# me with another filtration question..lol..



## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

after some consideration, i think i have decided against doing a sump, my tank is not a reef ready tank, and i am afraid of flooding.(hate it, i loved the idea of a sump/refrigium) but i have not seen a overflow that i trust enough not to flood/ or burn up pumps in a power outage. so i think i will use a hob skimmer, run my fluval 305 canister with carbon, maybe some phos remover. and let live sand and live rock do the rest. do you see any problems with that. can a sw set up run like that, and be as quality a system as a sump set up...


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

I have run many saltwater systems exactly as you describe. You will be limited by the quality of the hang on skimmer you choose, and options are fewer than in sump models, but you can run a great marine tank with a hang on skimmer and live rock.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

wannalearn said:


> after some consideration, i think i have decided against doing a sump, my tank is not a reef ready tank, and i am afraid of flooding.(hate it, i loved the idea of a sump/refrigium) but i have not seen a overflow that i trust enough not to flood/ or burn up pumps in a power outage. so i think i will use a hob skimmer, run my fluval 305 canister with carbon, maybe some phos remover. and let live sand and live rock do the rest. do you see any problems with that. can a sw set up run like that, and be as quality a system as a sump set up...


 Your all set. You don't need to run a sump. And HOB Skimmer models have improved quite a bit. Even if you do consider going to a reef setup, your still ok to use the setup you listed.


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

thanks, that is what i figured, just needed to hear it, pasfur,reefmadness i really take what you 2 say to heart, so thanks for all the help. you 2 are kind of like my confidence boosters lol..


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

I have a Rena Filstar canister and a HOB Red Sea Prizm skimmer on my predator tank. I don't have any corals in there, but it works GREAT with my eel and lionfish! All I have for CUC in there is a Choc. chip starfish and an urchin for algae. It can be done


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

how do you like that skimmer, has it done pretty good for you


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

Honestly its been a little hard to get it running the way it should be, like my round/conical skimmers. It takes some breaking in and adjusting/tweaking to get it running right. It may just be the nature of the beast since it is sort of square. Every skimmer I've had takes breaking in and adjusting, but this one needed quite a bit more.

BTW where are you in So.IL? I live in Granite City.


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

I forgot to add, it does not leave a lot of bubbles in the water like a lot of skimmers, which is great for an in-tank HOB! (I wouldn't dare want either of my other 2 hooked up directly to the display tank. WAY too many bubbles!!)


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> I forgot to add, it does not leave a lot of bubbles in the water like a lot of skimmers, which is great for an in-tank HOB! (I wouldn't dare want either of my other 2 hooked up directly to the display tank. WAY too many bubbles!!)


 Just wait til the air line clogs up with salt, and you gotta tear the thing apart to clean it out, bubbles will be mad inthe tank. Also, what are your trate readings using that thing? What are your water changes like? I've had one of those, nothing but a headache. Its not really rated for its numbers on the box, I would only put a Prizm on a 30g tank, and nothing else.


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

trate readings? Do you mean nitrate?

The combo of my rena canister and the prizm is actually pretty good now that we have it dialed in, haven't had to do a water change in a VERY long time. Just have to clean the filter media in the canister on a regular basis. I bought it used from the same guy I got the tank from, and it does fine now, in a 44g. Not saying everyone else can use them with sucess but mine is good.

I have an AquaEuroUSA nano skimmer that I ran in a 20g tall I used to have. It worked VERY VERY well but made lots of bubbles.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> trate readings? Do you mean nitrate?
> 
> The combo of my rena canister and the prizm is actually pretty good now that we have it dialed in, *haven't had to do a water change in a VERY long time*. Just have to clean the filter media in the canister on a regular basis. I bought it used from the same guy I got the tank from, and it does fine now, in a 44g. Not saying everyone else can use them with sucess but mine is good.
> 
> I have an AquaEuroUSA nano skimmer that I ran in a 20g tall I used to have. It worked VERY VERY well but made lots of bubbles.


What are your water readings? And, yes trates are short for Nitrates. What are your Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, ALK, CA, and Phosphate readings?


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

This isn't my thread, it was a thread about someone asking if he could use a skimmer and filter instead of a sump. I was only using one of my tanks as an example that it could be done. 

I never have any problems with this tank, it runs itself therefore I don't NEED to do water changes, if that was what the red lettering was for. I may not have 12 yrs experience but I don't think I'm some kind of total noob. There are several others on this website that I know don't do "regular" water changes but only do it if something is wrong. I would consider myself one of those people and use the same theory with my reef tanks, and have plenty of healthy, thriving coral and fish.

If it will make you happy, I will post the readings tomorrow since I have to test my 125 anyways.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> This isn't my thread, it was a thread about someone asking if he could use a skimmer and filter instead of a sump. I was only using one of my tanks as an example that it could be done.
> 
> I never have any problems with this tank, it runs itself therefore I don't NEED to do water changes, if that was what the red lettering was for. I may not have 12 yrs experience but I don't think I'm some kind of total noob. There are several others on this website that I know don't do "regular" water changes but only do it if something is wrong. I would consider myself one of those people and use the same theory with my reef tanks, and have plenty of healthy, thriving coral and fish.
> 
> If it will make you happy, I will post the readings tomorrow since I have to test my 125 anyways.


 I don't do regular water changes either.........But I carbon dose. And my water parameters are as follows.
Ammonia-0
Nitrates-0
Nitrites-0
Phospahtes-0
I was just replying to your message about the Prizm, which i tested on my 125g awhile ago. And, whith what I came away with was, that it wasn't fit for a 30g tank. 
Heres what you do. Borrow a good skimmer from someone you know, put it on your tank for 2 weeks, then you will see the difference. Proof is in seeing for yourself. Don't trust what I'm saying, check out everything I advise. If I havent' tried it, I would not advise the use of it.


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

Sorry it just seemed like you were jumping on me about it and trying to push advice that I didn't ask for. (A lot of ppl on another forum do this a LOT)

I guess after I finally take down the 65g I could try the skimmer in there, but it will make a lot of bubbles in the tank. What kind of skimmer are you talking about borrowing? I'm sure someone in SLASH (my local club) would have something...

Params this afternoon were (not too long after the eel got fed)
Amm .25
NO2 - 0
NO3 - 5
SG - 1.023
CA - 460
GH - 11
Phos - .25


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> Sorry it just seemed like you were jumping on me about it and trying to push advice that I didn't ask for. (A lot of ppl on another forum do this a LOT)
> 
> I guess after I finally take down the 65g I could try the skimmer in there, but it will make a lot of bubbles in the tank. What kind of skimmer are you talking about borrowing? I'm sure someone in SLASH (my local club) would have something...
> 
> ...


 Yikes. No, I'm not here to jump anyone, I've been on those forums getting my butt handed to me verbally, and I didn't like it, so I would certainly hope not to pull that on anyone else. So, if my answer was out of line, my apologies.
Now:
Your water: YIKES
To borrow. Hmm, would you be able to hunt down a Reef Octopus HOB? SWC Skimmer? Deltec? I would think you could get your hands on a Reef Octopus, you will be very suprised how well these things work.
Also, not for nothing, and alot of people will be suprised, but if you get a Coralife SUper SKimmer and modify it, it also works very well.


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

Whats wrong besides the tiny bit of Amm and Phos, and the nitrates? Am I missing something? I haven't done a WC in about 3 months so I'd say its due.

Whatever skimmer has to be hang on back. No room in the skinny stand this tank is on for a sump.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl;863884[COLOR=red said:


> *]Whats wrong besides the tiny bit of Amm and Phos, and the nitrates*[/color]? Am I missing something? I haven't done a WC in about 3 months so I'd say its due.
> 
> Whatever skimmer has to be hang on back. No room in the skinny stand this tank is on for a sump.


Considering your not supposed to have any of those readings in a saltwater tank you mean? Ammonia is very dangerous to fish and corals, Nitrites are really close to that, Nitrates are ok even at high levels for fish only, corals are ok with them in the low range, 20 or below, not including SPS. Ammonia Kills fish.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> Whats wrong besides the tiny bit of Amm and Phos, and the nitrates? Am I missing something? I haven't done a WC in about 3 months so I'd say its due.
> 
> Whatever skimmer has to be hang on back. No room in the skinny stand this tank is on for a sump.


 The ones that I listed all have a Hang On Back (HOB) skimmer.


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

This is a FOWLR tank. Eel, lionfish, choc chip star, and pincushion urchin are only inhabitants. NO CORAL.
I feed the eel 2-3x/wk and a while after he is fed the ammonia always goes up a tiny bit.

The ammonia was on the first line, 0.25. Not 20. Nitrate was on the 3rd line so yes I did a water change yesterday.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

trukgirl said:


> This is a FOWLR tank. Eel, lionfish, choc chip star, and pincushion urchin are only inhabitants. NO CORAL.
> I feed the eel 2-3x/wk and a while after he is fed the ammonia always goes up a tiny bit.
> 
> The ammonia was on the first line, 0.25. Not 20. Nitrate was on the 3rd line so yes I did a water change yesterday.


 Ammonia should never go up. You have enough bacteria in the water to take care of the feeding with no problem.
Ammonia - The Free Freshwater and Saltwater Aquarium Encyclopedia Anyone Can Edit - The Aquarium Wiki


Ammonia is produced constantly via the gills of fish, by the aquatic animals waste products decaying and the decay of plant and fish food.

*Ammonia causes gill damage and eventually skin damage and death*.

In general, ammonia is more* toxic at higher alkaline **pH** values* and as the temperature of the water increases
I'm outta this one. Post what you will. Ammonia is bad for fish. Its up to you at this point to realize that it does not matter if its a Reef or FOWLR. Its a bad thing. Thats is why we do not recommend using fish to cycle tanks, they usually die from the Ammonia.


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

I've used the Prism. Have one sitting in the garage. Not worth the price at all. Just not enough contact time, to small of a neck, constant adjustments. There are far better hang on skimmers.


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

think i have decided to go with a octopus hob skimmer, hear alot of good reviews about it...and trukgirl. i live in tamms, very southern tip of illinois... i have family that lives in granit city..


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

Oh really? I live not too far from Lee's Chicken.


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

not sure where lee's chicken is.. havent been to granite city in probibly 15 years, you dont know john and letha lesar do you..


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

No, doesn't sound familiar... but thats ok! You should come visit them in Feb/March and come to the SLASH club frag swap... lots of CHEAP coral, equipment, all kinds of stuff CHEAP!! Its at the Eagles lodge right on Madison Ave. Plus they have raffles with frags and equipment too! We win every time we go... this past one (3 wks ago) I only won 1 frag of zoas but the one in Feb I won 6 frags!


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

just may have to do that..lol we would have to wear certian cloths so that we could notice eachother..
olol


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## trukgirl (Jan 28, 2010)

Sure  when it gets closer to time I'll remind ya but it should be around Feb/March.


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## wannalearn (Jan 22, 2011)

sweet... should be fun


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