# My tank entitled "ROOTS" :)



## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

first of all, i wanna say thank you to those who helped me(i cant name you all, but you know who you guys were), answered my PMs and questions here in the forums regarding tetras, discus, driftwoods and even mango trees!! ive been to fresh, then to marine, then to salt FOWLR, then im back to fresh again.. this is my attempt to create an amazon biotope with no plants set up.. (if i do plan to put plants, il make sure that they are plastic ones) its not yet done, but i know i got the "look" that i want, so all i need now are the fishes 

stocks will include: (not yet final on the number, but will surely get these fishes) suggestions? 
20pcs penguin tetra (currently have 10)
40pcs rummynose
20pcs cardinal
6pcs albino cory (currently have 3) (i know there are better cories out there, but they contrast best on my substrate) 
6pcs platinum angel fish
**will add weekly and depending on what fish is available 


tank specifications:
100gal main tank (in-wall)
black river sand
driftwoods (duh)
(also planning on putting talisay leaves to add amazon effect)
two barrel wavemaker(forgot the specific brand)
t5 lighting (different colors, depending on my mood when im about to sleep)
70gal sump
-10kg+ ceramic rings
-different types of filters
-rio hf 17 return pump

the sump (i've organized this already, this picture was messy, its all in order now lol)









the tank "Roots" (sorry, you can see through my confort room ;p haha!)
normal t5s effect









attempting the biotope color by mixing different lighting effects (also planning on putting talisay leaves to add effect)









playing around with the lights









any comments, suggestions or questions will be answered and appreciated, cant wait for the platinum angels.. again, thank you for all the help 

**also, i dont know if this is on the right forum/thread, so i hope the MODS will move it if its wrong, thanks


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## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

That looks amazing! Will you be adding any type of background to it? I can't wait to see it with vegetation/leaves in there.

Great job :thumbsup:


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Romad said:


> That looks amazing! Will you be adding any type of background to it? I can't wait to see it with vegetation/leaves in there.
> 
> Great job :thumbsup:


no, its made to be see through  cause i wanna look at my tank when i take a dump in the morning ;p haha! the plan is just to place dried leaves on the substrate  any plants will be plastic..  thanks!


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## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

Oh.. ummmmm... errrrrrrrr..... I think I do see a toilet in the background :blush:


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## Chesh (Feb 17, 2012)

I like the setup, can't wait to see it in action. . . um. . . just as long as I don't see anyone on the pot in those shots, lol! Have you considered doing a true blackwater effect, rather than using lighting? I know you can buy blackwater 'tinctures' that will give the water that tea-coloration, along with the added benefits of tannins. Just curious! When are the angels going in? It looks great!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

OMG. Lol


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I would suggest no plastic plants, they will look artificial, but leaving it authentic with just the wood. This is what most of the streams are like in the Amazon. However, I would have floating plants, lots of them. You could cover the surface with Water Sprite, Amazon Frogbit, Brazilian Pennywort. All authentic, and these would handle the water quality issues that live plants do, while keeping the lower aquarium free of plants and authentic. Almost all Amazonian forest fish occur in such habitats. Vegetation is usually confined to overhanging or floating marginal, which is very important. This also helps to further shade the light.

I would caution on the fish combination though. Platinum angels are said to have beeen derived from the gold phenotype, which of course was from the original wild Pterophyllum scalare. They attain 6 inches and will naturally consider linear characins as food. The cardinals and rummys might not fare too well. The disk-shaped characins are better choices.

I do like the aquascape with the wood "branches," very true to Amazonia.

Byron.


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

Love it! I especially like the lighting in the center pic. Can I ask why you have a wavemaker? The fish in your list are calm water fish. 

I just picked up an armload of branchy driftwood at an auction. I'm excited now to add it to my angel tank for a similar look to yours.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Chesherca said:


> I like the setup, can't wait to see it in action. . . um. . . just as long as I don't see anyone on the pot in those shots, lol! Have you considered doing a true blackwater effect, rather than using lighting? I know you can buy blackwater 'tinctures' that will give the water that tea-coloration, along with the added benefits of tannins. Just curious! When are the angels going in? It looks great!


haha! il be posting that on a different website if someone is taking a shower or a poop :shock:
im just waiting for the driftwoods to do its natural course of action  and adding leaves will help too  it will be black water soon! angels will go in after all the tetras have settled in.. im buying all the tetras first, large ones.. and a medium sized angels, so that the tetras wont get easily picked if ever.. thanks!


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I would suggest no plastic plants, they will look artificial, but leaving it authentic with just the wood. This is what most of the streams are like in the Amazon. However, I would have floating plants, lots of them. You could cover the surface with Water Sprite, Amazon Frogbit, Brazilian Pennywort. All authentic, and these would handle the water quality issues that live plants do, while keeping the lower aquarium free of plants and authentic. Almost all Amazonian forest fish occur in such habitats. Vegetation is usually confined to overhanging or floating marginal, which is very important. This also helps to further shade the light.
> 
> I would caution on the fish combination though. Platinum angels are said to have beeen derived from the gold phenotype, which of course was from the original wild Pterophyllum scalare. They attain 6 inches and will naturally consider linear characins as food. The cardinals and rummys might not fare too well. The disk-shaped characins are better choices.
> 
> ...


thanks byron, one of the few people here who helped me a lot on this project! thank you sir!

ok, will think about this, cause i dont want any real plant on my system.. i want my water surface to be as clean as possible.. ive seen some plastic plants that are made of silk? i dont know if you've seen them, but you cant tell the difference between palstic and the real ones! they are looking so real.. will read more about this. thanks!

about the platinum angelfish, what other fish other than the discus woiuld you recommend? ive seen tanks with this community that live well, that's why im giving it a shot, if it fails i can easily transfer them to my other tank and choose other fishes


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

jeaninel said:


> Love it! I especially like the lighting in the center pic. Can I ask why you have a wavemaker? The fish in your list are calm water fish.
> 
> I just picked up an armload of branchy driftwood at an auction. I'm excited now to add it to my angel tank for a similar look to yours.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


the wave maker helps me a lot, it is added for the driftwoods.. in time it will have molds(not sure if you call them molds, lol) in them that you have to remove.. keeping a minimal current will avoid that from happening, and plus its good for their exercise, lol! there's some dead spot on the tank, they can easily rest there.. and lastly, wavemaker can place the leftover foods on specific sides of the tank, this way i can easily spot clean any leftover food 

nice!! please post it as soon as your done, i love to see how it will turn out


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I'm not grasping the issue with plants and the surface. I can assure you, aside from water changes nothing performs more benefit in any fish tank than live plants, and having them on the surface achieves this fastest as well as providing the necessary shade these fish expect.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I'm not grasping the issue with plants and the surface. I can assure you, aside from water changes nothing performs more benefit in any fish tank than live plants, and having them on the surface achieves this fastest as well as providing the necessary shade these fish expect.


what kind of free floating plants can i put?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> what kind of free floating plants can i put?


I mentioned these previously, but to repeat, Amazon Frogbit, Brazilian Pennywort and Water Sprite.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I mentioned these previously, but to repeat, Amazon Frogbit, Brazilian Pennywort and Water Sprite.


will get hose soon, thanks!


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I mentioned these previously, but to repeat, Amazon Frogbit, Brazilian Pennywort and Water Sprite.


hey byron! how about these " red line torpedo barb " / " deniso barb " , can they fit well in my tank? they grow 6inches and they are not at all aggressive, il get maybe 4-6pcs  since discus and angelfish are out of the options, will these work?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> hey byron! how about these " red line torpedo barb " / " deniso barb " , can they fit well in my tank? they grow 6inches and they are not at all aggressive, il get maybe 4-6pcs  since discus and angelfish are out of the options, will these work?


A beautiful fish, but not compatible on a couple of scores, if you retain the earlier fish mentioned (rummys, cardinals). The Denisons Barb requires more water flow that these tetra would appreciate, and cooler temperatures. And they may eat smaller fish, and to a 6-inch barb a 1 inch tetra is a small fish. Check our profile.

Just to throw out one option, this is a tank suited to the medium gourami that are too large for small tanks. As long as you get the floating plants, especially Water Sprite, gourami would be fine. Now, you have to be careful on species; the Blue Gourami will eat linear tetra, I watched 2 of them corner and devour a neon in a store tank once, then they stalked another tetra. The Pearl Gourami would be lovely. Just one suggestion.

Byron.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> A beautiful fish, but not compatible on a couple of scores, if you retain the earlier fish mentioned (rummys, cardinals). The Denisons Barb requires more water flow that these tetra would appreciate, and cooler temperatures. And they may eat smaller fish, and to a 6-inch barb a 1 inch tetra is a small fish. Check our profile.
> 
> Just to throw out one option, this is a tank suited to the medium gourami that are too large for small tanks. As long as you get the floating plants, especially Water Sprite, gourami would be fine. Now, you have to be careful on species; the Blue Gourami will eat linear tetra, I watched 2 of them corner and devour a neon in a store tank once, then they stalked another tetra. The Pearl Gourami would be lovely. Just one suggestion.
> 
> Byron.


oh bummer  i thought they can be a great addition to my tetras.. i saw the profile, but it is written that they are peaceful fishes.. ans schools as well.. my rummies and penguins love the wavemaker that i have.. 

so they are my only option? the pearl gourami? and no other gourami? can you suggest more fish and hopefully they are available here in our LFS..

how about the betta fish? the halfmoon betta looks very nice and ive read posts like betta living in a community tank, what's your stand on this sir byron? 

about the plants sir byron, can duckweed work?  that's the most common in our country.. i can give them a try.. we also are very local of talisay leaf( i think its the same as the indian almond leaves.. can i toss a lot of them to make a better water quality for my tank?


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

sir byron, what if i get the denison barb at an early change, maybe 1.5 inchers? by the time they grow about 4-5inches, my cardinals, rummies and penguins will be around 1.5-2inches  wont this work?  i kinds love the way they grow big and school 

blue gourami is highly available in our LFS.. but the peral gourami isnt..


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## Pearl2011 (May 21, 2012)

I'm going to use duckweed in my amazonian bio-type,since I sorta killed my amazon frogbit.
I LOVEEE the branches, its so natural. Makes me want to change the blue/green gravel out of my ten gallon even more


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Pearl2011 said:


> I'm going to use duckweed in my amazonian bio-type,since I sorta killed my amazon frogbit.
> I LOVEEE the branches, its so natural. Makes me want to change the blue/green gravel out of my ten gallon even more


thanks!  does the duckweed have the same benefits as the frogbit? im in it for the sahde and benefits


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> thanks!  does the duckweed have the same benefits as the frogbit? im in it for the sahde and benefits


Yes and no. Duckweed is a tiny floating plant [check the profile] that does not shade all that much light, being so thin. It is very fast at reproducing which obviously assimilates a lot of nutrients/organics.

The more robust floating plants, of which Water Sprite is far and away the best, add more shade, more water stability, and look nicer with their mass of dangling roots which fish absolutely love.

Frogbit is very similar, though not so easy to grow. Dwarf Water Lettuce is another. The stem plant Brazilian Pennywort comes close to Water Sprite. Salvinia is nice, but again less "depth."

Byron.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

updated pictures october 20, 2012

already added 40pcs rummynose (their nose are very red, so i guess im in good shape)
2 pcs otocinclus 
added 2 more albino cories

**scrapped the idea of discus(maintenance issue) and angelfish(aggressive issue)
**opting to go for 4-5pcs pearl gouramis or 5-6pcs red line torpedo barb / deniso barb

my tank's all brown (and i like it very much )
all water parameters are great

been playing around with lots of designs, so medyo chopsuey ang itsura nito 
here you can ive tried adding talisay leaves, kiapo (water cabbage) on top and some hornworts plant (since they require lease amount of light)
- wanted to put kiapo for nitrate absorption, but its an eye sore so far, so what im thinking is adding a light below my sump and placing the water cabbage's their. this way i wont get the eyesore on my main tank, and they will keep my nitrates down.
- the talisay can help stabilize the pH and so far i kinda like how it looks, plus it can be a future home for my shrimps
- the hornworts are just a trial if my tank will look good, and sure it will help cause they are plants ;p



















what can i use to pin down the talisay leaves that's aesthetically nice? :| i dont wanna use rock just to pin it down :| im thinking of sewing the together in train like manner, this way i can just worry pinning down two sides rather than per leaf...? your thoughts? TIA


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> Yes and no. Duckweed is a tiny floating plant [check the profile] that does not shade all that much light, being so thin. It is very fast at reproducing which obviously assimilates a lot of nutrients/organics.
> 
> The more robust floating plants, of which Water Sprite is far and away the best, add more shade, more water stability, and look nicer with their mass of dangling roots which fish absolutely love.
> 
> ...


the roots dangling down is an eyesore for me byron  i dont think i can opt for any floating plants.. im planning on making a light and support the plants on my sump below.. this way i can benefit from its nitrate absorption and some other helpful stuffs.. im thinking if just adding plants that require the LEAST amount of lighting required.. or if i just wanna add shade, i can just cut styro foams and place them on my water surface.. :\ 

those plants that you mentioned are not available in our LFS as well..


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

ultimate bad news... i called home 1030pm at night and asked our helper to turn on the lights.. i cant be home, im outside drinking.. my mom called saying that my main tank water is HALF EMPTY... T___T long story short, i think my main 100gal tank had a leak or broke something on the bottom.. the water is all drained now.. its a mess.. all the fishes are inside my sump and im running an aerator right now.. this is very depressing.. i cant express how i feel.. this is really sad.. i feel like quitting already.. i was just watching it last night and admiring my accomplishment, and in just an instant, its all gone right now... after investing for a long term tank that will operate in 3-4years, it just got broke... really depressing... ((((((((((((((


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

@byron
how many pearl gouramis can i place in my aquarium?


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## rjordan390 (Feb 18, 2012)

"Your putting the cart in front of the horse." Don't worry about adding fish!

The issue now is to find how the tank or sump leaked. Did you observe any water on the edge or sides of the stand? This would indicate a leak from the tank. If there was no water on the edge or sides, then either the sump leaked or there was a electrical power interruption that allowed water to syphon back through the discharge pipe to the pump and then into the sump causing it to overflow.
The deeper you have the discharge, then thats how much water will empty into your sump.

When I was part of a reef forum on "Compuserve" , most of us, if not all, would mark the pipe at the water line and then remove the pipe and drill a 3/16 or 1/4 inch hole 1 inch below that mark. Then when performing weekly maintenance, would check the hole to be sure it was not getting clogged.
This is called a syphon break.
So when a future power failure occurs; only 1 inch of water would syphon back to the sump.
let us know what you find.
Some fishkeepers may have installed a check valve to prevent a syphon. The problem with them is: they will accumulate solids over time and not seal completly.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

im sorry, but i forgot to post this.. i was suppose to post this before i asked what fish to add...

as you all know the bottom glass of my previous tank broke.. 

its up and running again on october 26, i made a brand new tank.. now with a 1/2 thick glass for bottom.. hopefully it wont break this time.. cant make the exact arrangement if the woods like i wanted to, but i did what i can..

first attempt:









current attempt:

























i kept 50% of the original water, kept it aerated.. so its like i made a 50% water change.. used API quick start for a day before i added the fishes.. ive lost about 20% of my stock, luckily i didn't lose all.. i plan on adding the cardinals in probably a week.. 

thanks for looking


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

I hope all is back to normal. You asked about Pearl Gourami numbers earlier. If you read the profile, it mentions that this fish occurs in plant-thick waters and females need plenty of hiding spots. If you are not intending floating plants, I would not go with this fish.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I hope all is back to normal. You asked about Pearl Gourami numbers earlier. If you read the profile, it mentions that this fish occurs in plant-thick waters and females need plenty of hiding spots. If you are not intending floating plants, I would not go with this fish.


i think im going for cabomba or hornwort plants, il just make them float.. if ever i get water sprite, how many pearl gouramis can i go for?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> i think im going for cabomba or hornwort plants, il just make them float.. if ever i get water sprite, how many pearl gouramis can i go for?


Always more females than males, so the male's attention to females will be spread out. And males are territorial, so in a 6-foot tank I would say 3 is minimum (with 2 you could likely have continual back-and-forth) so 4 or 5 males would be better, with more females than males.

Byron.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> Always more females than males, so the male's attention to females will be spread out. And males are territorial, so in a 6-foot tank I would say 3 is minimum (with 2 you could likely have continual back-and-forth) so 4 or 5 males would be better, with more females than males.
> 
> Byron.


4-5 males? isnt that too much, im aiming for just 6pcs.. :| how many pearl gouramis are you suggesting that il get total?

can you give me any more suggestion that i can add if I WONT ADD the pearl gouramis? you said that the denisoni barb doesn't fit my tank, other than the pearl gourami, can you still think of any ?  thanks! highly appreciate all your help byron..


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> 4-5 males? isnt that too much, im aiming for just 6pcs.. :| how many pearl gouramis are you suggesting that il get total?
> 
> can you give me any more suggestion that i can add if I WONT ADD the pearl gouramis? you said that the denisoni barb doesn't fit my tank, other than the pearl gourami, can you still think of any ?  thanks! highly appreciate all your help byron..


You asked how many without specifying an upper limit, so that is what I gave you. And I was assuming this to be a 6-foot tank...just checked back and it is 100g so perhaps it is a 5-foot? Whichever, if you want the PG then 2 males and 4 females. Or 3 males and five females.

The Denisons Barb would work in a 5 or 6-foot tank. Previously it was probably mentioned along with the gourami (or angels?), that won't work. But a group of 8 DB is fine. Select other upper fish with care as they need to be large enough not to be eaten. If it were me, I would probably have 8-9 DB, and some substrate fish (some of the peaceful medium-sized loaches come to mind). But if you want loaches, I would get more wood :lol: because some bottom chunks with tunnels are needed for loaches, they like a "home".


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> You asked how many without specifying an upper limit, so that is what I gave you. And I was assuming this to be a 6-foot tank...just checked back and it is 100g so perhaps it is a 5-foot? Whichever, if you want the PG then 2 males and 4 females. Or 3 males and five females.
> 
> The Denisons Barb would work in a 5 or 6-foot tank. Previously it was probably mentioned along with the gourami (or angels?), that won't work. But a group of 8 DB is fine. Select other upper fish with care as they need to be large enough not to be eaten. If it were me, I would probably have 8-9 DB, and some substrate fish (some of the peaceful medium-sized loaches come to mind). But if you want loaches, I would get more wood :lol: because some bottom chunks with tunnels are needed for loaches, they like a "home".


its a 6ft tank  its 6ftx 18" x 18"..  2 males and 4females, that sounds good 

denisons barb would work?? oh men, now this will keep me thinking again ;p so its either 8 db, or 6 gouramis? hmmmmm, gotta go to the local fish store ;p 

if ever il add loaches, what loaches can you suggest that wont grow that big..? maybe just around the size of a albino cory that i have.. i can maybe get 2 additional loaches for bottom feeders 

** i will only choose one group of medium sized fish.. 
right now i only have:
35pcs rummynose,
6pcs penguin tetra,
5pcs albino cory,
2 oto catfish,
(will add 20pcs cardinal soon) 
around 10pcs red cherry shrimps


..so im thinking about going for gourami or denisons barb.. my albino corydoras are fine for me, i dont want other bottom dwellers, im limiting my species into 5 to obtain a minimalist look(not including the oto and the shrimps to species count, lol).. i want it to be as minimalist as possible..


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> its a 6ft tank  its 6ftx 18" x 18"..  2 males and 4females, that sounds good
> 
> denisons barb would work?? oh men, now this will keep me thinking again ;p so its either 8 db, or 6 gouramis? hmmmmm, gotta go to the local fish store ;p
> 
> ...


I think one problem in this thread is that we are jumping around from fish to fish, mixing and not mixing species, etc.

You asked about Denisons Barb and I said a group of 8 would fit your tank. But not with some of the other fish mentioned. DB will easily eat or attempt to eat smaller fish--cardinals, rummys, etc. And probably the shrimp too. Read the profiles of the species, please, it is all there.

There are several loaches in our profiles. The two smallest are the Dwarf Loach and the Banded dwarf loach. Next up there are some that remain around the 4 or 5 inch mark, like the Zebra Loach, Angelica Loach, and a couple others. But check the respective profiles, some will fin nip, some less likely.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> I think one problem in this thread is that we are jumping around from fish to fish, mixing and not mixing species, etc.
> 
> You asked about Denisons Barb and I said a group of 8 would fit your tank. But not with some of the other fish mentioned. DB will easily eat or attempt to eat smaller fish--cardinals, rummys, etc. And probably the shrimp too. Read the profiles of the species, please, it is all there.
> 
> There are several loaches in our profiles. The two smallest are the Dwarf Loach and the Banded dwarf loach. Next up there are some that remain around the 4 or 5 inch mark, like the Zebra Loach, Angelica Loach, and a couple others. But check the respective profiles, some will fin nip, some less likely.


ooohhhh.... ok ok.. sorry about the confusion sir byron..  but with the fishes mentioned above, will the pearl gourami work? 2males 4females? that's why i got confused too, im sorry.. cause you said it once that it wont work.. 

will check upon the loaches, il add maybe 2pcs  thanks!


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Maestro08 said:


> ooohhhh.... ok ok.. sorry about the confusion sir byron..  but with the fishes mentioned above, will the pearl gourami work? 2males 4females? that's why i got confused too, im sorry.. cause you said it once that it wont work..
> 
> will check upon the loaches, il add maybe 2pcs  thanks!


If by "fishes mentioned above" you mean the rummys, penguin tetra, cardinals, corys, oto...yes the pearls will work.

If you do consider loaches, carefully read the profiles to avoid those that might nip fins, as the gourami is a prime target for nippers. This applies to some other tetra too, like the Serpae or Black Widow, just so you know if you consider more tetra species...always check the profiles.


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

Byron said:


> If by "fishes mentioned above" you mean the rummys, penguin tetra, cardinals, corys, oto...yes the pearls will work.
> 
> If you do consider loaches, carefully read the profiles to avoid those that might nip fins, as the gourami is a prime target for nippers. This applies to some other tetra too, like the Serpae or Black Widow, just so you know if you consider more tetra species...always check the profiles.


ok byron, thanks a lot, will get the pearls for sure  il choose a loach that is not aggressive  thanks!


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## Maestro08 (Sep 28, 2012)

added some plants, still haven't bought any additional fishes.. they are either sick or out of stock on the market..  so i just tried adding some plants and hopefully my amazon biotope look will still work.. im still deciding if il keep them or not.. so far im loving the java moss in front! hope it'll thrive! hopefully i can buy cardinals and pearl gouramis next week if the fish store has stocks.. 

FTS









middle java moss









right side









left side


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