# stocking ideas for a 59gal



## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

hello all,
i just got myself a 4ft 59 gal tank and am thinking about adding my 4 angels, 1 clown loach and my 4 bristlenose plecos into it, does anyone have any ideas of what else i can add that wouldnt cause too much chaos? is there any americans i can add? 
any help would greatly appreciate thanks


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> hello all,
> i just got myself a 4ft 59 gal tank and am thinking about adding my 4 angels, 1 clown loach and my 4 bristlenose plecos into it, does anyone have any ideas of what else i can add that wouldnt cause too much chaos? is there any americans i can add?
> any help would greatly appreciate thanks


Hi Joe,

I have a few questions I'd like to ask before giving you any stocking suggestions.

I need to some know water parameters for the water you will be using for the fish tanks.

Do you know your gH or kH? If you don't you can find this information by contacting your local water company or taking a water sample to a Local Fish Store.

What is your pH Level?

What tank do you currently have these fish in right now, how big is it?

Just from what you have given so far, I would say to keep the Clown Loachs in the tank their in right now. They don't necessary go well with Angels because they are active swimmers. Here is some more information on them.

*Compatibility/Temperament:* Peaceful when maintained as a group in larger aquaria with suitably sized non-aggressive fish such as the larger peaceful barbs, danios, rasbora and cichlids; not recommended with angelfish or discus due to their level of activity. Not a fish for the smaller (under 6 feet) home aquarium. A highly social fish, it must be kept in a group of at least five or six; with fewer than this, subordinate fish of the group will be harassed and other fish in the aquarium may be attacked particularly as the fish matures.

Read more: Clown Loach (Chromobotia macracanthus) Profile

You only have one so he is lonely, they like to be in groups of 5-6 at the least. You could consider making them the main fish for your other tank. How big is the other tank?

Also, are your Bristlenoses ever aggresive towards one another? Males tend to be territorial, especially in smaller tanks. There is a lot of information here on the profiles for Bristlenose Pleco. Just click on the Grey name.

----

I would say suitable companions (water parameters permitting) for an Angel fish would be something like a School of Harlequin Rasbora, like 15-25 of them. You could also look into some Cory Catfish. Some species like the Julie and the Pandas would do great. You want all these fish to be in a group of at least 6. They will be healthier and happier this way.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

As Termato said, all stocking plans are pending based on your local water parameters. 

I do have one comment about the clown loach: I know they are commonly sold as a good community fish, but they frankly aren't. They are a large fish that needs large schools to feel comfortable; these guys arne't recommended for tanks shorter than 6 feet long. The good news is there are alternative fish that look like clown loaches but aren't nearly as big. Angelicus loach, yoyo loach, zebra loach, and the Burmese loach all look very similar to the clowns but can easily live in your tank.


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

GH (general hardness): 60mg/L
KH (carbonate hardness): 45 mg/L
pH: 7.5-8 but stays on 7.6 most of the time

2 angels and clown loach came with tanks when i bought them, i bought a 65 liter(with the loach in it) and a 75 liter (angels came with it) tanks, second hand obviously and the owner advised me they hasve been in them tanks for around a year and ive had them for another 4 months on top of that, i know they are too small for them fish and ive bought this 4ft set up hoping to put them in and use my 3 smaller tanks for breeding my mollies, would that be a good idea?


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

and to answer the bristlenose aggression question i have 2 adult females and 2 young ones, the females i put in a tank together n they started fighting but that was in the 75 liter set up i am hoping theyd be ok in a bigger tank? im only keeping the loach is because it came with the tank, yo yo loaches would be proably a better alternative i do agree


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> GH (general hardness): 60mg/L
> KH (carbonate hardness): 45 mg/L
> pH: 7.5-8 but stays on 7.6 most of the time
> 
> 2 angels and clown loach came with tanks when i bought them, i bought a 65 liter(with the loach in it) and a 75 liter (angels came with it) tanks, second hand obviously and the owner advised me they hasve been in them tanks for around a year and ive had them for another 4 months on top of that, i know they are too small for them fish and ive bought this 4ft set up hoping to put them in and use my 3 smaller tanks for breeding my mollies, would that be a good idea?


GH (general hardness): 60mg/L = 60ppm which is about 3-4 dGH very soft water

Read more: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/...s-ph-freshwater-aquarium-73276/#ixzz1zZZbeHkp 

This is good information and in my opinion, great water to work with. You have a low gH and Alkalinity so that is why you see the easily fluctuating pH levels. This shouldn't be a problem.

This water is good for the fish you currently have.

I would not add any more Angels as they might kill or harass the new comers. Usually you want to get them all at the same time, unless you want to get new angels for the bigger tank.



> Good tankmates are non-aggressive catfish, small to medium sized loaches, medium-sized characins such as many of the Hyphessobrycon species such as those in the Rosy Tetra clade, Trigonostigma species of rasbora, Phenacogrammus interruptus (Congo Tetra), Moenkhausia pittieri (Diamond Tetra


Read more: Scalare Angelfish (Pterophyllum scalare) Profile

You could even consider an Amazon biotope with a school of one of the above recommended tetras or rasboras AND a Bolivian Ram (Or a pair of them) with the new or already present angels. Add a species of Cories in there and you have a full Amazon Aquascape.

If you would like to go community style, you could do the Harlequin Rasbora with one of the species of suggested loaches by TheKoiMaiden:



> Angelicus loach, yoyo loach, zebra loach, and the Burmese loach


*Personally I like Discus*, if you want to try them instead of angels. They are beautiful. You could do 2 of them and still do the rest I suggested.

Lots of options.


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> and to answer the bristlenose aggression question i have 2 adult females and 2 young ones, the females i put in a tank together n they started fighting but that was in the 75 liter set up i am hoping theyd be ok in a bigger tank? im only keeping the loach is because it came with the tank, yo yo loaches would be proably a better alternative i do agree


They could be ok, given enough hiding places and real driftwood. They NEED real driftwood. I'm still trying to find more to put in my tanks for both of mine (Their in separate tanks). I had two males in the same 29 gallon tank and they killed on another. Now I only have one per each, but their both males.

Females are not as aggressive so with the new tank you could be fine, in the end you could always take the aggressive one and put it in the 75L you have. Then you would have 3 in the big tank and the aggressive one in the small tank.

You could always try and sell the loache to a good home?


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

yea a mate of mine has discus and they are beautiful fish, but my partner and i have fell in love with angelfish so id love to keep them and work everything around them, i was considering selling the loach but i like it and my partner she loves it and its personality so i most likely will keep it but would not have decided to buy one it just came with tank as i said, ive read up on rams but if u get a pair arent they very territorial? and they need alot of space? id love tio get some but dont want anything else aggressive preferrably as the angels r kinda aggressive as is, thanks heaps for ur help  how can i monitor my GH & KH?


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> yea a mate of mine has discus and they are beautiful fish, but my partner and i have fell in love with angelfish so id love to keep them and work everything around them, i was considering selling the loach but i like it and my partner she loves it and its personality so i most likely will keep it but would not have decided to buy one it just came with tank as i said, ive read up on rams but if u get a pair arent they very territorial? and they need alot of space? id love tio get some but dont want anything else aggressive preferrably as the angels r kinda aggressive as is, thanks heaps for ur help  how can i monitor my GH & KH?


At least the bigger tank will allow the Clown Loach to have more room.

The Rams will get a little aggressive when breeding if anyone comes near their nest. Byron recommends only keeping One Ram or a Pair if you want to deal with it. You could always just go with one and not have to worry about it. When alone and not breeding, they are so peaceful. They will run away from trouble. Very peaceful fish. You can keep a single Bolivian Ram in a 20 gallon tank. The Bolivian Ram will co-exist with angels and discuss.

You can constantly monitor the gH & kH with a test kit. I would only do that if you will be changing your gH and kH. Instead you could monitor your pH which will fluctuate more. Unless you just want to know the numbers, its not necessary to spend the money on the test kit. In the case you do want to get it, API sells a test kit for gH and kH. THey also sell a general test kit for the freshwater aquarium. Both are water based tests which are most accurate than those strips.

Hope this helps. What fish are you looking at right now to put in with the Angels?


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

At least the bigger tank will allow the Clown Loach to have more room.

The Rams will get a little aggressive when breeding if anyone comes near their nest. Byron recommends only keeping One Ram or a Pair if you want to deal with it. You could always just go with one and not have to worry about it. When alone and not breeding, they are so peaceful. They will run away from trouble. Very peaceful fish. You can keep a single Bolivian Ram in a 20 gallon tank. The Bolivian Ram will co-exist with angels and discuss.

You can constantly monitor the gH & kH with a test kit. I would only do that if you will be changing your gH and kH. Instead you could monitor your pH which will fluctuate more. Unless you just want to know the numbers, its not necessary to spend the money on the test kit. In the case you do want to get it, API sells a test kit for gH and kH. THey also sell a general test kit for the freshwater aquarium. Both are water based tests which are most accurate than those strips.

Hope this helps. What fish are you looking at right now to put in with the Angels?
Read more: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/...sh/stocking-ideas-59gal-105931/#ixzz22XmfbDek





oh so you can get a gh kh test kit? would it be recommended i get one? so its differemt from ph kit right?
i took some water into my local fish shop for a test m he says its prestine water for angels and discus as its very soft water.
im not starting my 4ft set up for another week or two yet but i defeintly want my angels in there and loach n maybe my bristlenoses, i wanted more americans but unsure of what i can add that wont be too aggressive as i said, love the rams might opt for one if i can get them ordered in, maybe some schoaling fish? im unsure id love all the help and suggestions i can get! love my cichlids too they are amazing fish, thaniks heaps for your help termato very appreciated
​


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## Tazman (Jan 15, 2012)

The new tank will need to be cycled before ANY fish go into it, you can use some filter media from your current tank to "seed" it with good bacteria. It may risk the fishes health moving them into an uncycled larger tank.

The GH and KH test kit are beneficial but the API Master Kit which contains tests for Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, high and low pH range would be a very very beneficial addition. Test strips provide very inaccurate results. GH and KH measures the hardness or softness of your water and its ability to keep the pH stable. Low GH means you have soft water where as high GH means hard water. KH is important as it shows you how well the tank will keep the pH stable, pH swings can be deadly to fish.


The clown loach may eventually outgrow the tank as they can get to nearly 12". They are also shoaling fish and need a group of at least 5, with this alone it makes the tank overstocked.


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> At least the bigger tank will allow the Clown Loach to have more room.
> 
> oh so you can get a gh kh test kit? would it be recommended i get one? so its differemt from ph kit right?
> i took some water into my local fish shop for a test m he says its prestine water for angels and discus as its very soft water.
> ...


I refer to this thread a lot. Byron wrote this article on Water Hardness and pH in the aquarium. I would Highly Suggest you read this article. It is very informative and it basically says everything I would say right now...but in clearer...better terms haha.

Here you go: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-articles/water-hardness-ph-freshwater-aquarium-73276/

API Sells a test kit for gH and kH: GH & KH Test Kit - API

Their quite inexpensive at $7 but you don't really need it. Good to have though: Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Aquarian Freshwater GH & KH Test Kit

I have the API Master Test Kit which was recommended to me by multiple members on here. It has a liquid test for pH Low, pH High, Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate. All your basic Aquarium needs, I highly recommend you get this one first before getting the gH and kH test kit...if you don't already have it...or a good water based kit. Strips are ok...but not very reliable... You can just wait to get the new kit if you have something reliable already.

Here information on it:
Freshwater Master Test Kit - API

Here is the lowest price I found for $22, I got mine for $31: 
Amazon.com: API SALTWATER MASTER TEST KIT: Pet Supplies

*Local Fish Stores cary them, PetSmart and PetCo; make SURE they are NOT EXPIRED. You want a kit that has a date on it.*

I will give you some more suggestions on stocking tomorrow, South American Amazon Fish are what I love! hahaha. Hopefully other people can give some good suggestions too.

---

Edit: I totally made this post without reading what Tazman wrote because it was on a new page :/ I pretty much said the same things hahahah.


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

i have a ph kit with the ph up & down powder n so on but didnt have the kh and gh, will definetly look out for one of those and will read byrons article a lil later on thanks for the referral, in the link u posted the kit was for saltwater? does that matter?


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> i have a ph kit with the ph up & down powder n so on but didnt have the kh and gh, will definetly look out for one of those and will read byrons article a lil later on thanks for the referral, in the link u posted the kit was for saltwater? does that matter?


Oh wow I did! Yea it does matter. API sells a Freshwater master test kit (the first link). That is the one you want. I'm sorry. Good catch on that.

Is the pH kit you have strips or water based?


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

the kit i have i water based and thats ok hahaha


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

im open to stocking/stocking tips from anyone


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

ok what about yo yo loaches and kissing gouramis? are they compatiable with angelfish and clown loach and bristlenoses??
are they good in a community?


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## Termato (Feb 21, 2012)

Joe1985 said:


> ok what about yo yo loaches and kissing gouramis? are they compatiable with angelfish and clown loach and bristlenoses??
> are they good in a community?


For the YoYo:



> Long-finned upper fish should be avoided to prevent fin nipping; suitable upper fish are barbs, rasbora, danios, characins.
> 
> Read more: Yoyo Loach (Botia almorhae) Profile


Kissing gourami is not a good general community fish.

I know people that have kept Gouramis and Angels, but its not ideal.

That's what the profiles say, I have never kept either fish so I can't really be too much help on those two.


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Joe1985 said:


> ok what about yo yo loaches and kissing gouramis? are they compatiable with angelfish and clown loach and bristlenoses??
> are they good in a community?


Yoyos would be great to keep the clown company, but as Termato said, I don't think they would do well with the angels. I know others have done it, but I wouldn't put a gourami with an angelfish. Best thing with angelfish are more angelfish and small peaceful schooling fish that can't fit in their mouths. Things with a deeper body shape like pristella tetra, flame tetra, bleeding heart tetra, or the head and tail light tetra should coexist peacefully. Angels can have a tendency to eat the torpedo shaped tetra like neons and cardinals.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Nothing much to add to the good advice others have given, except to reiterate that you do not need to waste money on a kit to test GH and KH. Once you know the GH and KH of your tap water, which was mentioned earlier in this thread, it is not going to change in the fish tank unless it is specifically targeted to raise/lower it, and you are not contemplating that, nor do you need to. The pH is worth having a kit for, since it will tend to lower naturally (no issue with these fish) and you want to know how far and be able to detect any sudden changes which can indicate problems.

I wouldn't put loaches with angelfish, some loach species can be fin nippy, and the angelfish long fins are too tempting. This has to be born in mind when selecting any tankmates. Gourami are not good companion fish since they are too much like the angels--territorial. The dominant male angelfish will consider the 55g tank "his," no matter what. Izzy also gave some characin suggestions, check the profiles.

Byron.


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

ahh right right gotcha  very helpful advice ppl thanks again !! 
ill let you all know what i decide


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

oh and in peoples experiences what do they know of paradise fish?? easy to keep? i hear they are very similar to gouramis??


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Joe1985 said:


> oh and in peoples experiences what do they know of paradise fish?? easy to keep? i hear they are very similar to gouramis??


If you click on the shaded name it will opo up the profile, and I think you'll find your question answered.;-)


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## Joe1985 (Mar 28, 2012)

oh yeah haha, says they dont go too well in a community set up? fin nippers? i didnt know that, hmm thats no good


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