# Newbie Question (Feeding Question)



## mikedb1972 (Jul 13, 2008)

i have added a clown to the tank, and now i am having issues with feeding.
when i put the feed into the tank, the water circulation is so strong the food is sucked into the sump before he eats its, 

mu question is what everyone does on the feeding issue, do i need to stop the water flow while feeding, i wouldnt think i should. i have two food types, one is the flake food, and the other is a brine shrimp block.

thanks for any help you can provide, being my first SW tank i am unsure how to handle this issue.


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

At first i was confused, but i think you have an overflow system? yes?

Here is the solution. Hold the flake food underwater, allow it to become saturated, and then release the food. This will prevent it from floating to the surface.


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## mikedb1972 (Jul 13, 2008)

*thanks*

i am sorry i should have said something about my setup, i do have the overflow setup. i did try the holding the brime shrimp under water, but as soon as i let go, it floated straight to the top and to the overflow.

i have alot of water current in the tank and the flake food doesnt stand a chance even after it gets wet. i did get some shrimp pellets and they settle to the bottom, but the clown wont touch them. but if i put a cube of the brime shrimp in, he acts like he is starving to death.

i will keep trying for tonight, but i will have to figure out how to manage for future feeedings. 
thanks

a little about my tank, 55g with wet/dry filter setup with heater, large sump pump. approx 50# LR, last water check yesterday ph8.2, salinity 31, nitrate 20, nitrite 0, amon 0, temp 79.5


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

*Re: thanks*



mikedb1972 said:


> a little about my tank, 55g with wet/dry filter setup with heater, large sump pump. approx 50# LR, last water check yesterday ph8.2, salinity 31, nitrate 20, nitrite 0, amon 0, temp 79.5


Actually, a more interesting question is this... Why do you have a wet/dry setup on a marine aquarium with live rock? This is basically the equivalent of tying bricks to the feet of a swimmer wearing a life jacket. You might eliminate your nitrate problem simply by removing the biomedia, which i would personally do immediately. As in now. Yes, this very second. Just take out the bioballs. Why are you still reading? go go go ....


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## mikedb1972 (Jul 13, 2008)

*really confused*

i must say that i am seriously confused, this is the first staement from anyone in the past 3 months that have mentioned anything about the setup i have, i went through the setup questions all on the forefront, the who what and where stuff, and now i have my setup wrong, dont get me wrong, i am not doubting it, i just find it strange that now after months into this, and after having the tank setup for a month, i find out the bioballs is wrong.

if this is true, then i am lost because what other filtration do i have other than the bioballs. and as far the nitrate Problem, i didnt realize it was a problem, since it was under the 40 that i was told was a safe limit.


i just need verification on this, cause i have alot of money, time and patience already invested. do i need to remove the bioballs, or not, and i still have the feeding issue at hand, does anyone else have a suggestion

i am unsure if this will work, but i am gonna try and post a image here of my setup


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

I am very sorry that you have reached this point in your setup. It is an extreme misfortune that you were not told prior to now that bioballs are a 1980's method of filtration. I do not understand how this is possible, and I sincerely hope it was not this forum that suggested you use biomedia.

I am going to assume that you have a deep understanding of aquarium chemistry in the following explanation. If you need more details, just ask.

Biomedia causes Nitrate buildup. Nitrates are detrimental in a marine aquarium. They need to be kept under 20ppm for most systems, and the closer to zero the better.

What you should strive for is a complete removal of organics from the system. This is achieved with protein skimming. The live rock is an extremely effective biofilter, in that it breaks down organic waste completely, into Nitrogen Gas, which leaves the system naturally and is non toxic. 

Additionally, a deep sand bed of 3'' minimum, preferably 4'', is very effective at removing any additional Nitrates which remain in the system.

The basic concept of marine aquarium filtration is missing from your aquarium. You are intentionally causing Nitrates to climb, which can only be removed by very large water changes. 

Your future success can be achieved simply by removing the bioballs and purchasing an adequate skimmer. When i have more time tomorrow i will post a few skimmer options for you. It should not be an expensive process.


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

I could be wrong here, but if you're using an overflow with a wet/dry, couldn't it be possible to convert the wet/dry to a sump/refugium with more live rock and and use your skimmer down there?

It looks like your aquarium is very lightly stocked so this might not be essential now, but the extra filtration would likely be beneficial if you end up wanting to stock more fish, inverts and/or coral.

In the meantime though, losing the bioballs and getting a good skimmer will definitely keep those nitrates down.

As for the feeding issue: are you tossing the frozen brine shrimp cubes directly into the water? One cube is more than one clownfish can handle, so you might want to try cutting the cube up and thawing pieces of it in some of your tank water. Thawing the shrimp will be better for your fish but it should also keep it from floating and thus getting sucked into your overflow.


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

iamntbatman said:


> I could be wrong here, but if you're using an overflow with a wet/dry, couldn't it be possible to convert the wet/dry to a sump/refugium with more live rock and and use your skimmer down there?
> 
> It looks like your aquarium is very lightly stocked so this might not be essential now, but the extra filtration would likely be beneficial if you end up wanting to stock more fish, inverts and/or coral.
> 
> In the meantime though, losing the bioballs and getting a good skimmer will definitely keep those nitrates down.


Exactly my thoughts. You have plenty of live rock to filter your aquarium without biomedia. No problem at all. I would like to see you add more depth to your sand bed, to aid in denitrification.

Here are some skimmer ideas, which would work in the sump:

I have no experience with this one, but the design looks functional and the price is great:
http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/240204/product.web

This model is one of the best and would be my choice:
http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/238886/product.web 

Another inexpensive functional skimmer:
http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/236419/product.web

These options can all upgrade to larger aquariums and are very capable of handling a full blown reef if you upgrade in the future.


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## Pasfur (Mar 29, 2008)

Here is an eBay steal on the Berlin model:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Berlin-Protien-...ryZ46313QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

And another:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Red-Sea-Berlin-...ryZ46313QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## CSFishtank546 (Mar 13, 2010)

mikedb1972 said:


> i have added a clown to the tank, and now i am having issues with feeding.
> when i put the feed into the tank, the water circulation is so strong the food is sucked into the sump before he eats its,
> 
> mu question is what everyone does on the feeding issue, do i need to stop the water flow while feeding, i wouldnt think i should. i have two food types, one is the flake food, and the other is a brine shrimp block.
> ...


You should try getting pellet food instead of flakes - this is higher quality and will not get sucked up so easily.


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## teddyzaper (Aug 30, 2009)

you do understand the last post in this article was from 2008 lol


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## PrettyKitty187 (Nov 29, 2007)

if they are the same cubes I'm thinking of my ma holds them underwater until they get squishy then she sticks them to the glass on the side of her tank...they tend not to go anywhere


if anyone from 2008 is interested lol : blush :


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## reefsahoy (Jul 16, 2010)

Pasfur said:


> I am very sorry that you have reached this point in your setup. It is an extreme misfortune that you were not told prior to now that bioballs are a 1980's method of filtration. I do not understand how this is possible, and I sincerely hope it was not this forum that suggested you use biomedia.
> 
> I am going to assume that you have a deep understanding of aquarium chemistry in the following explanation. If you need more details, just ask.
> 
> ...


 
I agree with everything said here except that if you are planning to keep FOWLR and want to "pack" fish in, then the bioballs are ok along with scheduled water changes because nitrate doesn't really bother fish that much, however if you plan on keeping corals you might want to get rid of the bioballs


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

since this is a revived topic from 2008 im going to comment as well for anyone reading along now.

bioballs are great filtration IMO, for FRESHwater. if i was doing a FOWLR i would set it up with the same concept of setting up a reef ( obv. minus the corals and the light stocking of fish ) because fish in the wild never see nitrate levels so high even though they may be able to handle it. its not hard having a 4-6 inch sandbed, enough live rock, and a quality skimmer ( you should have them anyways ) and skip out on any bioballs, filter floss, even jam packing a sump with live rock ( as its basically the same as bio balls )

as for the original poster if they are still around, nice rock work. feeding flakes is like flavored cardboard to me, invest in higher quality foods. brine shrimp doesnt even have much of a nutritional value. ontop of that IMO you should pre-rinse any frozen food prior to adding to the tank as they tend to contribute to phosphate and nitrate problems. its easy to pre-rinse a frozen cube. just put it in an aquarium net, dunk it in a small container of tank or RO water and repeat if needed then feed. this will also thaw out the cube prior to feeding.

i also shut my sump off while feeding along with half of my powerheads.


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## bearwithfish (Sep 29, 2009)

hey i will jump in just to say i also shut down my sump and all of my powerheads


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