I still like them even through they are labeled wrong. And they look healthy. Ok
> So 3 cause they are for the 5 gallon. Maybe 2 weeks untill I add them? As long as everything stays normal that is.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It may work, I personally would not put them in a 5g. This species attains just over 2 inches, and they do like to browse around a lot.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok guys here is my next issue (haha never easy is it). So im taking everyones advice and not touching my plants. So far the leaves that were yellow/black on my red melon have lost all of their black color and are turning green/getting harder (instead of that wet paper feel), my water sprite looks nice and green uptop but leaves are kind of brown near the bottom (too close to heater or filter intake?), Other plants are bouncing back, vals look a mess still.

Here is my question. I dont know how how to prune the different kinds of plants, is there a good guide anywhere? I dont know what i should remove and what should be left alone. For instance, i remove any of the vals that turned transparent and just sit on the bottom ( if i touch them they break to pieces) but any that are still standing straight and yellow i leave alone. So i need to know how to maintain everything if someone could point me in the right direction. 

Another question, i tested the water again today and everything was fine, except the nitrItes again. They were not as high as .5 but it they were there, I swapped out another 5-10 gallons and it did go down. Do i need to just stay on top of changes until the bacteria catches up or is there another issue? Does it relate to my dead plants. Im not having this issue in the 5 gallon. 0 ammonia, and nitrAtes between 0-5ppm. I also noticed white "fuz" on the heater suction cups (only the heater, not the filter), wiped it up and it went up the filter.

The fish seem fine, they swim around in a group, never see them gasping for air or anything bad like that. Sometimes when they are not swimming around like mad men they will hang out in a group near the wood and open and close their mouths randomly (you know, like the fishy face you make when your grandma squeezes your face haha) but when they swim around they dont do that, and everyone is eating fine. Im trying to get pics for everyone but its hard.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Did my last change Thursday and now my nitrites are 2! Any ideas?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Did my last change Thursday and now my nitrites are 2! Any ideas?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


With nitrite actually at 2ppm you would see dying fish. I'm sorry I cannot explain this, I've no idea what could cause nitrite to show up on a test in the situation you have outlined for us.

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok so i just got home from the LFS, got some freeze dried blood worms, and different flakes. I tested the water twice this morning with nitrites at 2 ppm. Just did it agin and they were at 2ppm. Ammonia 0, nitrates less then 5ppm.

SO i tested the tap, nitrites at 0ppm.Did a water change of about 1/3. Tested nitrites and they are just about 0. I got the aqeon quick change adapter but need longer tubes for my vac so i will clean debris off gravel tomorrow. 

Now i also tested the nitrites in the beta tank and they are also high, like.50. But all my fish are doing fine. My black neons school and play together and eat fine. My beta works on his bubble nest almost everynight and swims aound like crazy everytime you are near the tank. The only weid behavior (maybe its not weird) is sometimes the neons take a break and open and close their mouths. Not near the top of the tank. just randomly when they are done playing.

So dead plant material wont cause a nitrite spike? I actually think things are coming back. Im floating some pennywort and my dwarf lily is looking great. Also the snails are all starting to come out, i counted at least 10. would the nitrites hurt them also?

I donno if this has anything to do with it either but the more you shake the test tube with nitrite solution the purpler it gets. If you shake it for like a min and read it it may only look like .5 but if you keep shaking or let i sit its a 2ppm. No matter how much you shake the tap water it stayes at 0ppm. Im using the API master kit.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Ok so i just got home from the LFS, got some freeze dried blood worms, and different flakes. I tested the water twice this morning with nitrites at 2 ppm. Just did it agin and they were at 2ppm. Ammonia 0, nitrates less then 5ppm.
> 
> SO i tested the tap, nitrites at 0ppm.Did a water change of about 1/3. Tested nitrites and they are just about 0. I got the aqeon quick change adapter but need longer tubes for my vac so i will clean debris off gravel tomorrow.
> 
> ...


My API nitrite instructions say to shake the tube for 5 seconds, then let stand for 5 minutes. Unless your instructions are different (I have an old kit), don't shake it more.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Not sure what is causeing your water problems either but wanted to add that the freeze dried blood worms should only be given as a treat to your fish not as an everyday food because the freeze drying process removes almost all if not all of the nutrients from the worms.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I know, but thank you. Once I get my full stock I will buy frozen but for just the 6 fish the freeze dried will do. I have crisps and flakes that will alternate everyday and freeze dry will only be on Saturday or Sunday after water changes. It was hard but they only got 1 each( except fatty, who I'm assuming is a female since she is rounder then the others, or just fat cause she is the most aggressive with food, she got 2)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

When I think of fish in most homes never eating anything other then the same old flakes, I think my fish are lucky with their selection. So many people on here are the "ideal" fish owners. Most fish, are not that lucky.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Could it be that I did not rinse my tank out well enough after first cleaning it. All I used was white vinegar and non ionized salt. Or something the old owner used ?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

And now this, I just noticed it today. Donno if it is ICH or maybe something from the blood worms. There is only a couple white spots, most in the same spot as this pic, som on back fins. Also their fins look very bluish. 

SOrry this is the best pic i could get, notice the spot just below his top fin, also see how they are bluish. It does not look like i sprinkled salt on the fish, just a few random white spots


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Keep an eye on it, and the rest of the fish. I wouldn't consider any medications yet if it were me. I see this now and then, in fact this morning I noticed it in one tank on a fish. I expect it to go away.

Blue sheen to the fins is natural.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I just did a 50% water change 5hrs ago and nitrites are already up to 2ppm again. Something is wrong. Is it ok to water changes that big everyday? Do you think the prime is the only thing keping them alive? Im gonna try and get my friend to test my water with his kit. Should i seed with some of his gravel? Im getting very stressed about this but Dont know what to do.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> I just did a 50% water change 5hrs ago and nitrites are already up to 2ppm again. Something is wrong. Is it ok to water changes that big everyday? Do you think the prime is the only thing keping them alive? Im gonna try and get my friend to test my water with his kit. Should i seed with some of his gravel? Im getting very stressed about this but Dont know what to do.


A 50% water change every day with a good water conditioner will not harm the fish, and is the only real solution for ammonia/nitrite if either really is present at these levels. I still do not understand that.

I'd be careful about adding gravel from someone else's tank; you have no idea what pathogens may be in it. A bacteria supplement like Tetra's SafeStart or Seachem's Stability would be better.

Prime as the water conditioner will also help. Let us know what the other tests show.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Some good news, some meh news, and pics!

First off,most of my plants are seeing new growth, so I am very happy about that. I started floating some of the pennywort and really like it, is there any way to keep in in the center?? it eventually drifts off and gets caught in the water sprite.

Today was my second dose of stability. I have been removing about 60% of the water then adding prime and stability as directed. I tested yesterday before the first dose/water change and nitrites were 2ppm. When I tested today they were closer to 1ppm. Dont know if its just because I didnt give it enough time to build up between changes or if the stability is doing something, but I am wishing for the best. I have not been able to get my hands on another test kit, but since i am seeing a difference in results and my tap tests for 0ppm, I don't really think anything is wrong with mine.

Also the fish seemed more active today then before. Both times I checked on them (7 am and 12p,) they were schooling alot closer and swimming around very happily. Also there is alot more blue "tint" to thir fins which I guess is good, they look really pretty. SO thats my good news.

Now the meh news, those few white spots are still bothering me. I did not see any increase in spots , or see it on other fish, and there is nothing near their gills. Now my question is, IF it is ICK, what do i do. I see some people talking about a specific med (forget the name) and others just say to increase temps. If i use a med will it kill the spores that the stability is adding? If the stability does not work fully after 7 days is it safe to keep adding?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Oops forget pics!!

Most up to date front shot:









Snail hanging out on pennywort










New water sprite growth









Snail eggs or something different on Java Fern?









New Melon Growth









Betta Tank









Fighting himself 










Bubble nest


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Great pictures your tanks are lovely.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Nice aquascape in the photos. I see no plant issues, the yellowing leaves are normal, green new growth is emerging as it should.

Ah, the benefits of a water change. As I said, the fish will love it.

As for the spots, I would still do nothing if no more have appeared. Better let the fish fight this off rather than stressing them with more chemicals.

I have much the same in my 90g at present; added several new fish last week, and noticed some flashing over the past couple of days and even a few tiny spots on the false neons. Left it alone. Spots are gone, less flashing today. Adding this or that would have stressed out everyone in the tank, and probably for no useful reason.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I just wanted to add that I agree completely, Your tanks are beautiful! Everything is looking good. Hang in there and try not to stess. (says the most easily stressed person here, lol)


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks everyone it means alot. Im hoping my rasbora do not come in tomorrow now, hopefully they can hold them for a week if they do. 

Any ideas what those brown spots are on the java fern?? Or is that also normal.

I am very less stressed now and just hoping the stability works. I want my loaches lol. 

P.S. Dont get stability in your eye. It really sucks. Dont ask how i did it, I wear glasses to but it happened somehow. 

P.S.S Just wrote an email to my local walmart about their fish display. Hope they do something about it


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I hear you about the Walmart display. We are lucky that our Walmart doesn't carry fish anymore. Though it stinks that they no longer carry the inexpensive 30-40 gallon kits anymore either. I went to Petco the other day and was disgusted with how many dead fish I saw. The feeder fish tank had a few dozen dead ones on the bottom that all the other fish seemed to be eating at. I would say over 60% of their tanks had dead fish in them. Then people wonder why I won't buy fish from Petco. Yikes!


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Sadly it's a hit or miss. I'm less then a mile from a petco to the west of me and about 3 miles from one to the east on the same road. I would never get anything from the one closest to me but the one to the east is nice. That's where I get my tetras. If I do have ich I guess it did start at the petco though.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Yeah, I am sort of smack between two Petco's also. Neither are any good for fish but one is better then the other for plants. Petsmart here is the best of the 3 just very limited selection of fish.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

So I'm pretty sure it is ich. It lookes a little worse on one of the fish and hill gills are turning red. I noticed planaria ( I think) this morning, which I don't understand because I don't over feed them( they gobble up everything and I even give them a fast day). 

It's so hard to get a good pic but I'll try to get one before work
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I cant get a pic, they are just too fast!

My friend forgot hit nitrite kit so I couldnt test and compare, BUT i did my water change mid day yesterday and tested 3 times since (including just now) and my nitrites are at .25ppm!!!! So I guess stability is working (today will be day 4, doing my water change and dose in about 6 hours).

He also said the same thing Bryon said about the ICH. Its seems to be on only 2 of the fish, but they are all swimming fine, no scratching or abnormal behavior.In fact they are so much better since I took care of the nitrites. He suggested the same thing, to just wait it out, make sure it does not spread anymore and hopefully its stress related ( or a reaction to stability, prime or flourish mix + stress) and goes away on its own. And just make sure once the nitrites are gone and everything is stable, to wait untill all signs of the "ICH" are gone before adding fish.

Could the white spots have something to do with the planaria in my tank? Maybe hitching a ride or something?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Just did my water change and stability dose and I noticed one of the fish with the spots is missing some of his top fin. DOnno if this is because they are playing a lot more now, or if its the "ICH". SHould I get a medication just incase? I would wanna get it tonight, so what should I get?


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Is it just missing like a piece of its gone or is it fuzzy looking? I have never seen ick make a fish look like it has a piece of fin missing.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I did not find my camera since I moved, so this is all I have, you cannot tell but it looks missing, not fuzzy. And he has the most spots out of all of them.



















You can kinda see the missing chunk here


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Sorry guys I really hate to be a pain or inpatient but this is really going to be the only time until Monday I can get to a store to get meds/salt. So I could really use your opinions. I don’t mind buying meds and not using them right away but need to know whats best. I have been reading a lot about rid ich. If I decide to go salt do I need a container to leave it in the tank or do I just mix it in the whole tank. I really think its getting worse and I will need to take action this weekend if nothing clears.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

When I've had to use meds, I use either Aquari-Sol or CopperSafe; both deal with any parasite. But before that, raising the temp is said by many to be sufficient if the fish can tolerate high temps. Some say 85F, some close to 90F. For a week, nothing more.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Should I get salt. I much rather add salt an raise temps then medicate
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## redchigh (Jan 20, 2010)

It's a matter of preference. Salt can kill plants, many medications are perfectly safe...

Raise temperatures if you want, (but be warned, you have to go pretty high. 88-90F is best, be sure to raise it gradually- 1-2 degrees every 30 minutes- and leave it at 90 for a week, or at miminum, 2-3 days after the last white spot disappears.

If you wanedt to use salt, get get rock salt. It has no iodine.
Also, you can use iodized table salt, I've heard from lots of places that the level of iodine is harmless as long as you don't dose with more than 1-2 tsp per gallon.
I've done it with livebearers (for 3-4 days) with no ill affects. (found out I already had rock salt so switched to it, would have kept using the table salt otherwise.)


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Should I get salt. I much rather add salt an raise temps then medicate
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No. You have characins (Black Neons in the photo), they are very sensitive to salt. I would never dose a tank with characins, catfish, loaches--indeed any soft water fish--with salt at a strength sufficient to do any good.

It is quite true that these fish will be severely stressed by any treatment involving medications, no argument there. But the effect of copper-based meds (as the two I've mentioned are) is in my view less serious than salt which destroys the kidneys and burns the gills.


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## redchigh (Jan 20, 2010)

Byron said:


> No. You have characins (Black Neons in the photo), they are very sensitive to salt. I would never dose a tank with characins, catfish, loaches--indeed any soft water fish--with salt at a strength sufficient to do any good.
> 
> It is quite true that these fish will be severely stressed by any treatment involving medications, no argument there. But the effect of copper-based meds (as the two I've mentioned are) is in my view less serious than salt which destroys the kidneys and burns the gills.


As long as you don't plan on adding shrimp or snails, copper is a great treatment.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok I will get Meds. Only have time to go to petco now but I really feel like I need to do something about this. Should I treat half dose. And I could always add carbon later to remove the meds to make the tank invert safe right?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Ok I will get Meds. Only have time to go to petco now but I really feel like I need to do something about this. Should I treat half dose. And I could always add carbon later to remove the meds to make the tank invert safe right?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Follow the instructions on the particular product you buy. The two I mentioned are used full strength. But you have to observe the fish, and obviously never overdose--and take into account the displacement of some water by substrate, etc. If any med is used and fish show signs of difficulty--check respiration, abnormal behaviour (dashing madly around or the opposite, lethargy) and remaining close to the surface or gasping at the surface--do a partial water change.

Carbon should be removed during the treatment period. Adding fresh carbon afterwards will help to remove the medication, along with a partial water change. I always do a 50% water change at the end of the period of treatment no matter what.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

THANK YOU EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!

Cant say it enough. My nitrites are at 0!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AAANNNNNDD Almost every single spot is gone! I did not medicate or raise temps!!!!!!!!!! You guys rock!!!

Now if it was ich could this mean that the parisites just feel off to enter their second stage? Or is it safe to say there is no ich at all. Im still gonna wait at least 2 weeks before I add fish. I would like to get my other 2 tetras and rasboras around the end of this month as long as all is well


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> THANK YOU EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Cant say it enough. My nitrites are at 0!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AAANNNNNDD Almost every single spot is gone! I did not medicate or raise temps!!!!!!!!!! You guys rock!!!
> 
> Now if it was ich could this mean that the parisites just feel off to enter their second stage? Or is it safe to say there is no ich at all. Im still gonna wait at least 2 weeks before I add fish. I would like to get my other 2 tetras and rasboras around the end of this month as long as all is well


I would wait at least a week, preferably two weeks, before introducing new fish.

Ich goes through the cycle as explained in that sticky...prob in the disease section. So the "spots" on the fish are somewhere in the aquarium and will release the next stage that will look for a host fish. However, how this "no treatment" works is that the fish build up a sort of immunity if they are healthy and the aquarium conditions are good. They do this by increasing their slime coat and the parasites cannot penetrate. They attack the gills, so you may see a fish flash now and then, though in my experience this too ends after a week or so. During this period, I would not subject the fish to any stress--like adding new fish which would themselves be under stress and thus more likely to contract the ich.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Again today nitrites 0!! So one questions. SHould I still do daily water changes to suck up any ich? Or is that not needed sice I probly wont be able to get them all anyway


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I know I shouldnt add any more fish but do you guys think I could add 2 more black neons by Friday if all else seems ok this week? Reason is that I have 1 tetra that is being really bossy and I think he(or she, she is rounder) is stressing the others, and may have caused the missing chucnk of fin on the other tetra.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Hey guys. Just wanted to update. All is good despite high water temps (90f) since my complex turned off the ac and it got really hot ( weird for this time of year). I got the other 2 tetras to make 7. However my friend ( who has a single parrot fish since it is aggressive. Had it for years) was cleaning out his 55 when he found a black neon tetra! He does not even remember the last time he got fish. It had to have been like 5 years. So he isolated it for a week and it seemed fine so now I have 8. 

I'm gonna call another store tomorrow to see if they can order the rasbora. If not then I may get the zebra loaches on wednesday. I'm so excited it's finally going well. 

The beta is also fine. I have not found any corys for him yet. 

I'll post pics tomorrow. Btw is a stingray pleco a hillstream loach or actually a pleco?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

> Btw is a stingray pleco a Hillstream Loach or actually a pleco?


Almost certainly it is a hillstream loach. Click on the shaded name to see the profile, this fish requires special consideration and is not an "ordinary" community fish due to the cooler temp and flowing water. I would not mix these with what you have/intend to have.

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

So now my betta can't eat his pellets. He used to gobble them up. Now he can't get them in his mouth. He eats flakes fine. Any ideas??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Could be that he has decided he just like the flakes better. Mine will not eat the pellets they just spit them out. LOL They ate them at first but then they became picky. I give them a varity of frozen foods and flakes.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Oh man, i remember those days when the complex turns off the air waaaay too early. They do the same with the heat, just to forewarn you. 

glad to hear things are going well for you. I did see home Rasbora at PetSmart not too long ago. you can check there, too. I haven't seen them anywhere else either.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks for the hint Lisa. Sadly I will not be shopping at petland. I just went to take advantage of the buy one get one for my zebra loaches. I met the Fish guy and wow what a ************************. I understand that he wants to provide good homes to the fish and he wants to answer everyone’s questions. (I wish everyone was like that) be he was soooooo rude.

This was basically our convo:
He "how long has your tank set up" (mind you this was while I was just looking at the fish, did not ask for anything)

Me "a month, I have 8 black neon tetras already"

"Ok lemme ask you this, do you know about the nitrogen cycle? Because it seems like you don’t. It takes 6-8 weeks to cycle a tank. From my knowledge your tank is not ready for fish, and they may not live. I’d like to see a water sample"

"Ok well I used stability, and that can help cycle a within a week and a half. I own a test kit and know how it works. 

“Did you ever hear of the nitrogen cycle?"

“Yes, you just asked that and I told you. Plus I have plants that changes things too. “

“ Oh yes that changes things completely you did not let me get to that question yet.”

“that’s because your rude and cut me off.”

“Well what are your parameters and Ill explain what’s wrong”

“My pH is around 7. My Nit………”

“Let me stop you there. I don’t care too much about ph. Does this surprise you?? (Smiles)”

“No its does not surprise me but the fact that your treating me like I have no idea what I’m doing has made me not want to buy fish here. I understand you know your stuff and you want to help people not to make bad decisions, but you are very rude”

“That’s fine; I would want to see a water sample anyway before I sold you fish. I have been keeping fish for 40 years and I care about fish more then I care about most people so I don’t want just anyone buying them”

So as I was waiting for the manager he came up to me and started explaining how he knew everything and he just wanted to make sure I knew what I was doing. He asked if we could start over and I said yes but he basically repeated the whole thing and said he would have a hard time selling me fish without a sample. I had to leave before I freaked out on him.

SO MAD. Plus this is the only place that stocks Zebra loaches. Im going to have to wait 2 more weeks to get them somewhere else. I know these ones are healthy and they are buy one get one free. I think I may go back tonight and buy them when he is not working, then never go back there again. Which is ashame since I think he keeps nice tanks.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

WHAT?? That is so strange. What did the guy look like? I've never experienced that there. Actually, every time I've gone in, they've known nothing, asked nothing, and just fished out what I wanted. I'm fine with that because I go in knowing exactly what I want and don't need to ask for suggestions. I am truly shocked at your experience, especially there!! Very rude.

As for Zebra Loaches, I got mine at Captain Nemo's in East Norriton. I've never seen them at Petland, only Clown's. You can always call there to see if they have any in stock, but they won't be buy 1 get 1.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Nemos does not have any and they said it would take a week or so. Petland has clown, yoyo and zebras. In fact a girl said I should get one clown loach and I told her that wont work. Im going back. For no reason I should be denied what I want to buy. Especially if its just baised on his biases that I look like a young kid in ripped jeans and a rock tshirt and have no idea what a fish is. Hopefully the manager is there.

In fact, this is the guy I wrote about in an older post (maybe my first thread) after I said that the tanks look great. He is an old guy, short, gray hair. Marty or Maury. Actually they closed half their fish section cause they were not selling as much. I guess its his attitude. Im going to get them tonight. Hopefully no one gives me an issue. I hope he notices the loaches are gone that way he can spend more time manageing his employees and not his customers.

P.S. about the apartment, I went 4 months with no heat at my old place. My fish will be better off then me lol.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Agreed. Get what you want. I was thinking of stopping there after work actually. I wanted to get 6 or so Cardinal Tetras if they had any and maybe some albino cories. I know exactly who Marty is. He always asks me about my tanks too, but not with the same rudeness he presented to you.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Just makes me so mad. If he does not like people he should not be in retail. I'm going there at 7. I could tell you what they have in stock but I did not get to browse much.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Wow what a jerk! I understand wanting to help people make the right choices but sounds to me like he was just trying to be a rude know it all. I would have waited on the manager and told him about the treatment right in front of the rude employee but that is just me.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I would have but I was so angry that I didn't want to handle it the right way. It's a shame but they won't do anything. I spoke with a manager and two employees before and they speak very highly of him. He does know his stuff. And it would have been fine if he proved me wrong or taught me a thing or two but he should have acted a little nicer. 

That's why I'm speaking to a manager tonight. And I already called coperate. I don't wanna get this guy fired but someone needs to tell him he has to learn how to speak to people.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok guys so I went back and met the owner. He was very nice and apologized for what happened. He is gonna talk to the guy.

The owner was very helpful. He went over my tank, not drilled me on it. And he said that there would be no problem adding the loaches. His only suggestion was to add 3 right now instead of 5, since they are expensive and if anything major was to happen at least I would save a few bucks. I aggreed with him and now I have 3 Zebra Loaches!

I am so happy guys, they are floating right now and they are gonna be crazy. They keep jumping out of the water (to bad they dont know they are in a bag).I know i keep saying I will post pics but never do, I will be sure to do that once they settle!!!


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

oh and i got a question. My neons just sit all the way up top and swim aggainst the current (its not much). Im thinking they are waiting for food since thats usualy how they feed, but this seems to happen very often. Am i not feeding enough? Is something else wrong? Or could it be that they are the only top level fish so they just do what they want since no one else is gonna run into them?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Sorry for the triple post but I had to share. I was trying to spot the loaches and I saw two wedges between the wood but cannot find the other. So I'm lm looking around and I notice in the corner of my eye something moving near the filter output. Sure enough he is inside it, trying to swim up! Looks like it's the spray bar for me! 

Oh and please tell me someone did this before....... I kinda dropped one on the floor  I could not get two of them out of the bad with the net. And I'm pretty sure they used a spike on the bag because there was a pinhole leak into my tank. Basically I had to pour the bag into the net over a bucket and the one went carazy and jumped out! I was so scared. My cats were just staring at it. I grabbed him( I think he tried to spike me) and plopped him in the tank. They all seem fine. I feel so bad, and stupid.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I had a Guppy jump out onto the floor and he too was picked up and scooped back into the tank. He is still fine, swimming around like there was never an issue. He did sit in one place for about a 1/2 hour though, I suspect stress.

As far as the bad service you got at Petland originally I understand. Good Service or bad means everything. I bought a Aqueon Live Plant Aquarium deluxe kit. I got the kit home started setting it up. Noticed some spots on the bottom of the tank, cleaned those out, added my substrate, some water, plants, wood etc... Set up the filter so on so on. Then I noticed the light was missing the brackets, the thermometer was missing. Next day (not even 24 hours later) I see drops of water IN the heater. I contact Aqueon and they say "sorry, I will send out those items right away and throw in some plant fertilizer for your trouble" I am content with that. However, it took quite some time to finally get anything from them (after another e-mail) then the package only has the heater and the thermometer. No brackets and certainly no plant fertilizer. I e-mail the same person again, she doesn't remember our conversation (of course not it was weeks ago) 

Now, the opposite experience was from Dr. Foster's and Smith. I had a package delivered that had moisture in it and Fed Ex had delayed delivery. Dr. Foster's and Smith replaced EVERYTHING that was wet in the package. HUGE apology and the package was there within 2 days. Which place do you think I will be giving my business to? Which one will I send my fish loving friends to? Which one will I NEVER purchase anything from again? Customer service is everything. When a business is selling something product is important but how they back that up is equally so. 

I believe that goes for fish too. I won't buy fish from rude people either. There are other options out there and I will take those. Glad you got your fish in the end and it is going well. Now for those pictures.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

I'm another one that it's happened too. One story not so bad, another one a horror story. I have a fish that is a complete pig and one day ate too much food. Her swim bladder was so bloated she was just floating up top. I removed her from the tank and put her in a 5 gallon bucket with some epsom salt (for constipation). I put the bucket on my bar high table so the cats wouldn't get tempted. I went upstairs to grab something and when I came back down, I heard "PLOP". She had jumped out and landed on the floor. Probably a 5 foot jump from the height of the table and bucket. I put her back in the tank and she's still swimming around fat and happy.

My horror story took place while transitioning from some ceramic pieces to driftwood in my 120g tank. I removed this rock cave I had, checked inside for any fish, and put it on a towel on the floor. I took about 20-30 minutes to position my five pieces of driftwood the way I wanted it. I stepped off my step-stool (tank is 22 inches deep and I am a 5'2" person ;-) ) and looked back to make sure I wasn't going to trip over anything on the floor. Just then I saw my Albino Bristlenose Pleco laying on the carpet!!! I PANICKED!! I picked him right up with my hands and tossed him in the tank. He was still alive, breathing extremely heavy, and I felt HORRIBLE! He must have been wedged way high up in the rock cave and jumped out of it at some point. Thank god he did or else I would have NEVER seen him. He sat in the same spot for quite a while breathing heavily. His white skin now had patches of bright red, and his gills were inflamed. I did not sleep at all that night. I felt like a horrible fish mom. However, I'm happy to report, miracously he is still alive and happier than ever. The reddness slowly went away and he has since grown a good inch 

Glad to hear you got your Zebra Loaches. You won't be disappointed. They are fun! I have 8 Zebras and 8 Burmese loaches in my 120g ;-)


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

LisaC144 said:


> I'm another one that it's happened too. One story not so bad, another one a horror story. I have a fish that is a complete pig and one day ate too much food. Her swim bladder was so bloated she was just floating up top. I removed her from the tank and put her in a 5 gallon bucket with some epsom salt (for constipation). I put the bucket on my bar high table so the cats wouldn't get tempted. I went upstairs to grab something and when I came back down, I heard "PLOP". She had jumped out and landed on the floor. Probably a 5 foot jump from the height of the table and bucket. I put her back in the tank and she's still swimming around fat and happy.
> 
> ;-)


The 5 foot drop is probably all it took to make her toot and feel better. lol Glad to hear she is alright.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ahaha thanks guys. I feel better after reading your stories. Everyone seems to be doing well. I wish I could watch them eat but for the most part they wait untill i go to bed. I have the same shrimp pellets and algea waffers they used at the store. The pellets (or mush after they sit in the tank for a while) are gone every morning, but they dont seem to like the waffers.

The first night I was trying to find them and i notice something up top. One was swimming into the output of the filter. The current was strong enough to keep him out but i couldnt do anything to make him leave. Finally I shook the output enought that he threw his gears into reverse and backed out sooooo fast. Looks like I gotta use the spray bar now.

These guys are great to watch. They all try to shove into the same driftwood cave at once, realize that they are not all gonna fit, back up together, they try again. Every day it seems like they venture out more while I'm around, im hoping the other two (bringing total to 5) will make them more active.

Still trying to pick out corys for the 5 gal. I really dont like albino anythings, and everything else I see (green, three line, pepper) are the bigger breeds. 

On pleco, would a regular brittle nose be too big at 5inches. Like I said above Im not a big albino fan, allthough I really want a brittle nose and If I need albino then thats what I will get. Lisa, where did you get yours at?


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Oh and I am really trying to get pics soon. My phone is just not cutting it any more but I still cannot find my digital camera. So just sit tight they are coming!!


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

I found my albino BN Pleco at AllQuatics. The place in NJ you didn't like. Fish Factory in Bristol can probably order you one if you request it. The owners wife is who I would speak to for fish requests.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Wooohoo! We found a place near the deptford mall called aquarium center. They have really really nice stuff. I found regular brittle noses there and they actually have the hengels rasbora in stock. They even have a display tank with older ones and they look much nicer then the harlequins. I'm so happy. Unfortunately I'm going to the mall so I don't wanna leave the fish in the car for 3 hours so I'm gonna go
Back soon.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Cool glad you found a good place to get your fish.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Actually kinda upset me that I got my zebra loaches. They have like 15 different loach tanks. It's crazy. I think they had queen loaches. They were nice
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Awesome!! How far is that?
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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

It's like 15mins over the Ben Franklin bridge. It really only took 45 mins to get there
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Do you guys think it will be too much to add all 7 hengals rasbora at once. I know it's alot of fish but they are really small. 

Also, would the betta and the bn pleco be ok together. I'm having some algae issues in the 5 gal. I cut how long the lights are on for and lowered fert dosage but it keeps growing. I was thinking I could put him in the 5 gal for a month or so and he can go to town on it, then I'll move him over to the 29gal. There is driftwood in that tank, and I figure I may have to do extra Cleanings since he will make extra waste 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

I wouldn't put a BN Pleco in s 5g. Algae, especially brush algae, is normal in new setups. I had it for a few months in my 5g then it slowly went away. If you like algae eaters in general and want get get one, I would suggest an Oto for a 5g.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I'm not too concerned. I just clean it while I change the water. I just figured it may work to do that rather then just add the rasbora and pleco and the same time. I'll just get the rasbora and add the pleco after the rasbora and after the next 2 zebra loaches.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I have to find corys for the 5gal still 
_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

The only cory for a 5g is pgymy cory since they are shoaling fish. The only place I've seen them is Captain Nemo's. I thought about getting them for my 5g but my plants grew so much u probably wouldn't be able to see them anyway. I just have a heavily planted 5g with a betta 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

How many for the 5 gallon. 5?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

I would say 5 would be safe.
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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I can't take it anymore. I came home from working 12 hours to do my water changes( I missed yesterday) and what happenes, my 5 gal filter broke. Ugh. Nothing is open. I hope my beta is ok for the night. I won't be able to get him anything untill tomorrow. Glad I didn't get the corys. Guess I gotta push back my trip to the lfs in nj for my rasbora and pgymys. 


Btw my loaches love messing up my water sprite. Little buggers
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Your betta will be perfectly fine without the filter in a planted tank. If you bought it separately, maybe you can return it? I just bought one on Drs. Foster and Smith for my 5g for $7


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I highly recommend simple sponge filters in small tanks. I have a plain sponge in my 10g, 20g and 33g and they work fine. In a planted tank this is more than adequate. A small air pump will run several of these. While air pumps may give out (never yet had one that did mind you) it is less likely, and sponge filters will frankly never wear out or break.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Hey guys. Its been a while so here are some updates.

First off I got a HOB filter to for the 5 gallon but its too powerful. I'll look into the sponges but Im not sure I have seen them. Do you make them with an air pump or do they sell an actual "sponge filter" Heh that may be a dumb question.

Anyway I love the loaches. They are so great to watch. Cant wait till I get the other 2, but Im waiting cause I really wanna add the rasbora, just dont have time to get to the LFS. They close at 8 which really sucks. The loaches keep destroying my water sprite. They love uprooting it. 

There have been a few plants that did not work for me so I got rid of them. Honesltly I hate the java fern. It is still not rooted to the wood. And I dont like the way it reproduces. Especially in the 5 gallon, the roots hanging on the leaves look stupid IMO.

My dwarf lily however, Is AMAZING. The leaves are soooo nice. And it is GIANT!. I moved it to the center and I think it is hogging all he resources from my Melon Sword. In fact, Im thinking of removing the sword and making the dwarf lily my center piece. That is, if that will work. I have too look it up since I dont know too much about it. So if anyone can comment on that idea then please do. Also, how do you prune it? One leave has already hit the surface and I can tell it is still growing.

AHHH I love the loaches so much!!!!

I promise pics today or tomorrow allthough they are not great. Im trying to get my friend with a nice camera to come over. 

Oh and I can add all7 hengels rasbora at once right???? They are small like i said so I didnt think 7 would be a big deal.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Sponge filters need an air pump; I have one that is self-contained, made by Eheim, but others said they no longer make this model. My other sponges use an airline from a small pump.

All 7 rasbora will be fine added together.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

I dont get how they work lol. But I can just get this and an airpump? What "size" pump?

Lees Sponge Filter Triangle - Aquarium Center, Inc.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> I dont get how they work lol. But I can just get this and an airpump? What "size" pump?
> 
> Lees Sponge Filter Triangle - Aquarium Center, Inc.


I haven't seen that particular type here, but yes, that is the sort of filter we call "sponge". The airline from the pump connects to the small tube and the air flow through the mechanism and up as bubbles in the larger tube draws the water in and through the "sponge" or foam, whichever. A very small pump will suffice. But think ahead--if more than one tank may be outfitted with sponge filters, a larger pump would be a better investment.

And on pumps, always buy a valve with one more outlet than you have tanks. For example, if you use this on only one tank, buy a valve with two outlets (in addition to the inlet from the pump obviously). Reason is, that an air pump will always last longer if it runs at full capacity. But that may be too much air for this filter in a small tank. So a two-valve allows you to have a "bleeder" so you can reduce the air through the tank filter and have the rest bleed out to keep the pump operating at full blast. A short couple inches of tubing with an airstone on the bleeder valve works fine--this is not placed in a tank but just left dangling beside the pump and valve. Obviously if you intend sponge filters in two or more tanks, you will have a valve unit with sufficient outlets for those and unless the air pump is enormous, it will likely put out full flow with 2 or 3 tanks. Hope I've explained this.

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Ok I think I get ya now. It doesn't make Bubbles in the tank does it? Cause I don't like that lol. I think I may wait to see if I can get the original Hob fixed and just use that and I'll keep the new one for the future. Thanks for typing that all out. 

Oh and we did agree that the 5 pygmy cories are ok in the 5 gallon with the betta right? And could I also get an apple or inca snail? And that would be it for the tank. Is there any issue adding the 5 pgymys at once, and possibly even with the snail at the same time?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> Ok I think I get ya now. It doesn't make Bubbles in the tank does it? Cause I don't like that lol. I think I may wait to see if I can get the original Hob fixed and just use that and I'll keep the new one for the future. Thanks for typing that all out.
> 
> Oh and we did agree that the 5 pygmy cories are ok in the 5 gallon with the betta right? And could I also get an apple or inca snail? And that would be it for the tank. Is there any issue adding the 5 pgymys at once, and possibly even with the snail at the same time?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The "bubbles" from a sponge filter are minimal, just up the tube which should be at or just below the surface, or just above the surface depending upon how much surface movement you want. I have never found sponge filters a problem in planted tanks, and a slight surface movement prevents the protein scum from forming.

I would go for 6 pygmy corys, the more the better for them, and only add them to an established tank. In a fairly new tank they frequent die within a couple weeks. I can't recall betta owners mentioning issues with corys, so I assume this is safe, but perhaps some of the experienced betta folks can comment. Corydoras pygmaeus does spend more time mid-water than on the substrate, unlike almost all other cory species; they love to shoal around with characins (tetras), etc.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

My issue is that some people say pygmys are the only corys for the 5, but some say i can do some others, but only like three of them. I have not found any other I like that are small enough. Like we said earlier the three lines may not have enough room to swim. And im not an albino fan lol. If you know of any species that will work let me know, if not I think pygmys are my best choice ( after seeing them in person they are so cutteee lol)

Do you consider my tank of a month and a half as established? No spikes or issues in the 5 gal since it started. 50% water change every week. I want the corys asap for obvious reasons. In fact I will be at the LFS in about an hour lol, but I will wait if I have too. Unfortunatlly I only like two LFS and they are both 45 mins away in different directions lol.

For betta compatibality I read it just matters on your bettas personality. Some may not mind upper level swimmers and some may, so I guess the only way is to find out is to try :/. Is this a reason to only get 3 now, or will that make the situation more stressful for the corys?

My other issue is I really want a BN pleco. Im not gonna get him yet (this is for the 30gal), because Im getting the rasbora tonight and then I wanna add the other 2 loaches, but I dont have natural algae in my tank. Is wafers, and blanched something enough for the BN or does he need natural algae. I also dont want him to tear up my dwarf lilly.

BTW Bryon do you know how to take care of Dwarf lilly. I have not found much info on it but like I said the leaves are now floating and the stems are continuing to grow.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bigehugedome said:


> My issue is that some people say pygmys are the only corys for the 5, but some say i can do some others, but only like three of them. I have not found any other I like that are small enough. Like we said earlier the three lines may not have enough room to swim. And im not an albino fan lol. If you know of any species that will work let me know, if not I think pygmys are my best choice ( after seeing them in person they are so cutteee lol)
> 
> Do you consider my tank of a month and a half as established? No spikes or issues in the 5 gal since it started. 50% water change every week. I want the corys asap for obvious reasons. In fact I will be at the LFS in about an hour lol, but I will wait if I have too. Unfortunatlly I only like two LFS and they are both 45 mins away in different directions lol.
> 
> ...


I would not myself try corys other than one of the dwarf species in anything under a 10g. I have 7 pygmys in my 10g and they are ideal. I cannot picture 3 of my other species in there. That from a purely personal perspective. In the Cory profiles it recommends 15/20g minimum for all non-dwarf species, i.e., a 24-inch tank. There are a couple of "dwarf" species aside from the 3 in the profiles, but they are very rarely seen in the hobby.

Once the tank is cycled, then 5-6 weeks should allow it to be "established." Plants help to quicken this. I would get all the corys at once, they will settle much faster which mean less chance of initial losses.

I would wait until algae is present for the BN. Some pleco are omnivorous, but BN is vegetarian and without algae (edible types) it may not eat or it may munch on the plants and once that starts it may be impossible to deter it.

I will try to add a profile on the lily this week. Is it a Nuphar japonica, or a Nymphaea species (Red or Green Tiger lotus type)?

Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Nymphaea Stellata Bulbs

Everything I see says its slowgrowing, However it is the only thing growing and is quickly taking over my tank. HELP lol

BTW, they only had 1 pygmy so I am waiting on that, also someone bought the Hengels rasbora before I got there (my luck i know) so I only got five. However they have made my tank sooooo amazing, they school with the tetra and both species take turns chasing each other around. I was late to work today because I ended up sitting in front of the tank for 10 mins. I should be getting the extra 2 next week to make 8 black neon tetra and 7 hengels rasbora. Then all I need it the 2 zebra loaches and hopefully my pH will be ok to do rummynose, but it has stayed around 7.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

I think we need updated pictures. LOL


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Gaaah i know but it's so hard to get good pics with a old camara or an iPhone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

LOL thats ok we can wait.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Here are two pics to hold you over untill I find a better ways to get good ones.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Oh I love it and I love the loach peeping out. LOL I really like the Lilly plant I have some of those bulbs your grow your self that are suspose to be those but it has not grown out yet I think I may move it into a tank that gets more light to see if that helps.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

That's looking good, I like your aquascape. Nice work. Byron.


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## bigehugedome (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks guys. Here is my next issue. It seems like my betta is suffering from fin rot. I did not notice anything until today and some parts are clear but others raw blackish and the fins look shorter. I read all the posts on the forum but I got a gold inca snail almost 2 weeks ago and I don't wanna use any meeds that will hurt him. What should I do. 

And what could have caused this? I change the water once a week and dose with prime and flourish. The tests show nothing wrong. Light is on 8 hrs a day. I have an algae problem and that's why I got the snail. Could a filter with too much flow cause it? Cause the new one I got when my first one broke cannot be turned down. It was just going to be a temp until I got money for a sponge or got the first one fixed.

Thanks guys.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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