# Top Fin Colored Gravel



## Seamoe

I found this old thread on the forum. I was searching for accounts similar to mine with PetSmart's Top Fin Aquarium gravel.

I bought a bag of blue gravel and a bag of red gravel and mixed them to put in my new aquarium. I was told to wash them for "dust". I did indeed wash them, but dust wasn't the problem. The blue dye from the blue gravel washes off and colors the water, no matter how many times I swirl it around. My hands are bruised from the tiny abrasions I get swirling the gravel with my bare hands (now I'm using a spoon to do it!).

Thinking I was done the first time, I spread the gravel onto the floor of my tank, only to find the water becoming a cloudy blue. I left it two days and when I got around to changing the water and gravel, all the water on the bottom was clearly a dyed blue.

I'm not sure about the red gravel. I see no red coloring. Whether that is because it does not wash off, or because the blue dye overwhelms the red, I do not know.

Needless to say, I am rather disappointed, and I find it rather peculiar and frustrating that gravel sold and intended for a fresh water tank would color the water like this. The gravel isn't cheap, but it sure seems cheap. Now, what do I do? Should I boil the gravel? Will this get rid of the excess dye, remove it completely, or what? Or is there another brand out there that won't color the water?

I had hoped I could be looking forward to putting my first fish in the tank by now, but this issue has surely made me blue (pardon the pun).


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## 1077

seamoe,
Boiling it would probably be the most effective but it is hard to say how much Blue or Red would remain.


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## Flashygrrl

Personally I'd put all of it in a bag, bring it back to the store and show them how the stuff comes off in the water. From what I've heard, yours probably will not be the first complaint they've had.


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## Seamoe

Flashygrrl said:


> Personally I'd put all of it in a bag, bring it back to the store and show them how the stuff comes off in the water. From what I've heard, yours probably will not be the first complaint they've had.


I might just do that tomorrow.

Would you guys have any suggestions on other brands or types of gravel? After this experience, I would really prefer to avoid painted gravel if possible.

I have wasted so much water on that horrible gravel that I'd rather not do it again if only for environmental reasons!

Also, would it be advisable to fill the tank and treat the water before I put in the gravel? I'd just like to recover some time here...


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## 1077

I would look for some fine pea gravel that was not coated with epoxy or anything else for that matter. sometimes garden shops or nurserys carrry it. There are also places online to order it as well. Many fish appreciate dark substrates as opposed to light colors . If i might ,I would respectfuly suggest that one of the most valuable traits needed in caring for fish is patience.


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## iamntbatman

I've recently discovered that a lot of aquarium products and fish stores in general are a huge ripoff. While I can't say that's true of some products (for example specialty substrates for planted tanks), for some of the more basic products it's certainly true.

Fish stores sell pea pebble gravel for $3-5 for a 5 lb bag and usually about $15 for a 20 lb bag. You can buy a 50 lb bag of the same pea gravel at Home Depot for less than $5. All it needs is a good rinse, just as any aquarium substrate would need. My LFS also sells larger rocks for aquarium use. They had a beautiful red shale that was running about $4 a pound. I went to a local store that sold bulk stone for landscaping work, and found the same red shale at $0.14 a lb. I've built a massive stone cave system in my 29g tank that cost me maybe $4.


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## Seamoe

1077 said:


> f i might ,I would respectfuly suggest that one of the most valuable traits needed in caring for fish is patience.


I hear you. But I'd like to actually be able to set up the tank so I can be patient already! 



iamntbatman said:


> I've recently discovered that a lot of aquarium products and fish stores in general are a huge ripoff. While I can't say that's true of some products (for example specialty substrates for planted tanks), for some of the more basic products it's certainly true.


From what I've seen, I agree. I'm just unsure of what I can get and what I shouldn't. I guess I'll go looking and run it by you guys before I put use it in the tank.

Thanks for the feedback, guys.

Now I'm starting to wonder if I should worry about decorations dyeing the water. I find them very expensive, but I see that's no indication of their quality.


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## iamntbatman

After my first tank, I get out of the whole "decoration" business. Some of the silk plants look decent and if you aren't ready for live plants yet they can be a good option. They're also great for tanks where plants wouldn't normally work (such as with silver dollars, many African cichlids, and the American cichlids that uproot your plants). I've found that you can decorate a tank for much less money and end up with a better looking environment for your fish if you stick to natural looking decor, such as driftwood and rockwork. 

Just my opinion, though. There's certainly a market for more traditional decor like the resin castles and treasure chests but it's just not my thing.


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## stephenmontero

well in the topfins stuff defensive i have white gravel from them that is fine and works great


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## Seamoe

iamntbatman said:


> I've found that you can decorate a tank for much less money and end up with a better looking environment for your fish if you stick to natural looking decor, such as driftwood and rockwork.


I do plan to put live plants in the tank. And, I've thought of putting an old plant pot in there with maybe some natural rocks, though from what I've read on these forums, it seems that putting random rocks in a tank is not recommended. Not sure what else I can use to decorate the tank.

Anyway, I marched on to PetSmart and I'm glad to report that they gave me a full refund after I handed the gravel back in two ziplock bags, and they didn't give make it difficult for me. I was pleasantly surprised. This means I'll probably be going back for some fish supplies there later.

However, now it's on to find some decent, not too expensive, unpainted gravel elsewhere...


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## 1077

Planted tanks depending on what type of plants , do much better with substrates designed for that purpose. That is not to say that with proper lighting, and fertilizer that plants can't be grown in aquariums without this specialty substrate. co2 also plays large part in what types of plants can be grown. As for rocks Slate, quartz, flagstone, and some smooth river rocks that have been cleaned well are popular with many. I would avoid most pourous rock. One method used for testing whether rock is safe for your tank is with vinegar. Pour some over the rock, if it start's to fizz or bubble I'ts probably not wanted. Some rock can alter your ph values as well and is best suited for tanks with fish that are more comfortable with higher ph. Hope some of this helps.


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## GeegaFish

I feel for you. I've had similar issues with colored gravel. The brand I had trouble with before was Estes. The dye did not visibly color the water in my case, but the stones killed my fish! I spent months trying to adjust the parameters in my 20 gallon tank and they would never stay stable. After doing a few of my own experiments, I nixed the colored gravel and everything was fine. Imagine that?!!! 

In my case, it seemed that the epoxy coating was leaching something into the water detrimental to the fish. After a while, pieces of the paint actually flaked off. I know gravel is colored in different ways - sometimes paint, sometimes dye, who knows what else. I've had trouble with painted decorations sold from pet stores too! I don't use them anymore. After having several beloved and unusual algae eater die after nibbling the algae on the painted decorations, I gave up. Now my tanks are almost completely natural, with live plants (a few fake ones, but no paint), driftwood, pea gravel and healthy water! Yay....finally.


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## Jasey

I too, like Geegafish, had detrimental results from dye-leeching gravel. The brand that failed for me was Petco. All of my fish in the tank died from it. I have, however, used TopFin gravel before and had no problem with it.

However now I am using Eco-Complete (great for growing live plants). And as others have stated here, I also use non-coated pea gravel from Home Depot. If you go that route, make sure to rinse the gravel thoroughly if you don't want cloudy/dirty tank water.


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## Amphitrite

If you can afford the extra expense, then I would also highly recommend eco-complete for planted tanks if you're planning on keeping live plants.

When I started out in the hobby I opted for artifical decorations such as caves - but have found that a much more natural effect can be achieved using a mixture of live plants, a dark substrate, slate, bogwood and rocks. 

If you can't afford eco complete, then a fine gravel from somewhere such as Home Depot is a good alternative - mixed with some plant fertilisers or API or Seachem Root Tabs.


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## Seamoe

Thank you for all the feedback, guys. I think I will opt for a more natural setting, with natural rocks and such, tough I'm a little I'm kind of clueless as to what to get and where to get it from. I will visit the local Home Depot and take a look at the rocks, gravel available there. I guess I'll also have to find another local fish store fro different options.

Which eco-complete gravel type do you recommend for live plants (and frogs and fish) in my 10 gallon tank?


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## Jasey

Eco-Complete is a brand of gravel specifically designed for aquatic plant growth, and has some great reviews. It -is- a little on the expensive side, being around $25 for a 20 lb. bag. The 20 lb. bag should be more than enough for a 10 gallon though. There is also Fluorite from the brand Seachem, and it is slightly less expensive. Try looking for a locally owned fish store in your area (internet, phone book). They are more likely to have these substrates and also other things, such as driftwood, than a commercial store like Petsmart or Petco would. Although, I do believe I've seen some pieces of driftwood at Petsmart next to their packages of gravel.


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## GeegaFish

I believe if you cannot find what you want locally that Dr.'s Foster & Smith carry it online or via catalog order. Good luck!


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## fish_4_all

Pea gravel is a great choice and it works really well. Mostly if not completely inert so it shouldn't effect your tnak chemistry and can be found in many colors.

I actually found a bag of what was called industrial gravel/sand. I had to sift it to get the sizes I wanted in the tnak but for $4 it was well worth it for a 50# bag. Could probably do the same thing with play sand if you can find it.

As for the gravel you have, I would definately take it back and insist on my money back. That is rediculaous to have the dye come off like that.


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## iamntbatman

Eco-complete is a brand name of substrate designed for planted tanks. Some people use just plain Eco-complete while others mix it with other types of gravel. It's really up to you - having pure Eco-complete will be even better for your plants but might not be the look you want. 

It shouldn't be too difficult to find rocks for your aquarium. I couldn't find loose rocks at Home Depot, but they do sell large slate flagstones that you could easily break up and use. I avoided this because I thought they were a bit expensive and wanted to avoid the sharp edges you'd get by breaking the rocks. Most landscaping stores or garden centers will have a bigger selection of rocks. Usually slate or shale is easy enough to find and is great for stacking up to make networks of caves. Round river rocks (also available in 50 lb bags of baseball-sized rocks from Home Depot for very little money) can also look good scattered around your aquarium. In general, I would just try to avoid a few types of rocks: anything close to a roadway that might have oil or other nasty stuff on/in it, rocks that look rust-stained as these can have high metal contents and be bad for your fish, and any rock soft enough for you to break easily or scratch with your fingernail. These types of rocks can often raise your pH. River rocks, slates, shales, granite, gneiss all work. Just give 'em a good scrub (I use an old toothbrush and a garden hose) then pour some boiling water over them to kill any critters.

I would recommend getting your live plants from a LFS or another aquarist, as it's difficult to know if the plant you're getting from anywhere else is truly aquatic.

Driftwood can be a real pain to find so despite its expense, it's usually most readily available at a LFS.


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## Seamoe

I found the Pea Gravel. It's really a great deal at $4. But, I didn't buy it because I want to take a look at the Eco-Complete. It's so sad, I have the tank there.. with no plants or fish in it. I googled some local fish stores and I'm going to try going this weekend so I can finally move on.

I decided to go all "natural" and just go with the wood and stones. However, I've yet to find those. I did see stones at the same place I saw the pea gravel at, but it is quite a but more expensive than the pea gravel.

As for plants, I'm no expert. Not sure how to tell an "aquatic" pkant form a non-aquatic one. From my simple understanding, an aquatic plant is just a plant that lives in water. The ones I saw at PetSmart looked green and healthy. I want to find moss for the tank, though, which I don't think I saw there.

I'll update you guys when I've got something.


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## fish_4_all

http://www.plantgeek.net/plantguide_list.php?category=11

List of some non aquatic plants. Also avoid bamboo, lucky plant, or anything else that looks like it should be grown in a flower pot.

The same site has a lot of aquatic plants that will give oyu an idea of what to look for when you do go to decide on what plants to get.

Remember you do not have to wait until the tank is cycled to add the plants.


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## Seamoe

I bought the pea gravel and tried to add it to the already water-filled tank. Even thought I had rinsed the gravel, it clouded up the tank something awful. So, I went back to square one, and restarted the tank, this time putting the gravel in first after rinsing it a few more times. It looks good now. And no more blue water.

Thanks for that list, fish_4_all. I compiled the info from that site into a "Yes" and "No" list. I presented it to the lady at the fish/aquatic plant place (not PetSmart, it's another place I found) and got a chuckle and funny looks, but they seemed to have true aquatic plants there.

I bought a Cardinal Plant, a Wentii, and another plant which name I cannot remember. I also bought some Java Moss, but I had to take it out because it became scattered around the tank and started clogging the filter. I'd like to get something less likely to float up and more likely to cover the gravel instead.

Unfortunately, I bouht the plants before redoing the tank and they took a bit of beating while I put them aside to wait for the water to dechlorinate again. But they seem to be rebounding just fine, and I've now got my tank set up with the plants and two African Dwarf Frogs.


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## Tyyrlym

Jasey said:


> They are more likely to have these substrates and also other things, such as driftwood, than a commercial store like Petsmart or Petco would. Although, I do believe I've seen some pieces of driftwood at Petsmart next to their packages of gravel.


My local Petsmart has a large selection of drift wood, plants, and "natural" looking decorations. In fact my LFS doesn't stock aquarium decorations at all aside from a small case of live plants.


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## Jasey

Tyyrlym said:


> Jasey said:
> 
> 
> 
> They are more likely to have these substrates and also other things, such as driftwood, than a commercial store like Petsmart or Petco would. Although, I do believe I've seen some pieces of driftwood at Petsmart next to their packages of gravel.
> 
> 
> 
> My local Petsmart has a large selection of drift wood, plants, and "natural" looking decorations. In fact my LFS doesn't stock aquarium decorations at all aside from a small case of live plants.
Click to expand...

Petsmart here is the same way. However, the ones I have been to do not carry Eco-Complete. I've only seen that at LFS's.


Seamoe, I'm glad you finally got the tank up with the plants and frogs! That pea gravel sure is dusty to begin with. I had to let a hose run through mine for 30 minutes before the water was clear again.
As for the java moss, it needs to be tied down to something so that it will root to the object before it will stay put. I currently have some tied down to a piece of driftwood. Once it attaches you can remove the string, although my LFS said it may take a couple of months.


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