# Help?



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

I have never been on a forum before. I have no clue what I'm doing. I hope this gets out because I really need advice. 
I got a 55 gallon tank for Christmas. I have never owned any tank before. I have been reading all kinds of books and doing a lot of research online. I have pretty much narrowed it down to what kind of fish I want. I was going to get a BGK, but I want to wait until I get more experience. This is my list of what I'm looking to get, but I don't know if it's too much or if they will all make good tankmates..... 1 - Angelfish, 8 - Cardinal Tetras, 8 - Rainbowfish, 4 - Pictus Catfish, 3 - Bronze Cory Cats and 1 - Blue Gourami. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated! Thanks
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## AnnieC (Jan 5, 2011)

The Cardinals will probably not last very long with the other fish you are considering. Also, that amount of fish seems like it may be a bit much, unless you were considering moving them to something larger. A BGK will also need a larger tank, if/when you do decide to ever get one.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

AnnieC said:


> The Cardinals will probably not last very long with the other fish you are considering. Also, that amount of fish seems like it may be a bit much, unless you were considering moving them to something larger. A BGK will also need a larger tank, if/when you do decide to ever get one.


Thanks. Do you think if I didn't get the pictus the cardinals would be okay?


----------



## AnnieC (Jan 5, 2011)

newbie336 said:


> Thanks. Do you think if I didn't get the pictus the cardinals would be okay?


I wouldn't put them with the pictus, gourami or the angel, and depending on which species of rainbowfish you are getting, I probably wouldn't keep them with them, either ;-)


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

AnnieC said:


> I wouldn't put them with the pictus, gourami or the angel, and depending on which species of rainbowfish you are getting, I probably wouldn't keep them with them, either ;-)


I don't have my heart set on either the cardinals or the rainbow fish. I would just like to have a colorful school that would get along with the angel. Any suggestions?


----------



## RCinAL (Nov 14, 2010)

newbie336 said:


> I don't have my heart set on either the cardinals or the rainbow fish. I would just like to have a colorful school that would get along with the angel. Any suggestions?


Maybe try some Glo-fish. You can't beat the color and they should be fine with Angel fish.


----------



## tanker (Mar 13, 2010)

If you look at the profile for the angelfish it recommends them to be in a group of 4/5. 

How about a group of angels, group of diamond tetras, and a group of cories for the bottom?

What sort of water do you have? These are fish that like soft water.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

I can't seem to get my water report but I think I have changed my mind on the Angels. I am now thinking about going with a pair of Kehole Cichlids, maybe some cherry barbs and redtail rasboras and some harlequins for top swimmers. I do like those diamond tetras to. I am basically trying to find a centerpiece fish, some middle level schooling fish of two types (if possible) and some top swimmers. I still want the Cory cats for the bottom but I think the pictus catfish might be too aggressive. There are just so many fish to choose from!


----------



## aura09 (Nov 5, 2010)

I would maybe go with a peaceful tropical comminity tank as they are more hardy and good begginer fish plus you can have more!  angelfish get really big 8x6! you should check out aqadvisor.com just put in your tank and filter and it has a list of fish and it will tell you if that fish can get along as well as other things like your stocking percent! its pretty cool. but def set it all up first and let your tank cycle for a week or two. use prime and maybe if you want some bacteria supplement. and then add your fish slowly as its a new tank and will be stressful for them. maybe 1-3 for big fish or 5-7 small ones. but goodluckk on whatever you chose to do! 

p.s and for a show fish maybe a pearl gourami they get along with small neon tetras and what not. they are pretty too


----------



## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Newbie336, welcome to Tropical Fish Keeping forum.

We have a fish profiles section, click on the second tab from the left in the blue bar at the top to go there. Freshwater fish are divided into the categories like Characins (the tetra, hatchetfish and pencilfish are all here), Catfish (corys and other bottom fish, except loaches), Cyprinids (rasbora, danio, barb, loaches), etc. Read through and find things you like. Each profile has advice on minimum tank size [for that spcies understand, the more species you have the bigger the tank needed], numbers of each species (shoaling fish must be in groups), compatible fish, etc.

Your water parameters are important, both hardness and pH. Some fish have specific needs, others are adaptable to some degree. This is also mentioned in the profiles.

The tank also has to cycle; read up on that here:
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/...inners-guide-freshwater-aquarium-cycle-38617/

Byron.


----------



## iheartmypitbull (Aug 25, 2010)

Okay, this may be a silly question, but what's a BGK? I'm totally drawing a blank on what that could stand for...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iheartmypitbull (Aug 25, 2010)

It's a black ghost knife, isn't it? Yeah, I should've given that another thirty seconds of thinking before I asked....

As for a suggestion for your tank, I'm super gung-ho madly in love with cichlids. If it were me I would do something like a pair of ram cichlids (they're GORGEOUS) with a small school of something like rummynose tetras, some marbled hatchetfish up top, and a few cute little cories on the bottom (my favorite are the peppered but some people find them boring).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

Black Ghost Knife.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

I was looking at some keyhole cichlids but I think I'm gonna go with about 6 Discus, 12 neon tetras and 4-5 panda corys. I was looking at the peppered corys but it didn't look like they could withstand the temp of the tank where it needs to be for the Discus.


----------



## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

Sorry to be a downer but there is no way you should have 6 Discus in a tank that size. They can grow to 6" and are very difficult fish to keep. 

Minimum size tank should be 75 gallons and they require a lower ph range (7.0 is neutral, they are best kept at 6.0 or 6.2).


----------



## iheartmypitbull (Aug 25, 2010)

I agree with Romad, discus would be a bad idea. Along with their size, I have been told that they are VERY sensitive to water quality and their health can rapidly deteriorate in less than perfect conditions. Discus owners must do diligent weekly water changes which, in my experience is not something a lot of novice fish keepers will be consistent about. I'm not implying in any way that you are incapable, just forewarning you the difficulties in keeping discus. 

IMO there are a lot of other bright and beautiful cichlids out there who are much easier to care for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

I'm pretty bummed. I read that they are sensitive and can be hard to keep, I guess I was just hoping I could do it, but the more I think about, I better not risk it. I also have three kids and I don't want them to get stressed. Any suggestions about what I can replace them with. I want something colorful that I can put with a small school and some corys or pictus's.


----------



## iheartmypitbull (Aug 25, 2010)

I don't know much about them but I've also been intrigued with threadfin rainbow fish. There's also lots of killies out there (i think rocket panchax are cool looking) and tetras in every size and shape. It'd be super cool if you did a heavily planted tank with a huge (40 or so) school of some little tetra. The bigger the school, the more natural they will act. And with all the different kinds of tetras, I'm sure you'd be able to find one that tickled your fancy. I suggest looking at the species profiles on this website.

[EDIT: oh gosh, I just realized you said WITH a small school, not IN a small school. Maybe apistogramma?]


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

Thanks, I'll look into it.


----------



## Calmwaters (Sep 2, 2009)

In my 55 I have 8 golden barbs, a pair of honey sunset gourami, 3 coryadorus duplicarius, 6 albino corys, 2 peacock gudgeon, 6 flame tetra, 12 neon tetra I have room for more fish and will be adding more after I move the tank to my new house but right now I feel like it has a lot of nice color and everyone gets along fine. I also have a lot of real plants which are way better than plastic ones and are not hard to take care of at all in my opinion.


----------



## tanker (Mar 13, 2010)

Have you found out what sort of water you've got? 

How about platies? They are hardy and have lots of different colours. (They prefer harder water)


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

Might sound cruel, but I think I would like to stay away from breeding fish as much as possible. They are a beautiful fish though.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tanker (Mar 13, 2010)

You can just buy all the same sex if you don't want them to breed.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

So, how about this? 3 angelfish, 3 black mollies, 6 blackskirt tetras, 6 marble hatchetfish and 6 panda cories.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iheartmypitbull (Aug 25, 2010)

I'm no expert but I think that sounds like a pretty good stock
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

Cool! Thanks. I haven't been able to sleep well because I've been so excited and there are soooo many choices. I hope this will do it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

newbie336 said:


> So, how about this? 3 angelfish, 3 black mollies, 6 blackskirt tetras, 6 marble hatchetfish and 6 panda cories.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There are a couple issues here.

First the angels, as you have a 55g you can do it properly and get 5 or 6. They will be much more settled in this size group, as noted in our profile [click on the name, Pterophyllum scalare]. Otherwise, you may well have serious squabbling; the dominant fish of the 3 can easily hound one or both of the others to death.

Black skirt tetra [common name is Black Widow Tetra in our profiles] are not the best tankmates for angels. This tetra frequently becomes a fin nipper, and the flowing fins of the angels would be too great a temptation. A better choice would be one of the Rosy Tetra clade [several species in the genus Hyphessobrycon, check our profiles]. Not only are they far less likely to be "naughty," but they add some lovely reddish colouration to the tank. And as you have the space, even with 5-6 angels, I would increase the group from 6 to 8 or 9. Here again, the more fish in the group the less likelihood of trouble.

Byron.


----------



## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

100% agrree with Byron. 5-9 Angels would be quite a display in your 55g. Maybe a group of 5-10 corys as well for some action on the bottom. Black skirt Tetras will most certainly nip. If you're looking for a colorful, active tetra, a nice shoal of Rummynose Tetra would be nice too. I have 15 in my 125g and they are a lot of fun. Rummynose Tetra are one of the few tetra that will actually swim together in unison across your tank all together. Most other tetras need to be in groups for security, but will not group together to swim like the Rummynose. I did try Bleeding Heart Tetras in my tank (a group of 7 or 9 I believe) and they became nippy towards my Angels and had to be taken back. Just a word of caution.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

I would love to have that many. I was on aqadvisor.com and it said I was overstocked with the fish I listed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

newbie336 said:


> I would love to have that many. I was on aqadvisor.com and it said I was overstocked with the fish I listed.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The great problem with any calculator to determine fish stocking is that some of the variables cannot possibly be incorporated into the method. "Compatibility" in a community aquarium has several aspects that affect the success (or cause failure) beyond simple numbers. 

To take just one aspect, interaction within the group: A group of 3 angels will quite likely cause stress to the angels from the dominant behaviour of one of them. In a group of 5 or 6, this dominance is more evenly spread out, and it is natural; these fish occur in such groups in nature, and it is inherent in their makeup to have this interaction--but not to excess. A group of 3 angels will be under severe stress and this in turn affects the other fish in the tank through chemicals and pheromones released by stressed fish. But in a group of 5-6, this is significantly lessened, resulting in a calmer environment. And that means healthier. So having more fish actually improves the environment. Now, of course one can carry this too far, and the size of tank must always be kept in mind. Plus having live plants helps a great deal because of the "filtration" they perform that no filter we add can match.

Carrying this interaction idea one step further, we add a group of other fish, like one of the rosy tetra. Sometimes this is termed "dither fish" which means these other fish are there partly to calm the angels. This works with almost all cichlids, which on their own can be quite withdrawn and nervous. But a group of peaceful tetra cruising among the plants tells the angels that it is safe to be out and about. By nature, angels are very shy fish, remaining among fallen tree branches, tangled roots, etc., in quite dimly-lit waters. In the relative brightness of our aquarium they do better with companions. Discus are even more like this.

Aquarists seem to frequently forget that fish have evolved over thousands and millions of years to suit their environment. Replicating that environment is a big step in providing a suitable one in the aquarium. A fish like the angel from the habitat I have mentioned, when placed in a relatively bare and brightly-lit tank will always feel threatened. If does not understand that it is under no danger from predators. It only knows what nature has programmed into its instincts, that in such a surrounding it is highly vulnerable and likely to be attacked at any second. This inherent instinct is present in all fish species, and sometimes we see it (as with pale, shivering fish) but often it is not overly-apparent externally. But inwardly the fish is literally terrified. And that means under stress, which means poorer health.

I hope this explains it a bit.

Byron.


----------



## newbie336 (Jan 8, 2011)

So 5 or 6 Angels, 12 rosy tetras, 12 rummy nose, 3 black mollies and 6 panda cories? Does that sound okay or is it too much?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Not a problem with numbers, but here again there are incompatible fish, this time in terms of water parameters.

Mollies absolutely must have basic harder water. They will succumb to fungus and all sorts of issues in soft acidic water.

At the opposite, rummy nose tetra are not at their best in basic hard water, at least not to their full potential lifespan. As noted in our profiles [see Hemigrammus bleheri], this species should have soft, acidic water. They are wild caught, like most cardinal tetra, and share identical needs with respect to water.

The other fish are inclined to soft, acidic water too, but are adaptable to slightly basic water, pH in the low to mid 7's. I would not subject rummynose to this. I don't know what your water parameters are, but this is a significant part of compatibility.


----------

