# Spawning Farlowella (Twig Catfish)



## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I think it is particularly rewarding when fish feel so "at home" that they spawn, particularly when they are a species that are not that prone to spawn in community aquaria. Aunt kymmie had her discus spawn the other week, and that is just what I mean. Today it was my Farlowella, last week the Bolivian Rams [another story for another thread].

I put three Farlowella vittata (Twig Catfish, click on the name to see the profile for info on this fish) in my 90g flooded Amazonian forest setup last year, not knowing if I had male/female in the trio; with my eyesight even a magnifying glass wouldn't allow me to see the "bristles" on the male's snout:lol:. Solely due to their different girths, I had a hunch there were two females and one male. For the past several days one fish has spent a lot of time on the glass beneath the filter spraybar. A bit unusual in itself, since these fish occur in slow-flowing waters and in this aquarium very rarely stay close to the filter flow (which is pretty minimal anyway), although that can be a sign of trouble if they need oxygen. So I kept an eye on the fish, and I thought it looked quite plump. 

This morning the pair were on the glass with a clutch of 8 eggs in between; as of a moment ago there are 10 more eggs. I took the attached photos which aren't that good with my cheap camera, but you can see the "plumper" female above and the thinner male below, and the fairly large eggs. I realize now that for the past few days the female has been cleaning the glass in preparation.

The authorities say this is not a particularly difficult fish to spawn, though as noted in the profile feeding the young is tricky. Fry of various fish appear every now and then in this aquarium, though I rarely witness actual spawning routines, since most of these forest fish spawn in the early dawn so it goes unobserved and many scatter eggs in plant thickets; some, like the Nannostomus eques pencilfish deposit them on the underside of leaves and I have several times witnessed that. This is not one of the species that I would have expected to spawn on its own initiative in a large community aquarium.

Byron.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Wow. That is so cool. Their eggs look huge, nearly twice the size of what my discus lay. Thanks for shawing the pics. I know exactly how you feel as far as feeling "rewarded". Your rams also spawned? I think there's some serious Love Potion #9 up there in your Canadian waters...maybe you should start bottling it for sale in the states?
Thanks for posting the pics, they are good quality shots!


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

Congrats on the eggs. Hard to imagine all those eggs coming from that twiggy little fish! Good luck with them and hopefully you'll have some hatch. Are you planning to try to raise any of the fry or do you think they'll get eaten by your other fish?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Just now there are 21 eggs, and the female is still quite plump. The male is up on the glass sort of centre, guarding them as he will do. I would expect them to survive to hatching, but then...too many hungry mouths in the tank I would think.

I've had one pencilfish and several tetra fry survive in this tank; they can get sufficient food from zooplankton and remain among the thick plants. These though will be different. Nature will take its course as it always does in my tanks.

Byron.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

I am always in awe of your tanks. They are so beautiful and this one is no exception. Congrats on having your fish so comfortable that they feel ready to spawn. Those are some very interesting fish. So much to learn, I am so glad I have found this forum. You have been a font of knowledge and I so appreciate your willingness to share it.


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

i think your cheap camera took good shots. thanks so much for sharing, i love when fish breed.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Thak all for your kind comments.

I just spotted in two of the photos one of the group of Characidium fasciatum [prob. sp] hovering there. Just for the record, it is not pondering the eggs, it is pondering me outside the tank. As noted in our profile, this fish is particularly responsive to the aquarist. Every time I enter the fish room, regardless, all five of them are at the front corner, hovering mid-water or sometimes perched on a plant leaf. They want food of course. Once they have settled into the aquarium, this is one species that you never have to wonder if they are all there, they will instinctively come to the front whenever they see (or hear) you. If I sit there without moving for a spell, and then raise my hand to pick up a glass [won't say of what;-)] they will suddenly twitch around to look, no matter where in the aquariu they are, waiting to see if more movement might happen. Highly inquisitive fish. I wouldn't be surprised if some spawning from them occurs in a few months. I'm fairly certain there are male and female, and the other day I was engaged watching three of the males displaying back and forth, somewhat typical characin fashion, but a little different in this species. They challenge one another, one is obviously dominant and darts at the other, who rolls sideways and flutters, then another enters the match. Fascinating world.


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

Awesome photos! Those really are some gigantic eggs considering the shape of the fish they're coming out of. I almost always let nature take its course in my tanks as well, but I can't help but cheer for the little guys. I hope some make it!

Those darting characin are really cool looking fish. I'll have to keep an eye out for those. I can probably squeeze them in somewhere (especially if I ever get around to reducing the size of this kribensis colony).


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

WOW! And I was thrilled about my Angels...sheesh :roll: . This is incredible Byron. How many eggs did you end up getting in totoal? When those photos were taken, that female looked like she still had a lot left. It will be neat to see if they make it to the free swimming stage. I'm curious to hear how the Farlowella do in protecting their eggs from the other fish. Since they don't swim persay, I wonder if they'll be able to fight off the other fish when they discover the eggs. This will be interesting to follow. Thank you for sharing. I'm looking forward to my own trio of Farlowella in a few weeks or so.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*Update and Second spawning*

It has now been 8 days since the spawning last Monday week, and you can see the darkened eggs that are left. Early this morning, the Farlowella spawned again, or perhaps it was the other female (there are 2 females and one male) and the attached photos show the string of new eggs beside the existing, with the male guarding the nest.

According to all reports I have read, a male will spawn with several females in succession if they are ready, even the same day, and guard the nests. He has done a fair job for a fish that really has no aggressive traits.

By the way, the dark dots to the right of the eggs in the larger photo is green dot algae, for those who despair over this; it is absolutely common in many tanks, and with the eggs on this panel I did not scrape this glass last week during the water change, and this is how quickly it can appear.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

That is amazing. Great pictures. What happened to the eggs from last week? I see the black eggs left as you staed, but what about the rest? Did they get eaten or were they not fertilized? Did you find out how long until Farlowella eggs hatch?


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

hey byron
in due time if there's any success can i buy 3 from you or would shipping to the states be to pricey?
thanks


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Lisa, hatching time is 6-10 days, today is day 8. As for the others, they have slowly disappeared. The male goes over them mouthing them periodically but does not seem to "eat" them. Don't know if other fish do at night, or if they fall off, or hatch. I think they were all fertilized because the dark "dot" turned into a dark line in all that were there and this over the week expanded until the eggs were as they appear now. Can't detect any motion inside them.

onefish2fish, I'm letting nature takes its course so I expect if they do hatch something will eat them, depending when it is. At night the fry might disappear into plants and survive. Fry of various fish in this tank do survive now and then. I wouldn't want to risk shipping, I sent some plants Air Express to California, took over a week and they all died.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Quite interesting, to say the least. I'm curious to know if the parents protect their young, or if they are on their own once they are free-swimming.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Quite interesting, to say the least. I'm curious to know if the parents protect their young, or if they are on their own once they are free-swimming.


The reports Ihave read indicate that the male guards the eggs and the fry until they are free swimming. After the eggs hatch, the fry remain to absorb the yolk sac which is about five more days before they are free-swimming. It is very difficult to feed the fry, which need the softest and smallest of plant matter. If some get down among the thick plants, a few might survive.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Was just thinking of your thread. Have you spotted any surviving Farlowella?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

There were two spawnings as you know. The second set of eggs have been developing; yesterday morning when I went in, they were all gone. I've no idea if they all hatched, or (more likely) something got them during the night. Almost 3 weeks there were eggs on the glass with the male guarding them. If they did hatch, the fry presumably would be down among plants somewhere.

Today I noticed a very rotund female on that same glass, with the male close by, so I am thinking another spawning is in the offing.

I also have interesting behaviour among the Characidium fasciatum, one of the fish is very rotund, presumably a female, and "she" has been interacting quite a lot with two of the thinner presumably-male fish. Lots of what I call sparring--very fast darting at each other, spinning around, sidling up, etc.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, 3 weeks? That's a long time for eggs. I guess every species is different. Maybe in the coming weeks you'll see small Farlowella. That would be neat. Is the Characidium fasciatum an egg scatterer?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Wow, 3 weeks? That's a long time for eggs. I guess every species is different. Maybe in the coming weeks you'll see small Farlowella. That would be neat. Is the Characidium fasciatum an egg scatterer?


Baensch/Riehl say the eggs will fall among plants and gravel.

There were 2 batches of eggs, so the 3 weeks overlaps; it takes 6-10 days to hatch, and these last eggs that "disappeared" yesterday were the second spawning. The eggs from the first spawning "disappeared" around last Tuesday. Once they hatch, it takes 5 days for the fry to absorb the yolk sac before they are free swimming.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Did you see any wigglers before that or did the eggs themselves just disappear?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Did you see any wigglers before that or did the eggs themselves just disappear?


Disappeared, which is why I'm inclined to think something ate them.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Well, another spawning occurred yesterday. Total of 28 eggs. Here are some photos taken mid way through. There are two females and one male in this tank, so no idea which female, they look identical to me.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, nice shots! You can see how distended with female's belly is. Does the male then come along and fertilize the eggs?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Wow, nice shots! You can see how distended with female's belly is. Does the male then come along and fertilize the eggs?


I observed for almost an hour (fell asleep actually:lol. The female meticulously cleans the glass around the existing eggs, the male periodically comes up from below her, sometimes to her side, there is a bit of twitching of their tails, but I could not see any eggs being deposited. From what I did observe, I believe they deposit and fertilize the eggs simultaneously side by side, in characin fashion as opposed to separately like angelfish.


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## britnyjackson (Mar 10, 2010)

Wow amazing pics and info Byron!! I will definitely be watching this thread for updates!! Keep us posted!!


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

It's quite fascinating to learn how each species spawn. My Angelfish fry are now free-swimming. I cannot believe they made it this far in a community tank.


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## amazon21 (Jun 28, 2010)

wow!, whiptail's are hard to spawn. Do you have any red whiptails in that tank??


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

amazon21 said:


> wow!, whiptail's are hard to spawn. Do you have any red whiptails in that tank??


Assuming you mean the fish pictured below, Rineloricaria sp. L010A, no, I've never seen them. I have two other Rineloricaria species in the 115g Amazon riverscape. The fish that spawned are Farlowella.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*Update--hatching and another round of spawning*

This morning I noticed the Farlowella were again spawning; about a dozen eggs so far. At noon I interrupted the proceedings to do the weekly water changes. The water level of course dropped below the egg clusters on the tank wall, but this has occurred previous weeks and I just splash some water over them a few times so they don't dry.

When the tank refill started, I noticed that about half of the oldest (black) eggs were gone, and they had been there when I started the water change. A group of 4 or 5 tetra were also gathered on that side under the eggs. H'm, I suspected you know what, and I was right.

I found 7 hatched fry hanging on the glass (1 on a plant) and managed to net them and move them into the 10g. With all the plants in there, plus the much smaller fish, they may have a better chance. They require soft plant matter and algae for their first feedings once the yolk sac is absorbed and that is the most likely tank for all that. Having hatched, they will now take 5 days to absorb the yolk sac, according to the spawning reports. Then we'll see.

I tried photos, never expecting any luck with my cheap camera, but--surprised again, they are not bad. This is one of the fry. They are about 5/16 of an inch in length.

Byron.


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

:cheers:


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

That is most impressive. They are larger than I expected for newly hatched fry. They almost resemble an oto with their size and shape. I hope some survive for you. Good luck!


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## zof (Apr 23, 2010)

Sweet these are interesting fish, glad you've had such a good hatch out so far!


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Byron- that is amazing! Good pics, too. I know you always like to let nature "take its course" but I'm happy to hear you netted out the babies to the 10gl. It'll be interesting to watch them develop. I'm loving your new camera skills!!


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Congratulations! That is certainly some exciting news for you. They are pretty cute when they are so small. I hope some of them grow to adulthood for you. What will you do if your tank becomes over run with these guys?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Inga said:


> Congratulations! That is certainly some exciting news for you. They are pretty cute when they are so small. I hope some of them grow to adulthood for you. What will you do if your tank becomes over run with these guys?


Sell them. They sell for $12-15 each in Vancouver.

And thanks kymmie. B.

Fish are spawning all over the place. This week an Emperor Tetra fry appeared in a tank in which there have never been Emperor tetra. Wonder who can figure that out? [There's a reason, my fish are not flying from tank to tank--at least I don't think they are:shock:].

And the Bolivians are preparing to try again, after something (I suspect one of the nocturnal catfish) got the first batch of eggs on the second night. And the Hemigrammus pulcher were scattering eggs earlier this week, all I'm sure eagerly devoured by the rummynose that were sitting patiently below the plants waiting.


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## bones14 (Mar 19, 2010)

The only way I can think of to get a fry in the tank that had never had Emperor Tetras before is you moved plants from another tank that had eggs on them.Am I right?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

bones14 said:


> The only way I can think of to get a fry in the tank that had never had Emperor Tetras before is you moved plants from another tank that had eggs on them.Am I right?


Yes, either the egg or a fry were moved either in plants or in wood. I had pulled the 70g apart and set it up with new gravel and rocks and new wood. I moved over a few plants from the 33g, and the Emperors had been in there about 6 weeks prior. When I noticed the 3/8 inch fry for the first time, 3 weeks later still, it was an hour after I moved a piece of wood from the 33g. So it could have been a fry in a tunnel in the wood.

I also have 5 Emperors that "appeared" in the 90g about 3 months after the Emperors had been removed from that tank. And 3 of these appeared first, about 3/8 inch long; some 5 weeks later two more 3/8 inch fry appeared, by which time the first 3 were 3/4 inch long. That seems a long time for eggs to be sitting so I am assuming the first fry spawned.

I seem to have a glut of Emperors.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Byron, wanted to check in to see how the fry are going? Are they getting bigger?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

According to published information, the fry take 5 days to absorb the yolk sac before they become free swimming. Yesterday was day 5 post-hatching, and when I checked this morning a few minutes ago after the lights came on, I see that the 7 fry are spread out around the tank whereas for the past 5 days they have remained basically in one corner (5 of them, the other 2 I could never see). So they are obviously moving around the tank today. They still appear to be rather motionless, but if I sit and observe them for a longer period I should see them "swimming". They are about 1/2 inch in length now, very thin of course, and hanging on plant leaves or the glass.

I've let the direct daylight and sunlight hit this tank for the past couple of days to encourage algae, as they require soft green foods at first. Feeding the fry initially is said to be the trickiest part of the whole process. I can't see there is any need for me to start polluting the tank with decomposing spinach or something, there is a lot of natural algae which is after all what they would eat in nature.

Byron.


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## thefishboy (Aug 20, 2010)

Wow ive seen these in my LFS, but they dont look nearly as happy, and full of colour as yours.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*Update, new photos of fry "swimming" (sort of)*

Fry are now free swimming, which for Farlowella means hanging on the glass or plants grazing algae. And the 7 (they are all there) are now doing this. Here's a photo of two of them, best I can do with my cheap camera.

They are about half an inch long, and perfect miniature relicas of the adults, in appearance and habits. I did the water changes earlier today, and when this tank was being drained they kept moving down the glass with the water. I'm keeping the blinds open with afternoon sun on the tank to keep algae growing fast. They certainly seem to be grazing it, so hopefully they will get enough nourishment to grow.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Those are amazing pictures! You sound like a proud grandfather.  Will you keep all of the babies?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Let's wait and see how many make it. But seriously, if they all do, I would like to trade some for credit on fish with a local store. I know the owners personally of 3 good local fish retailers and I think they would each readily accept some Farlowella. These fish sell for around $15 here.

And I still have the last batch of eggs in the 90g that haven't hatched yet; if I am as successful moving those when they do I might have even more.


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## Inga (Jun 8, 2010)

Very cool! I would think that if they came this far, they will grow up nicely but what do I know. It just seems that at that size, they should already be a bit safer in the tank. They sure are cute little guys. 

I wish I had a few fish people here that I felt so confident in. There is one store that sells a larger variety of fresh water fish and the guy claims to have over 20 years of experience but he has also told me things that I know for a fact are not true. The tanks in that store are full of algae which I know isn't a crisis but seems odd to me for a shop to have their display tanks full of algae. That is where I got the Java Moss with the brush algae on it.

The other store the guy seems a bit arrogant and the cost of fish there is just way out of hand. Petsmart will have a fish listed for $5.00 and I go there see a fish of the same size and species and he will have it listed for $35.00. I know sometimes you pay for the knowledge and sometimes, it is worth that but in this case, I am not sure it is. His tanks however, are amazing. Clean and well set up, from what I can see.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Wow those are awsome pictures! Congrats on the eggs.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Great update, Byron. Nice pictures. This makes me want to get one or two more Farlowella myself. I actually saw two in the LFS, but they were so small I was concerned that they might not make it with the larger one I already have. Plus, they didn't look quite like the one I already have (beasides size of course), as I assume there are many species of Farlowella. Do you think different species will get along okay? We both love our Farlowella and find him quite entertaining.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Great update, Byron. Nice pictures. This makes me want to get one or two more Farlowella myself. I actually saw two in the LFS, but they were so small I was concerned that they might not make it with the larger one I already have. Plus, they didn't look quite like the one I already have (beasides size of course), as I assume there are many species of Farlowella. Do you think different species will get along okay? We both love our Farlowella and find him quite entertaining.


Lisa, check our profile of this fish. There is a diagram of the two commonly-seen species, and as it mentions there are some 30 known species, only two of which are regularly imported.

You have ot be careful, there is a very similar-looking fish called a royal farlowella (common name, useless of course but sometimes used) that gets large, too large. Sturisoma is the genus. The smaller species (5-6 inches max) are the best.


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## thefishboy (Aug 20, 2010)

Nice pictures, they are amazing fish!


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Yikes, that's scary. I hope I got the right species with my first one. I'd say he's about 6" right now and hasn't grown since I got him. Actually, I just looked at the profile and he looks like the Farlowella Acus. The one's I saw at the LFS were small; about 2"-3".


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Yikes, that's scary. I hope I got the right species with my first one. I'd say he's about 6" right now and hasn't grown since I got him. Actually, I just looked at the profile and he looks like the Farlowella Acus. The one's I saw at the LFS were small; about 2"-3".


The rostrum (snout) on the Royal is curved upward more, at least to my eyes. And these fish are usually seen larger, say 6+ inches in the store, at least that's how I've always noticed them. That is not a reliable guide though. If I look at the fish in the store for a minute, I can tell which it is. It's just something about it...:roll:

Ask the store to see the scientific name on the inventory sheet from the supplier. That can be incorrect of course, I have seen fish labelled one name that were different...but if it said a genus other than Farlowella, it probably is.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Ok, the one I have now is definitely straight. Not curve upward at all. Next time I go back I'll look at the two at the LFS. They were so small though I'm afraid I won't be able to tell.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*update photos*

Day 6. Here are photos of a couple of the fry this morning. Just like the adults, these are busy little beavers, grazing plant leaves continually for algae.

On another note, the last batch of eggs that must have been on the point of hatching disappeared overnight, and this morning 35 new eggs have been laid and are being guarded by the male. These fish are certainly dedicated; the male has been guarding eggs now for 6 continuous weeks non-stop, this is now the fourth (I think) spawning from these 3 fish (two females, one male).


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Byron, they are so cute. I wish I lived close by and could come over and get one for one of my tanks!


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, they seem to be growing at a fairly quick rate. Great pictures. Thanks again for sharing.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Those are some awsome little fish.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Last update was nearly a month ago. Byron, how are the fry doing??


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Yes I agree we need an update.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I was thinking that, and tried getting some photos yesterday when I was photographing the Echinodorus flowers, but my camera wouldn't co-operate. But I can still update.

I now have close to 50 fry in that 10g. The original fish, in the earlier photos, are doing very well, they are about an inch long now, very thin as this species is so they don't look "large" as most other fish would at this stage. There were 7 from the initial spawning, and I think most are still there--with all those plants and bunch of moss it's hard to tell. Then there were the four from the second spawning.

Last week, the male was guarding about 35 eggs in the 90g from the latest spawning (the fourth) and rather than wait for the eggs to hatch before moving them and risk losing the fry (they are easy targets once they hatch out) I decided to move them. I carefully scraped them off the glass (they were truly stuck) and put them inside one of those fry nets and hung it inside the 10g; I figured the eggs just sitting on the bottom would be too tempting for the pygmy corys. Late last week, the eggs hatched; the fry take 5 days to absorb the yolk sack before they start "swimming" so I left them until yesterday when I did the water changes. I could see they were beginning to move around, so I dumped them out of the fry net into the 10g. There were almost 40 of them.

I added a sponge filter last week to move the water around a bit. The pygmy corys have been a bit more active since. I may try later after the lights come on to photograph some of the older fry. They have their brown colouration and pattern which is much clearer now.

Byron.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Wow Bryon thats alot of baby fish. I wish I could find some of them around here I would like a few to put in my 55 gallon. I saw them once at a LFS before I had the 55 but they have not had any there since then.


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, very exciting! Thanks for the update. I recently added two more to my 120g tank. I'm hoping all goes well, but I don't think they will be territorial, especially with a 6 foot tank. At what point will you sell them to the LFS? I assume they should be a couple inches first?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

LisaC144 said:


> Wow, very exciting! Thanks for the update. I recently added two more to my 120g tank. I'm hoping all goes well, but I don't think they will be territorial, especially with a 6 foot tank. At what point will you sell them to the LFS? I assume they should be a couple inches first?


Yes, these fish are sensitive to water conditions so I am not going to send them to an early grave.

You'll have no territorial issues, males might poke each other now and then, but no damage will result.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Calmwaters said:


> Wow Bryon thats alot of baby fish. I wish I could find some of them around here I would like a few to put in my 55 gallon. I saw them once at a LFS before I had the 55 but they have not had any there since then.


Amanda, these are one of my absolute favourite fish. Not to everyone's taste of course--their almost total lack of "activity" makes them boring to many. But they have a prehistoric oddity and combined with their incredible peacefulness it makes them very suitable for any soft water community aquarium of quiet fish.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Once I get my tanks moved to the new place I may see if the LFS can order some for me. Do you think 3 is a good number of them for a 55 gallon?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Calmwaters said:


> Once I get my tanks moved to the new place I may see if the LFS can order some for me. Do you think 3 is a good number of them for a 55 gallon?


Yes. I had one, then I got 2 more; they are in a 4-foot tank (90g). Many times you won't even see them; they lie motionless on a plant leaf or piece of wood. I usually only see all three when I feed the fish in the morning; the Farlowella know and will all be at the front in the open space where the sinking food is dropped in for them and the Corydoras.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Good I will add them to my fish wish list. LOL


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## britnyjackson (Mar 10, 2010)

Any new pics?? Would love to see the growth of the babies! : )


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

yussss we need updates


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Byron said:


> Amanda, these are one of my absolute favourite fish. Not to everyone's taste of course--their almost total lack of "activity" makes them boring to many. But they have a prehistoric oddity and combined with their incredible peacefulness it makes them very suitable for any soft water community aquarium of quiet fish.


I agree. I have two in my 120g and they are one of my favorites as well for the same reason. They are very entertaining to watch sort of glide across the tank at times too. They are extremely peaceful and I highly recommend them Amanda, if you have the water parameters to suit them.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Thanks Lisa I will definatly add them after I move my tank to my new place.


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## burnsbabe (Jul 15, 2010)

This has been really interesting to watch Byron. I've read the whole thread sitting here. I have a 55g soft/still set up in my dining room with Pristellas, Bolivan Rams, and Angels right now. I'm looking for some bottom/algae fish and was going to get some otos until I found out about this fish recently.

I know you don't want to ship, and I completely understand, but, I'm in Portland. Any chance you'd sell me a trio when the time is right if I drove up?


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## britnyjackson (Mar 10, 2010)

Yay! another portlander!!


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

britnyjackson said:


> Yay! another portlander!!



i love random people :-D


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

burnsbabe said:


> This has been really interesting to watch Byron. I've read the whole thread sitting here. I have a 55g soft/still set up in my dining room with Pristellas, Bolivan Rams, and Angels right now. I'm looking for some bottom/algae fish and was going to get some otos until I found out about this fish recently.
> 
> I know you don't want to ship, and I completely understand, but, I'm in Portland. Any chance you'd sell me a trio when the time is right if I drove up?


Absolutely. Perhaps we could do an exchange; there is a fish store in Portland that is very good, or so I have been told, forgotten the name again, they have a website I know. Apparently they often have rarer fish. If interested, perhaps we could connect via email, and work something out. PM me. If you are looking for plants, esp swords, I can toss those in too. I have so many plantlets this year I am tossing them due to lack of tank space.

My camera is not co-operating much so updated pics are not yet available, but the first batch of fry are doing quite well. The larger last batch also seem to be managing on the algae in the tank, though a few have disappeared. They are slow growers, as to be expected from vegetarian fish that need to eat so much for the nutrition. Nothing against otos, I have a group in the 115g, and some of the rarer species like the zebra are beautiful; but these Farlowella are something else.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Byron said:


> Absolutely. Perhaps we could do an exchange; there is a fish store in Portland that is very good, or so I have been told, forgotten the name again, they have a website I know. Apparently they often have rarer fish. If interested, perhaps we could connect via email, and work something out. PM me. If you are looking for plants, esp swords, I can toss those in too. I have so many plantlets this year I am tossing them due to lack of tank space.
> 
> My camera is not co-operating much so updated pics are not yet available, but the first batch of fry are doing quite well. The larger last batch also seem to be managing on the algae in the tank, though a few have disappeared. They are slow growers, as to be expected from vegetarian fish that need to eat so much for the nutrition. Nothing against otos, I have a group in the 115g, and some of the rarer species like the zebra are beautiful; but these Farlowella are something else.


Byron- I need to find a Farlowella myself. I keep catching a few of my otos attempting to feed off of the slime coat of my Discus. :-( If I remove all otos from the display (which I plan on doing) I will have no algae janitors in the tank. I highly doubt Farlowella would engage in this type of behavior.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

aunt kymmie said:


> Byron- I need to find a Farlowella myself. I keep catching a few of my otos attempting to feed off of the slime coat of my Discus. :-( If I remove all otos from the display (which I plan on doing) I will have no algae janitors in the tank. I highly doubt Farlowella would engage in this type of behavior.


Never to my knowledge. Farlowella are absolutely one of the most peaceful fish; my trio is in a 90g with some very delicate (pygmy hatchets, rare pencilfish), sensitive (all of them!) and small (Ember Tetra, Pygmy corys) fish. And they are busy beavers on the algae.

Otos are often mentioned as doing what you describe.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Byron said:


> Otos are often mentioned as doing what you describe.


I never knew that and was surprized to see them doing that. I've always had otos in my Discus tank and this is a first. I suspect it's because my Pigeon Blood is being mopey since her mate is in QT being treated for an eye injury. Instead of swiming mid level she has taken to the bottom, staying nestled in the hygro angustifolia, a favorite spot for the otos, making her a prime target. 
I'm going to try to net out as many otos today as I can and move them over to my 75gl. Should be fun. :roll:


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

aunt kymmie said:


> I never knew that and was surprized to see them doing that. I've always had otos in my Discus tank and this is a first. I suspect it's because my Pigeon Blood is being mopey since her mate is in QT being treated for an eye injury. Instead of swiming mid level she has taken to the bottom, staying nestled in the hygro angustifolia, a favorite spot for the otos, making her a prime target.
> I'm going to try to net out as many otos today as I can and move them over to my 75gl. Should be fun. :roll:


I don't know how frequent it occurs, but several sites mention that otos will "suck" on any fish they can latch on to. Some usually say this is no issue with healthy fish, nor is it all that frequent. I've had otos for many years, and while I do sometimes see one "chasing" this or that fish, nothing has every been "caught" that I have seen, though I'm not in front of the tank 24/7. Discus with their slime might be too enticing, or she might be sending out pheromones about her stress that the oto is picking up on.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Byron said:


> I don't know how frequent it occurs, but several sites mention that otos will "suck" on any fish they can latch on to. Some usually say this is no issue with healthy fish, nor is it all that frequent. I've had otos for many years, and while I do sometimes see one "chasing" this or that fish, nothing has every been "caught" that I have seen, though I'm not in front of the tank 24/7. Discus with their slime might be too enticing, or she might be sending out pheromones about her stress that the oto is picking up on.


I think you are very right about this. She's clearly stressed and it makes more sense to move the otos and not her. I'm feeling pretty badly for her. After checking on her mate this morning it looks like another two weeks in QT is warranted. Poor girl. I know that you have to remove Discus fry from the parents after about a week to ten days as the fry will feed off the slime coats to the point of compromising the health of the parents. I have this horrible vision that after the tank lights go off at night she is being swarmed by otos. Yuck!


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## britnyjackson (Mar 10, 2010)

sorry for being so random....haha


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

lol


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*Update on Fry*

Here are a couple photos, the best I could do out of many taken, of 3 of the 4 surviving fry from the original 7. The two together in the second photo are the largest of the 4, though still somewhat difficult to spot on the plant leaves. I moved these 4 from the 10g to the 20g last Friday and they are much more active, grazing plant leaves continually now.

I have various stages of fry still in the 10g, including 54 about-to-hatch eggs I moved from the 90g today.

A lot of the fry did not survive long. As the published reports all mention, feeding the fry is the real challenge, as they require very soft algae. I am sure the original 4 have survived because they had fresh green algae. Even with the 10g in front of a west-facing window with a fair bit of direct sun and an overhead light, I have been unable to keep sufficient algae; these fish are voracious algae eaters. I have tried blanched spinach, raw spinach, zucchini; now I have dry oak leaves in the 10g. I'm trying the oak leaves because as they break down they apparently exude very nutritious food for fish fry, and the Farlowella fry in the 10g have been eager to graze the oak leaves, so this may have better results.

Third photo is the male Poecillocharax weitzmani who just happened to stop motionless for a couple minutes while I was trying to photograph the fry; I have a pair in the 20g, which is otherwise full of small plants culled from the main Amazonian setups. And a shoal of Corydoras pygmaeus and C. habrosus.

Byron.


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

wow they look amazing! are you going to sell breeding pair in the future


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## burnsbabe (Jul 15, 2010)

They're looking good Byron. I've gotten hooked up with a job recently so there should be a check soonish and so some gas money to get to BC. Let me know when you think these guys are ready for a trip.

Have they shown any interest in algae tablets yet?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

burnsbabe said:


> They're looking good Byron. I've gotten hooked up with a job recently so there should be a check soonish and so some gas money to get to BC. Let me know when you think these guys are ready for a trip.
> 
> Have they shown any interest in algae tablets yet?


Not that I've seen. With the middle group of fry I have them in a fry net in the 10g and I am putting sinking pellets (algae) in there along with the oak leaves to see. They are down in the tablets (they fall apart and the fry "sit" in the stuff) periodically but I can't tell if any is being eaten. The larger 4 now in the 20g are working on the plants, and tablets go into this tank regularly for the corys, including a couple of veggie ones, so I will keep an eye on them.

I want to do my best to ensure they will survive the move. It would be a shame if you came all this way only to have them croak on the way home.

Byron.


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## burnsbabe (Jul 15, 2010)

No, I agree. There's no need to rush things. I'd rather have them survive as well. I'll be better off to make the trip with a couple paychecks under my belt anyway. Just glad to hear they're doing well and getting bigger.


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## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

Very nice pictures. They had some of these in the LFS the other day but they were almost $30.00 so they will have to wait a while before I can afford them.


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

Calmwaters said:


> Very nice pictures. They had some of these in the LFS the other day but they were almost $30.00 so they will have to wait a while before I can afford them.


:shock::smash::BIGweepy::BIGcha-ching:


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

burnsbabe said:


> Have they shown any interest in algae tablets yet?


I believe they are eating from tablets now. The 4 I moved into the 20g almost 2 weeks ago spent the first several days on plant leaves, but now they always seem to be on the substrate where I drop the tablet/pellet foods for the corys. This is exactly what the mature Farlowella did when I acquired them; they quickly got used to the feeding routine and are now down with the corys as soon as sinking foods go in.

I still want them to mature a bit, I think it would be safer moving them the longer distance. But they seem to be doing fine.

Byron.


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## james7139 (Jul 10, 2010)

are you going to be selling/shipping them?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

james7139 said:


> are you going to be selling/shipping them?


Provided they survive [there are just 4], I'm trading them to burnsbabe who intends to drive up to get them along with some plants. I have mailed plants with varying degrees of success, but I do not want to attempt live fish.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

*new pic of Farlowella fry*

Here is a photo of the two surviving Farlowella fry from the original spawning which was back in July 2010. One is to the left on the upper surface of a leaf, the other to the right on the underside of another leaf. They are about 1.5 inch long but this is a thin fish so they are still very "small." Also slow growing. I have not seen the other two of the original four for several weeks now and I'm sure they are gone.

There is also one fry from the last spawning, doing quite well in the 10g. When it is a bit larger I'll move it in with these two, but the other is only about 3/4 of an inch and might get nipped by the Poecilocharax weitzmani. There are also some Corydoras pygmaeus in this tank, and they are spawning again today, or to be more accurate, the males are very friendly with the plump female.

Byron.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Aw, they are so sweet. Have you ever had any successful spawns from your pygmys??


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

aunt kymmie said:


> Aw, they are so sweet. Have you ever had any successful spawns from your pygmys??


When they were in the 10g, I think so. They frequently went through the motions, there were 7 of them, and I would see 3 or 4 males very chummy with a very plump female, following her everywhere and nudging her constantly. When I moved the Farlowella fry in there, I dumped in more plants and encouraged algae to grow (it's in a southwest window), so it's impossible to see anything through the thicket of plants. I also had the Boraras brigittae in there. When I moved the 4 oldest fry to the 20g, i decided to remove the adult fish from the 10g to give the youngest Farlowella fry more "privacy" and to net out the pygmys I had to dislodge the chunk of wood. Something skitted across the sand (this is the tank with sand) that was about 1/4 inch and coloured like a pygmy, and I don't know what else it could have been; it vanished back under the wood, and I've periodically watched for signs of whatever it is but nothing so far. I haven't messed with the tank; once the last Farlowella is out, I will tear it down as the algae on the glass next the window is very heavy. But I'm leaving algae for the Farlowella that will eat nothing else.


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## burnsbabe (Jul 15, 2010)

Sweet photos Byron. You're right that these guys are very slow growing fish. But then again, you would be too if all you ate was algae! :lol:


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## Plumkin (Jan 24, 2011)

very impressive =]


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

So happy to hear you have survivors!!


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