# New to Saltwater



## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

My friend offered me his neglected 20 gallon saltwater tank setup this weekend for $100 and I just couldn't pass it up. It's just been sitting and looks pretty rough, but I'm getting tons of stuff and don't mind the clean up. 

Included: 
~40lbs live rock
2inch sand bed
2 koralia nano 425's
4xT5 light fixture with 10k and actinic bulbs. (brand unknown at this time)
heater

I have some questions regarding clean up. Is there anything I should look out for with the live rock or sand since it's been sitting with no maintenance for a while? My plan currently is to remove the live rock and sand from the tank and seperate it into two 5 gallon buckets of saltwater. Is this ok? Should I take a toothbrush to the liverock?

Then give the tank a good scrub down to remove algae and whatnot. Any pointers on cleaning the tank? 

Then I'll replace sand and hardscape the live rock. Should I fill the tank up before I hardscape with the liverock? Is it going to ruin it if I have it out of water for an hour or two?

I'm going to be taking this process slow and gathering the rest of my needed equipment over the next couple months. Am I missing anythning obvious here? Any feedback/advice is appreciated. Thanks.


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## InsaneIchthyology (Apr 8, 2012)

You should probably get a sump pump for the tank. 
And leaving the live rock out of water probably isn't too good for it. 
I also wouldn't scrub the live rock too vigorously.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

What would I need a sump pump for?

Thanks for the other tips, I'll make sure and have some water in the tank before I mess around with the scape. Thanks


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## InsaneIchthyology (Apr 8, 2012)

The sump pump is like a skimmer, and it helps keep the tank clean. Kinda like a filter


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Oh, I'll be using a modifed AC70 as a refugium with chaeto. I think that should suffice for filtration with the two koralia nano 425's. I'm planning on weekly water changes of atleast 5 gallons as well.


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## InsaneIchthyology (Apr 8, 2012)

Sounds good, I think you should be fine with that. 
Good luck!


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Any other opinions, suggestions?


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

You can scrub the rock off using a dish scrubber or something of that type, tooth brush is a bit small. No need to use SW as its just been sitting out and its dead anyways.
Rinse out the sand before puttin in the tank. Rinse out the tnak with vineagar and water, rinse well after you give it a lil scrubbing.
Fill tank half way with salt water that has been mixed up at least 24hrs prior. Put sand in. Then you can Aquascape, making sure you push the rock to the bottom of the tank, before setting another piece on top of it. 
All the other things you have listed will work for ya. On thing to keep in mind though, that tank will go through a normal 4-6 weeks cycle, as the bacteria is no longer alive on any of the things you have.
You;ll still need tesing equipment.
Ammonia
Nitrites
Nitrates
Refractometer to measure SG (Specific Gravity)


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## InsaneIchthyology (Apr 8, 2012)

Well when I got my saltwater tank I got a few yellow tail damsels. They're easy to take care of and fairly inexpensive, so they are good for a new tank. If they live for awhile and don't die then you can start getting other fish. 
A mistake I made was getting a hawkfish because the people at my lfs recommended one of them. That is NOT a good idea. If you don't have any other fish then go ahead and get one but they are very aggressive. It actually ended up killing a few of my fish, so we eventually sent it back. 
One more thing you might want to get is a salinity testing device. It's just a simple tool that lets you know how salty the water is.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

InsaneIchthyology said:


> Well when I got my saltwater tank I got a few yellow tail damsels. They're easy to take care of and fairly inexpensive, so they are good for a new tank. If they live for awhile and don't die then you can start getting other fish.
> A mistake I made was getting a hawkfish because the people at my lfs recommended one of them. That is NOT a good idea. If you don't have any other fish then go ahead and get one but they are very aggressive. It actually ended up killing a few of my fish, so we eventually sent it back.
> One more thing you might want to get is *a salinity testing device*. It's just a simple tool that lets you know how salty the water is.


* Refractometer*: As I stated above. 
A Damsel in my opinion is a horrible first fish, as they will get to know the tank first, and make it their own, bullying all other fish you put in there afterwards. Then good luck getting that thing outta there when you've had enough of him.


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## InsaneIchthyology (Apr 8, 2012)

They did bully a little bit, but I've got a wrasse, a coral beauty, clown, and a tang and the damsel is doing fine with them now.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Reefing Madness said:


> You can scrub the rock off using a dish scrubber or something of that type, tooth brush is a bit small. No need to use SW as its just been sitting out and its dead anyways.
> Rinse out the sand before puttin in the tank. Rinse out the tnak with vineagar and water, rinse well after you give it a lil scrubbing.
> Fill tank half way with salt water that has been mixed up at least 24hrs prior. Put sand in. Then you can Aquascape, making sure you push the rock to the bottom of the tank, before setting another piece on top of it.
> All the other things you have listed will work for ya. On thing to keep in mind though, that tank will go through a normal 4-6 weeks cycle, as the bacteria is no longer alive on any of the things you have.
> ...


Maybe I should clarify about the state of the tank. I was sent a picture and the water has just been left to sit in the tank and has evaporated to about halfway. My friend just drained the tank down to the sand bed so the rock is no longer in the water. The tank looks very green from algae growth most likely. There should still be bacteria/life in the sand bed. 

Should I rinse the sand with SW? Probably nothing to hope for on the rock. Do you think the sand will be enough to seed the rock?

Thanks for the tips on cleaning and setting up the tank. That's exactly what I was looking for. 

I have freshwater ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate test. These should work ok for SW right?


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## Tazman (Jan 15, 2012)

rjwwrx said:


> I have freshwater ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate test. These should work ok for SW right?


You need to download the saltwater color charts if the test kit is API then you can get them from here.

The Nitrite test is the same color chart, Ammonia and Nitrate are not.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Tazman said:


> You need to download the saltwater color charts if the test kit is API then you can get them from here.
> 
> The Nitrite test is the same color chart, Ammonia and Nitrate are not.


Awesome, thanks!


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

rjwwrx said:


> Maybe I should clarify about the state of the tank. I was sent a picture and the water has just been left to sit in the tank and has evaporated to about halfway. My friend just drained the tank down to the sand bed so the rock is no longer in the water. The tank looks very green from algae growth most likely. There should still be bacteria/life in the sand bed.
> 
> Should I rinse the sand with SW? Probably nothing to hope for on the rock. Do you think the sand will be enough to seed the rock?
> 
> ...


 Its very possible that you still have some life in that sand bed. Yes, rinse it well in SW, this will keep them teaming. And will help your tank cycling, and seeding the Rock.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

I came home last night and took off to the fish store. I picked up a 20 gallon stand, salt and hydrometer. Went to walmart and picked up 4 5 gallon jugs of RO water from their machine and 2 5 gallon buckets for tank maintenance. 

I got the sand out of the old tank and rinsed out in SW. Scrubbed out the old tank and got the new stand in place. I added 10 gallons of water to the tank and got all the sand transferred over. Then i called it quits. I woke up this morning and the tank is still pretty cloudy. I'm sure it'll clear up in a day or two. I'm running one koralia nano 425 at the top of the water line pointing towards the middle front for circulation. Should I keep this up? Please forgive the cell phone pics my camera battery died and we can't find the charger :-(










I had some time this morning so I started scrubbing the rock I got. I scrubbed it pretty good but there is still some color to the rock. As soon as the tank clears enough for me to see what is happening in there I'll start scaping. Not sure how I'm going to place that oblong flat peice yet. I like it though.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Throw the rock in there, worry about the scaping when it clears. The presesnce of the rock being there will actually help that cause.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Great, thanks for the help


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Got the rock put into the tank last night and woke up to a mouch improved tank. 










I'll keep posting with progress. Hopefully I'll get it filled up and scaped tonight. Any suggestions for scaping are welcome.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

:thumbsup:

Scaping is all in what you want your tank to look like.

aquascaping ideas - Bing Images


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

I was able to scape the tank last night. Got it topped off with water and put my temporary filter on while I wait for my AC70. It's looking much clearer.

Does this scape look ok? Seems like I'll have some ok hidey spots and a couple decent spots for easy corals when I'm ready. Just hoping that it's functional.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Looks good.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

First of many test results.

PH: 7.8
Ammonia: 1.0ppm
Nitrite: .25ppm
Nitrate: 10-20ppm

The nitrate test is really hard to determine the colors, but i'm fairly certain there are some. Not really sure why at this point. Will probably be testing every other day or so. 

Suggestions for a simple CUC would be welcome at this point. I'm in no rush to get anything, just want to start doing my research on what I want. CUC should be reef safe 
as I plan for corals some time in the future.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Readings lookin normal. Yes, You just kinda read the Nitrates like you did, the inbetween coloring, 10-20 is a good reading to hold once Amm and Trites come down.
CUC:
Bumble Bee Snalis
Trubo Snails
Nass Snails
Blue Legged Hermits
Scarlet Hermits


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Thanks Reefing, I appreciate all your help. I'll keep posting up my numbers. I might swing by the LFS and pick up a nice piece of LR this weekend. Hopefully this together with the livesand I got will have a decently quick cycle.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

PH: 7.8
Ammonia: 0.5
Nitrite: 1
Nitrate: 10-20


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

PH: 8.0
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrite: .25
Nitrate: 20 (definitely orange this time)


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

rjwwrx said:


> PH: 8.0
> Ammonia: 0.25
> Nitrite: .25
> Nitrate: 20 (definitely orange this time)


 :thumbsup:


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

I was looking through aquatraders.com and noticed they have a HOB refugium/skimmer that is much less expensive than the CPR product. I was going to mod an AC70 into a fuge, but this purpose built product looks like it will have more water volume and it has a skimmer. I am sure the skimmer is not going to be the greatest, but something should be better than nothing right?

Filtration - Reef - Hang On Refugium with Protein Skimmer

Any opinions?


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

HOB Refugium is very nice, don't count on that skimmer being of much help to ya.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

PH: 8.0
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrite: 0 
Nitrate: 20

I'm puzzled by my nitrite reading being zero when I still have a small ammonia reading. I'm going to retest these two tomorrow night and see if I get the same results. Things are moving right along.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

No worries. It'll come and go.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

PH: 7.8
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrite: 0 
Nitrate: 10-20

I did a small ~2 gallon water change to see how my numbers would go. Seems like the ammonia number is still there and puzzling me. Maybe I'm just color blind with the print out I made from their website. 

Anyways, I'm definitely seeing diatom growth on the sandbed and a little on the higher LR. I'm using 2 18" 6500k t8's right now just propped on the tank, but it seems to at least be supporting some algae. Once I figure out whether I truly have any ammonia in my tank or not I'm going to pick up some snails. 

Birthday is coming up next week so I will have some $$$ to buy my light fixture and HOB refugium. I'll get pics once I have the refugium and lights up.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Yea, test colors are lil tough to read. How long has it been running now?


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Running since 4/11
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Should still see Ammonia.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Reefing Madness said:


> Should still see Ammonia.


Even with the established sand I kept from the old tank setup? I wasn't expecting to go through a full 6-8 week long cycle.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Welp, ya never know then.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Tested last night. I'm still seeing the same color as before with the ammonia, but I'm going to call it zero now. Color hasn't budged and nitrites have stayed at zero. 

PH: 8.0
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0 
Nitrate: 10-20

I'm getting plenty of diatom growth so will probably be picking up some ceriths soon. Birthday is coming up next week so the rest of my equipment should be on order within the next couple weeks.


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## Logansbloodyclaw (Mar 30, 2012)

sweet dude!!!

keep up the good work!!!!!!!!!!!

what are looking at to stock your tank with( and don't say fish lol)


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Logansbloodyclaw said:


> sweet dude!!!
> 
> keep up the good work!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> what are looking at to stock your tank with( and don't say fish lol)


Thanks for the comments. 

I'm planning for a pair of tank bred ocellaris clowns mainly. Then probably a goby, blenny, or firefish. Haven't really decided on one of these yet. I'll just see what my LFS has. I really like clown gobies so I'll go with that if I find one.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

I was looking at my scape over the weekend and I started to feel like it didn't look very natural. I moved the top rock to the side and filled in the gap in the middle a little. Opinions? 










I've got plenty of diatom growth going on so I went ahead and added 5 ceriths yesterday. They have been slowly but surely munching it down.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Don't worry about the Diatoms, they will go away by themselves.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Reefing Madness said:


> Don't worry about the Diatoms, they will go away by themselves.


Yeah I'm definitely not worried about them. Just glad I have some life growing in the tank to support a CUC.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

rjwwrx said:


> Yeah I'm definitely not worried about them. Just glad I have some life growing in the tank to support a CUC.


 :thumbsup:


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Just made my order with aquatraders!

4x24w T5 with built in timer
10"x5"x1" led fuge light
14" HOB refugium with protein skimmer
200w heater
extra pack of prefilter sponges for powerhead


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

My wife couldn't wait for me to get my new equipment on tuesday before adding fish. Picked up two tank bred ocellaris on saturday. They are looking good so far. Again only cell phone pics but I will take better shots when I get my stuff in on tuesday. My wife decided to name them as well. Jack and Rooster...:roll:


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

:nicefish::thumbsup:


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

might help to open the rock work up more to create gaps. you can also create arches, islands, pilars, caves and such with the rock aswell but the openings will help with flow in the tank and also allow the fish to interact more in its enviroment.

i also strongly suggest the use of a QT for new fish as well.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

onefish2fish said:


> might help to open the rock work up more to create gaps. you can also create arches, islands, pilars, caves and such with the rock aswell but the openings will help with flow in the tank and also allow the fish to interact more in its enviroment.
> 
> i also strongly suggest the use of a QT for new fish as well.


 
Thanks for the ideas. I am really struggling with finding a scape that looks natural to me and also functional. I'm hoping for good usable coral space and still have something interesting to look at. I have more playing to do with the rock work.


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

Unboxing new equipment I put in the equipment forum here.


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

:BIGgrin:


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

UPDATE: 

I got my HOB refugium all setup! I used thread tape and I am currently not having any leaking. I really like this thing. I was also able to get a ~13" 200 watt heater in the refugium with no problems. 
I decided not to use any sponge on the pump intake and instead I placed some filter floss in the second baffle for water coming up into the fuge. Seemed to clear everything up nicely. The floss will be maintained/replaced weekly with water changes. This also helped get rid of any bubbles making their way into the main fuge area. However I am getting tons of microbubbles from the return. I'm hoping that if I give it a chance to break in that these will go away. For now I have some filter floss rubber banded around the return. 

I ended up attaching an air pump to the power head for the skimmer. Just didn't see enough bubbles produced without it, but we'll see what happens in the long run. I swung by petsmart and picked up the tetra whisper 10 and it seems to be working well. This is my first skimmer and it's not a great one by any definition so I'll have to work on getting it adjusted. On to a few pics. (Wife left for vacation and stole the camera so only cell phone pics  )


Right side
















Filter Floss
















Left Side








FTS


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## rjwwrx (Sep 30, 2011)

And I got my first frag last night! I feel like such a noob for being this excited about it. :mrgreen:




















The addiction begins :twisted:


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

:cheers:


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## JimBinSC (Jun 11, 2011)

rjwwrx said:


> First of many test results.
> 
> PH: 7.8
> Ammonia: 1.0ppm
> ...


Late to the party here but I am wondering how you got your ammonia up to 1 after only 2 days if I read this right. I am not getting any reading on my 75 with just one clown. I want it to happen so I can add more fish!


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## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

JimBinSC said:


> Late to the party here but I am wondering how you got your ammonia up to 1 after only 2 days if I read this right. I am not getting any reading on my 75 with just one clown. I want it to happen so I can add more fish!


 Lemme see if i read this right here. You have a new tank, with a Clown Fish in it, that hasn't cycled yet. And you want to see Ammonia so you can add more fish?


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## JimBinSC (Jun 11, 2011)

Reefing Madness said:


> Lemme see if i read this right here. You have a new tank, with a Clown Fish in it, that hasn't cycled yet. And you want to see Ammonia so you can add more fish?


Ummm...not exactly, guess I didn't word it right. I want to see ammonia since that means the cycle is going then I can watch for the cycle completion so I can add more fish!


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