# Parrot Fish & Glo fish etc



## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Hey y'all...

what do you think about fish like the parrot fish or the glow fish (or any 'man made' fish for that matter)?

Do you have them? Are you ok with man made fish or do you think that's totally wrong?

Just wanna understand what people think about them really, discussions welcome, but keep it civil ;-)


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I don't care for them, wouldn't keep them and don't understand the attraction. Mother nature does such a better job!


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

i think it is a matter of personal choice regarding "man made" fish. The one major down side, IMO, is that when people mess with nature in those regards you get animals that dont live as long and have more health problems. i personally have contemplated the neon glofish for my sons tank in his room. The process they go through, from what i read in another thread, is slightly different then some others. I have seen fish at a local pet store here called Pet Supply Plus that have these platies with hearts, balloons and peace signs ect. that are seeminly tatooed on them and i would NEVER contemplate these guys. But each to their own....everyone has their opinion on this matter and if you see a fish you like and your set up will support their needs then go for it....just be prepared for for short livings and health problems. 

ps....i could be wrong about life span and such this is just what i have heard/read through some research....


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

molliefan09;274183 have these platies with hearts said:


> Are you serious??? :shock:


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Yep, one of the LFS in my area has them. :-(


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Ok apparently a LOT has happened since I last went fish shopping (which really dates a few yrs back) I did catch the introduction of parrot fish in store, recently seen the glo fish (modified Danio's)....now apperently we also tattoo fish...ok, need to let that idea settle for a moment...

What other 'creations' did we (humans) come up with over the past year in the fish world?


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

So far, the tattoo fish is the worst I have seen. Looks like 3 year olds painted hearts, tiger stripes, and other goofy designs on poor mollies. Turning beautiful fish, ugly.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Twistersmom said:


> Looks like 3 year olds painted


...cause that's prop exactly who done this overseas....:roll:

Doesn't that disable the fish thou? I mean a normal human tattoo goes way down into another layer of your skin, now obviously you can't get that far in to a fish but its pretty much got to be burning of their scales right, doesn't that disable them in the day to day life?

What a world....


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

the fish at the store that i saw that were tatooed seemed to be getting around ok, i did not observe them very long as i was slightly disgusted as to how someone would do that...BUT i suppose some like that sort of thing....they even had some for the football lovers with their choice of team logo.......


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

I read up on the "tattoo art" at one time, they claimed it was done by laser and does not harm the fish in anyway. Still tacky, if you ask me.


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

im sorry, and not to give out personal info, but have any of you had laser treatments done before?!?!?! that procedure hurts!!!!


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## Mikaila31 (Dec 18, 2008)

Really depends what you are talking about here. The unaltered hybird parrot fish and the GM glofish or the process of dyeing/tattooing fish. 

As far as coloring fish, it is done a few ways mainly using lasers or needles. It is a cruel process on the fish usually resulting in a high mortality rate. 

The topic of hybrid fish really depends on personal opinion. I don't care for the parrot fish appearance wise. Other than that in my book there is nothing wrong with keeping them as long as they are not dyed. If kept properly they live long and healthy lives. However since the parrot fish receives the majority of dying/tattoing/tail cropping I feel this specific hybrid should be avoided. I do have a pet-peeve with hybrids though. We've been dealing w/ hybrids like endler/guppy and rainbowfish hybrids. Its hard to determine this. Endler/guppy hybrids could be bred a few generations and sold as a strain of pure endlers. They will look like it, but genetically they are not. Its the same with rainbowfish. These hybrids genes can sometimes work there way into pure strains.

Man-made fish in my book is any fish produced through human selection. All "common" tank strain livebearers fall into this category. Gold fish especially fancies, fancy bettas, a number of color morphs of angles, discus, cichlids, albino tank strains, balloon strains, ect.... The list could go on and on. Only things that are not man-made IMO are fish that are in the trade and look exactly the same as they do in the wild. Now if you sort through them I bet most chain stores carry more man-made fish than natural fish. 

Genetically Modified fish. I have no ethical issues with these fish. I honestly think they are a good thing for the hobby. I mean why dye fish, when you can genetically alter them so they glow. A glofish is created by taking the GFP(green florescent protein) found in jellyfish and inserting it into the zebra dainos genome. This is done waayyy before hand, to the egg of the fish. It produces fun little fish that glow under UV light. Originally they were designed to test for pollution. The GFP was only activated when the fish came in contact with specific pollutants, making the fish glow. They were used around powerplants. The ones you see in stores, just have had the gene set so it is always expressed. Glofish breed true as well, so their offspring will glow just as much.

The use of the GFP is very common in cell and microbiology. The guy who discovered it actually won the Nobel peace prize. We have used it to learn a LOT of new things. Two weeks ago I made some bacteria glow green in my cell biology lab by introducing the GFP, was actually kinda boring I wish I could of made something more interesting glow green. Usually the GFP is linked to another protein you are testing, this way if the test protein is being expressed by the cell it will also glow green. Its fun stuff IMO, usually done on the cellular/microorganism level, but we have made, cats, mice, monkeys, Axolotl, rabbits, insects, and many other things glow green. 

Oddly my cell biology professor's research is studying heart defects in zebra daino embryos that are caused by exposer to chemicals. I could intern under him and kill helpless unborn zebra dainos a couple days a week by slowly inducing heart failure! Ahhh...those unexpected collage opportunities :-D.


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## willow (Sep 9, 2006)

i don't personally care for things like this,nor do i agree with it in other animals,
leave nature alone,she's done a great job so far.
human pleasure is questionable sometimes,don't you think. ?


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

*@Mikaila31*
There may be different parrots to the 1's I seen few times (so forgive me if the statement is incorrect) but the Parrots I have seen where definitely colored cause that is neither hybrid nor remotely close to any natural freshwater fish coloring I know of..They more reminded me of my text markers at work....

_" They will look like it, but genetically they are not. Its the same with rainbowfish. These hybrids genes can sometimes work there way into pure strains." _
That is a very good point you're making there...so then what if we'll find up (over time obviously) that are cross breed's only!?

Another worry of mine is folks buying these fish, realizing they don't like it any more after 6 mos and release them into the Rivers & pond locally.

So you make no difference between fish litterly created in the lab (eg. Glo fish) vs fish that are bred over generations only with 1 color (eg. cichlids)?
Where I feel torn apart, creating a certain type of fish for scientific reasoning is one thing, to mass produce this fish later on for fancy home entertainment is another level IMO.

And YES unfortunately you're VERY right all these fish you named is what I can find here, spc fancy goldfish & guppy & betta...however me not wanting these fish creates a problem.

*@Willow* you may or may not have seen my tanks set up's, so yes I am right there with you, natural no tons chemical added, no plastic plants fish tank and no Lab mass-production fish in my tank neither, just keeping it natural.

_"human pleasure is questionable sometimes,don't you think. ? _" I think THAT goes for just about ANYTHING out there not just fish ;-)


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

You know, this is a very touchy subject to most people. being in my line of work i see it all the time with dogs such as the labradoodle, golden doodle, pugle......all these pets that were created for certain qualities and really are nothing but mutts (my personal favortie kind of dog).....but again, it is a persons personal choice. i have seen the parrot fish and i actually like them, however until this thread i did not know they were "man made". I told my boyfriend that when we got another tank i would like to think about getting some. I would have, however, researched them before purchasing them but i honestly dont know if i will change my mind due to the fact that they are man made.....i would have to learn about the "making" process before i made a decision....i dont want to support anything that is cruel, IMO, like the dying or tattooing but if it is man made by breeding certain fish and will work with my water....i may still concider it...




i am speaking of the blood parrot cichlid not the saltwater form of a parrot fish...


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Absolutely, this is TOTALLY everybody's choice and obviously there's plenty people out there that want to have these fish cause if there was no demand for it, they'd not sell them (and they're fairly pricey what I've seen).
Me personally I don't want to support it. I do agree in line of science that this kind of work is at times necessary, but I do not agree with some type 'mass production' for the homy eye, that's where I differ this matter.

You know like my dogs, I have 2, they're not man made, but they're cross breeds aka Mutts, just kinda like a black molly falling in love with a white molly and have spotted babies, that's something that naturally happened and is ok IMO, but i'd not have my dogs if they were some lab result at best with a exchangeable micro chip inside of them for training and coloration...


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

PS I don't wanna step on no toes or nothing like this, like I said from the start, I just want a open discussion about this here and people's opinions, that's all.


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

no, i completely agree with you!! lab made is much different then just breeding to get certain qualities......i would not personally spend excessive money on a mutt whether it be furry, feathery or fishy......now knowing that they are infact hybrids, i probably not get them due to the fact that they are more costly then your average cichlid. just as an example....i could get good quality labrador for approx $800 and a good quality standard poodle for approx. $1000.....i would not spend $1500 for a lab/poodle (labradoodle)....

i think thus far this thread has not really caused any issues...most people are not only stating their personal view on things, but also facts that have researched. Like i said in a previous post....were this thread notposted i would not have known the blood parrot cichlids were hybrid until my later research....


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

See that's how I learned about tattoo fish....And as someone said further up, apart from all other facts, what also would disturb me is spent quite some $ on a engineered fish who's then not winding up living very long. 

If you have the water for it (mine is unfortunately way too soft) you may like these here Caeruleus (Labidochromis caeruleus) - Seriously Fish
I had a group in a 55g tank and its been one of the most enjoyable fish I ever had to watch (no one else lived in that tank thou and you need some serious hardy plants, only thing for me that worked in the tank was Hygrophilia).

Yea or you go to our local animal shelter and get a pure bred Lab for an adoption fee of some $60-70....and do something good while you're at it (all my babies are adopted).


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

i have a boston terrier, 2 mini dach (weaner dog), 2 pitbulls, and a shep mix......all are either found strays or rescues (i work at an animal hospital)...i was just talking from fish perspectives.....


that is the "yellow lab"right?? i was actually just doing some research for my next tank which i am hoping will be an african cichlid tank and i was looking at the ones from lake malawi or victoria since they seem like they would fair well with my pH


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Urg tell me about stray's, apparently out on our country Rd is THE drop off for unwanted city dogs and there's been more stray's here since we moved here in March then I EVER met before in my life even at a shelter, its horrible and we can't keep them all its breaking my heart...

Yup that's yellow lab and they get a nice good size too, I'd buy some again in a heartbeat, but since I had such hard water before the move for all my 6 tanks, I wanna take advantage of the softies now and house these for the first time.
What size tank are you wanting to set up next?


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

i was thinking 50gal...i started a thread over in the cichlid section....from what i have read about the mnubas (SP???) they rec. OVERstocking the tank?!?!


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## Mikaila31 (Dec 18, 2008)

> There may be different parrots to the 1's I seen few times (so forgive me if the statement is incorrect) but the Parrots I have seen where definitely colored cause that is neither hybrid nor remotely close to any natural freshwater fish coloring I know of..They more reminded me of my text markers at work....


The (blood) parrot cichlid, it a hybrid. I'm not sure exactly what you say as there is another parrot cichlid that is a naturally occurring fish Hybrid parrots can vary in appearance greatly. Undyed parrots are usually a light peachy color. Here is a link that helps explain them. Most all are sterile do to being hybrids. You have dyed parrots, tattooed parrots, heart parrots(their tails are cropped). Undyed fish can vary greatly too, this is due to being hybrids. Pic  



> _" They will look like it, but genetically they are not. Its the same with rainbowfish. These hybrids genes can sometimes work there way into pure strains." _
> That is a very good point you're making there...so then what if we'll find up (over time obviously) that are cross breed's only!?


 Thats why wild fish will always be in demand.




> So you make no difference between fish litterly created in the lab (eg. Glo fish) vs fish that are bred over generations only with 1 color (eg. cichlids)?
> Where I feel torn apart, creating a certain type of fish for scientific reasoning is one thing, to mass produce this fish later on for fancy home entertainment is another level IMO.


 I see a difference between them. I mean no matter how long we selectively bred we could never make a glofish. They along with other lab creations are in a separate group from selectively bred fish, but both in my eyes are man made fish. I see no problem with mass production of glofish for pets. The fish does not suffer from the process and with live just as long as a normal zebra daino. Selective breeding on the other hand can result in genetic diseases and other things. The Great Dane for example has a very short lifespan for a dog. Overall, I guess you could say I find selective breeding amusing. I mean as far as what people consider OK vs a mutation. Majority of us don't have issues with fancy goldies, but I often see people refer to balloon mollies and rams as mutated fish. 

We have the Munchkin cat, which is a "breed" of cat that suffers from a genetic mutation called achondroplasia which causes short legs. It is not prone to other diseases or a short life. However its not widely recognized as a breed do to the fact that it is suffering a "mutation". Why this amuses me is the organizations that don't recognize it, recognize other cats like the cornish rex as breeds. What makes one any worse than the other? The munchkin cat probably can't run as fast or leap as far as a tabby cat, on the other hand I can't throw a cornish rex outside into WI winter like I can with my tabbys. 

I keep very very few man-made fish. I prefer the appearance of wilds, however I don't have any issues with man-made fish.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Very good post!

I'd kinda be curious to have someone talk here that houses these fish (and maybe even only these fish)


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

i have a fish that i thought was a blood parrot when i bought it, but it seems to look like some sort of convict/blood parrot/texas cichild mix. its a very strange looking fish lol


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## Hawkian (Oct 29, 2009)

OK so getting back to the original question, I'm with Kymmie... I don't care for the man made fish and believe that mother nature does a much better job alone. Most painted fish look unnatural to me. As for the tattooed fish... never saw one and I hope I never do...


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

man made fish arent all bad though. even though most of them are butt ugly they still have great personalities. my parrot or whatever it may be always greets me when i walk up to the tank and is very exciting. as for dying and tatooing fish i am completly against that. species could possibly crossbreed in the wild but they would never be dyed or tattoed. thats just plain wrong.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

doze7 said:


> i have a fish that i thought was a blood parrot when i bought it, but it seems to look like some sort of convict/blood parrot/texas cichild mix. its a very strange looking fish lol


:lol: That sounds interesting, can we see a picture???


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

sure, here you go. its 3 months old and 2.5 inches long.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Well it has the development of the 'normal parrot' if you look at the face. Now I say up front I have little knowledge about the parrots, but I thought the 'pure lab' parrots always were fancy colors, kinda like text marker assorted colors?


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## Mikaila31 (Dec 18, 2008)

I would call it a parrot. A couple different cichlids can be crossed to make parrots. This is why they can vary so much in appearance. I would agree yours looks like it was a convict cross with something else.


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

i think you may be right, as he is devolping a violet sheen around the yellow on his gills. i just thought he looked really different fron the rest of the parrots by the way his fins are shaped at the front and the blue specks on his scales which are hard to see in the picture.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Just to sorta steer back to the OP question...Would you breed your parrot if you could? Just curious...


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

even though i think my fish is very cool and unique looking i would not breed it. but only because of the fact that parrots are lab fish. if it was a convict/texas hybrid that was naturally bred i would breed the fish, but considering this is not a natural fish i woukd not breed it.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Good point! Glad to hear you think that way to be honest with you


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

I was recently given a parrot fish. This is not a fish I would ever think of buying as I have never cared for the look of them. But I have a soft spot for all animals. My son called me and asked me if I wanted this fish. I reluctantly said I would come take a look at him. The guy had this fish bagged up and ready to take to the LFS. I couldn't stand the thought of him having to live in a too small tank at the LFS for who knows how long before someone bought him. He's full grown at about 7" and I was told he's 5 years old. The owner had kept him in a 25 gallon tank. So I brought him home and put him in one of my 55's. As homely as I think he is he has grown on me. He has a sweet personality and is very mild tempered. 

As for dying/tatooing of fish, I think this is a disgusting practice that should be banned.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Jeanine to the fish rescue :-D Just PM me your phone # so next time we have stray out here again I know where to turn to others then myself for a change :-D

Do you have any tank mates with him or is it just him in the 55g?


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Jeaninel, how very sweet of you to rescue the poor guy. Kudos to you! How great that he ended up being an agreeable fish. My dental office keeps a parrot in a tank with some kribs and the parrot harasses the kribs endlessly. It always bugs me to watch it so I'm never early for my dental appointments...


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

Angel079 said:


> Do you have any tank mates with him or is it just him in the 55g?


He's in my bedroom tank with some other fish (Firemouth, young JD, tiger barbs). So far everyone is getting along fine. I'm a little concerned about the JD once it gets bigger but right now everyone gets along fine. I may move him (the parrot) into the community 55 in my living room if any problems develop. He's like a big, gentle giant. Maybe I'll call him Ben (I say "he" but not sure if it's male or female).


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

jeaninel said:


> He's in my bedroom tank with some other fish (Firemouth, young JD, tiger barbs). So far everyone is getting along fine. I'm a little concerned about the JD once it gets bigger but right now everyone gets along fine. I may move him (the parrot) into the community 55 in my living room if any problems develop. He's like a big, gentle giant. Maybe I'll call him Ben (I say "he" but not sure if it's male or female).


Ah just look at the impression on the face...that's a guy :-D


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

jeaninel said:


> As for dying/tatooing of fish, I think this is a disgusting practice that should be banned.


I completley agree with you on this. I think that there should be regulations placed on these acts and that fish stores should be checked for these kinds of fish.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

I actually recently seen them for the first time myself...HORRIBLEEEEEE


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## doze7 (Dec 1, 2009)

really ? i hve yet to see this fish. hope i never do. did the fish seem ok ?


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

First I heard about them was actually on here...then a few days ago when I got my Rummy's I seen something 'odd' from the corner my eye and looked closer and they had like hearts and what not tattooed on them, but in a style like a toddler would draw. It was all the lil white balloon mollies. I guess they seemed ok'ish but I"d NEVER get such fish and support such cruel ideas with my purchases, just not my world sorry, to me these are the same category then the glo in the dark Danios....that is just not natural....


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## Zeetrain (Oct 13, 2009)

I found this info on the Glo-Fish and also this GloFish - The Free Freshwater and Saltwater Aquarium Encyclopedia Anyone Can Edit - The Aquarium Wiki. Its pretty much what has been said already, but I thought it might be useful.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Thanks for adding this Article...

Learn something new...they already been existing for 15+ yrs now, who'd have thought that, I sure didn't know that.


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## molliefan09 (Sep 21, 2009)

i went to a new LFS the other day and another customer was in there asking about the glofish and the process they go through to get those colors and the guy told them that it was a naturally aoccuring process...that these colorations are infact NATURAL....i was like "WHAT?!?!". i had some fish picked out and getting ready to bag em up and told them never mind....

I just recently inherited a blood parrot from my BF who tried him out in his oscar/jd tank. the JD harassed the poor guy so now he is in my 55 with my baby albino zebras. He is a cool fish, has a GREAT personality.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Telling stories to customers... I can not tell you how MANY times I actually pulled people to the side at various stores over the years and started my sentence "Look ....".....some of the stuff these sales rep's tell new fish keepers is just plain horrible....


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## HollyinWA (Dec 29, 2009)

I definitely am against tattooed fish! I never knew they existed until I read it on this board. Regarding manmade fish, I am against it if they breed them/make them in ways that it deforms them to where they cannot function properly....affects their health, etc. Actually, how do they man-make a fish? I am pretty sure fish do not cross breed like dogs and cats, do they? Not sure if I am for it if they have to go too far with making them.


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## HollyinWA (Dec 29, 2009)

If they inject dye into a fish to make the glow fish, I am against that. I saw them for the first time at Petsmart the other day and I thought they looked pretty neat, but I was puzzled at how they became like that. I was leary. I did not see those kinds of things 8-10 years ago....at least I don't remember them. We did have the Parrot fish, and I had one but I did not know at the time exactly how they came into being. If they are not mistreated in the process or if they can funtion ok without big health issues from their makeup, then I guess they would be ok.


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## HollyinWA (Dec 29, 2009)

Mikaila31 said:


> I would call it a parrot. A couple different cichlids can be crossed to make parrots. This is why they can vary so much in appearance. I would agree yours looks like it was a convict cross with something else.


They must cross them by using man to cross them, right? I was always under the impression that fish do not cross-breed like dogs and cats. If I am right, how do they fertilize the eggs.....what do they do to the male....hopefully not abuse it or they end up dying, etc.


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## Angel079 (Feb 14, 2007)

Holly, if you read the first link in post #45 that explains it fairly well what's happening there....


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## HollyinWA (Dec 29, 2009)

Angel079 said:


> Holly, if you read the first link in post #45 that explains it fairly well what's happening there....


Oh, ok, thanks. I will check it out.


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## sericinda (Jan 9, 2010)

I have 4 parrot cichlids, all rescues, and I ADORE them. They are by far my favourite fish. They have amazing personalities. They are very shy around strangers but they know me and come for me when called. I happen to think they are adorable too. I will be rescuing 2 more from an aunt that has two babies in a 10 gallon (yikes...) so am trying to figure out where to put another setup for them.

I also have 5 glofish in with my blue crayfish and they are great. Very fun to watch and love the colors.

I don't like the tattooing or dying process for parrots or other fish though, and would never purchase a tattooed/dyed fish. I have two dyed skirted tetras that were rescues as well and they are very pretty, but I wouldn't purposely support the practice by purchasing them at the LFS.


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm against any sort of modification (whether that be done via selective breeding or actual mutilation of the fish) that results in health issues. Whether it's dyed fish, tattooed fish, cropped fish, balloon varieties or what-have-you I just can't stand by these practices.

I have absolutely no beef with Glo-Fish. I personally don't like the way they look but since the process has no known negative health issues and doesn't harm the fish in any way, I don't see any harm in it. No different from selective breeding for color strains, really.

Hybrids, however, I do tend to have some problems with. A lot of hybridization is accidental, resulting in people taking their fish in to the LFS where they are mislabeled and sold. I see all kinds of strange cichlid and livebearer hybrids especially. I don't really have any problem with the hybrids specifically, but it makes finding pure strains difficult and really complicates things for hobbyists looking for new breeding stock.


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## Kelso (Oct 28, 2009)

I really don't like hybrids period..like mules even for instance. I don't like how it also tampers with keeping genetic lines clean...as aforementioned cichlid or guppy/live bearer mixes. I like my fish the way they were initially found. I'm not too upset over the glo-fish, I just find them ugly. Tattooed fish or dyed fish are all ugly fish and are despicable. To be blunt-I don't like man's involvement in the appearance of fish...except bettas or other fish where all it is is selective breeding.


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