# Keeping tanks - then and now



## easeltine

This is just something to think about: 

The book I was quoting was from the 19th Edition entitled, "Exotic Aquarium Fishes," a 595 page book written by Dr. William Innes. The first Edition was in 1938, and this Edition was written when he was 93 years old in 1966. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_T._Innes

I am mentioning it because that is the book I was brought up on doing Tropical Fish Aquariums as a child, and we had 6 Tanks. They were working beautifully! The 29 Gallon had 26 Angelfish we raised, and the guppy tank was so loaded we used to let the Angelfish feast on guppies. 

1. There is no mention in this book of a Water Test Kit. I have never used one for an aquarium. I just let the Marineland Eclipse 2 BioFilter on my 30 gallon Tall do it's job, and pay for a new $1.00 to $2.00 fish when they croak. LOL
2. No regular water change was ever done to aquarium tanks when I was young! We just put in cooled boiled water whenever the water evaporated. The Black Skirts lived 8 years without ever getting the water changed in their tanks. 
3. I raised bettas, I even had a salt water aquarium. 
4. Our filter system was the floss and carbon side filters that were changed ever 2-4 weeks. We vacuumed the tanks with one of those battery powered vacuums every few months. Nothing else. 
5. We had plenty of plants. 
6. Fish population, the different tanks recommended by this 93 year old in this book are amazing! He suggested 11 different scenarios - 5 gallon - 17 smallish mixed-sized fish, 15-20 gallon 46 mixed-sized fish, 5 gallon 19 small-sized fish, 5 gallon 12 fishes a little larger, 7 gallon 8 fishes still larger, 10 gallon 31 small fishes 10 gallon 15 fishes a little larger average size, 20 gallon 60 fishes mostly smaller size, 20 gallon 37 larger fishes, 40 gallon 78 fishes mostly medium size 78 LOL!, 40 gallon 65 mostly large fish
Concepts that in today's standard we think are CRAZY! 

I only started changing water every week coming back to the hobby about 12 years ago, and reading the modern literature. 1 1/2 years ago I lost 8 Angels that I had raised due to the City changing to Chloramine. 

I don't know. I think some people make things too complicated for a person wanting to start a 10 gallon tank.


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## BWG

easeltine said:


> This is just something to think about:
> 
> The book I was quoting was from the 19th Edition entitled, "Exotic Aquarium Fishes," a 595 page book written by Dr. William Innes. The first Edition was in 1938, and this Edition was written when he was 93 years old in 1966. William T. Innes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> I am mentioning it because that is the book I was brought up on doing Tropical Fish Aquariums as a child, and we had 6 Tanks. They were working beautifully! The 29 Gallon had 26 Angelfish we raised, and the guppy tank was so loaded we used to let the Angelfish feast on guppies.
> 
> 1. There is no mention in this book of a Water Test Kit. I have never used one for an aquarium.
> 2. No regular water change was ever done to aquarium tanks! We just put in cooled boiled water whenever the water evaporated. The Black Skirts lived 8 years without ever getting the water changed in their tanks.
> 3. I raised bettas, I even had a salt water aquarium.
> 4. Our filter system was the floss and carbon side filters that were changed ever 2-4 weeks. We vacuumed the tanks with one of those battery powered vacuums every few months. Nothing else.
> 5. We had plenty of plants.
> 6. Fish population, the different tanks recommended by this 93 year old in this book are amazing! He suggested 11 different scenarios - 5 gallon - 17 smallish mixed-sized fish, 15-20 gallon 46 mixed-sized fish, 5 gallon 19 small-sized fish, 5 gallon 12 fishes a little larger, 7 gallon 8 fishes still larger, 10 gallon 31 small fishes 10 gallon 15 fishes a little larger average size, 20 gallon 60 fishes mostly smaller size, 20 gallon 37 larger fishes, 40 gallon 78 fishes mostly medium size 78 LOL!, 40 gallon 65 mostly large fish
> Concepts that in today's standard we think are CRAZY!
> 
> I only started changing water every week coming back to the hobby about 12 years ago, and reading the modern literature. 1 1/2 years ago I lost 8 Angels that I had raised due to the City changing to Chloramine.
> 
> I don't know. I think some people make things too complicated for a person wanting to start a 10 gallon tank.


Technology and and practices advance. I'm sure you can understand that given you are likely on a computer. 

Are you certain your fish died from chloramine? Are you sure it wasn't a case of old tank syndrome caused by overstocking and no water changes in which after you finally did a water change the pH went from acidic to close to neutral turning the ammonium into ammonia? I ask because I have chloramine in my water and do weekly water changes has never killed one of my fish.


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## easeltine

I never had any problem with a water change until the area where I live in Los Angeles made a decision to basically, spike the water with chloramine about 1 1/2 to 2 years ago. I had read online from a reliable Aquarium Fish Store that they had no problem changing the water on their fish, and that the chloramine in a small amount could be beneficial in killing diseases. Well, I decided to change my procedure of dechlorinating the water, and then I read right after my angelfish died that the City had changed to chloramine. I then could smell the spike in the water. 

I really do need a Test Kit now to make sure all the ammonia is out of the water before I do a water change! I know that to be true, for it could also be higher. I have a 30 gallon tall with 21 fish. It is possible that it is overcrowded and the test could tell me if I need to reduce the population or change the filters more often. It is an Eclipse 2 with a Bio-Filter. I could have too much nitrate or nitrites in the water, it is possible.


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## jaysee

Expectations are much higher now than they used to be as well. Having to frequently replace fish is not considered success by today's standards. Too, the quality of the fish is much lower than it used to be, which surely contributes to the difficulty there can be keeping fish nowadays. 

I do agree that it is easy to over complicate things, and some people do to their detriment. Other people love the technical jargon - especially many of the people that post in the advanced section. Is it important to understand the specifics of how certain things work in order to successfully maintain a healthy aquarium? Absolutely not. One need not understand how water conditioners work in order to use them effectively.

This is a hobby and there are a number of different things that people enjoy about it. Some like the tech talk, others like to talk about how their betta looked at them this morning. We get to determine our own level of involvement in the various areas.


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## easeltine

I do realize now that what I was writing would confuse a beginner, it is confusing. 

What would be a good type of water test kit for me to start with? Someone mentioned a cheaper ammonia kit, and maybe that is a good idea for me? 

Maybe I am forgetting details when I was young, (or mom did more than I realized), but it seems to me I had more fish in the tanks, more plants, less sophisticated filtering systems, did nothing to the water, less work, less diseases and the fish lived longer. 

Maybe, the fish lived longer because they liked me more for feeding them live brine shrimp back then?

I had a good very good GPA going back to College, but not in Chemistry. I was looking at the Advanced Section, and technical jargon, wow!, you are not kidding.


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## jaysee

I don't ever test my water - never have. I don't think you need a test kit if you are familiar with your fishs behavior. If they are acting like they are being poisoned by ammonia, then you're going to do a water change anyway so why bother testing? If the amount of water you change is dependent on your test results, then yes it's important I suppose. However, if you just change an arbitrary amount of water, then it doesn't matter as much.

Liquid test kits are considered to be the best.


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## easeltine

Thank you, based on some of those comments one would think I sinned by never having a test kit.


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## Tolak

Besides the scientific aspect, which wasn't real well known, tanks were quite expensive back then if you factor in inflation. Slate bottoms, metal frames, lots of hands on work compared to the mass produced aquariums of today. It's pretty common to find these metal framed aquariums in smaller sizes by today's standards, 5 gallons up to maybe 30 gallons. Today the 55 gallon is second only to the 10 gallon as far as unit sales, 55 gallon tanks in those days were huge! Due to this stocking heavily, and dealing with the occasional fish loss was common and acceptable practice.

Much more of the stock back then was also wild caught, preservation of the environment as far as tropical fish were concerned was unheard of. This gave a larger, and more sound genetic pool for the species that were sold, as opposed to the mass bred species found today. We're better with the environment now, but often have genetically inferior fish compared to what there used to be.


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## easeltine

Tolak, 

I do have to get a water testing kit due to the problems I have, that is the truth. 

The fish tanks were all as you said metal frames. The 29 gallon we had was thought of as a huge tank. 

I did bring that idea up that the fish were genetically superior back then, but another poster totally did not agree with what I was saying. Many of the fish we had were caught in the wild back then, and they seemed more aggressive and stronger to me than fish we get in the store nowadays. I bet one could even put a couple bettas in a 30 gallon now, (not that I would try it).


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## jaysee

In a large enough tank, anything is possible


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## easeltine

I know, off the subject, 

Jaysee,
How big a tank do you need to keep two bettas in? I read about a gal that claimed she had 2 male bettas in a 30 gallon. Is that possible?


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## Tolak

I'm not going to argue against the test kit, it can't hurt, you just have to realize the limitations. Many of your hardcore NW cichlid keepers try for wild caught or F1 fish just for the reasons you mentioned. Your more serious breeders will outcross to wild stock when need be, then breed back to obtain their goal, with a fish that is stronger genetically. 

The fish that are commonly sold in corporate owned & run shops usually come from a commercial outfit, many of which are in Florida or California, who do not give a care about the inbreeding & genetics behind the fish they sell. The Asian imports are just as bad. Your smaller independent shops are the ones who will deal with local breeders, these are the ones who will outcross & such for a stronger fish.


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## jaysee

easeltine said:


> I know, off the subject,
> 
> Jaysee,
> How big a tank do you need to keep two bettas in? I read about a gal that claimed she had 2 male bettas in a 30 gallon. Is that possible?


Depends on the bettas. Anything is possible. Is it likely to be duplicated? Probably not. Is it something that one should try and duplicate? Probably not. My question is how long had they been together when she claimed success? I see people say "this works" and "that works" when the fish had only been together for a week. As if that's an indication of how the next several years will go. 

I think the smallest I would even be tempted to put 2 male bettas in is a 55. But really, why try to keep males together when keeping females together is a much more likely to work?


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## easeltine

I have never tried African cichlids before, just Scalare/Angle Fish. 
I bred Black Lace Angle Fish as a kid, and again they seemed more aggressive than current ones I have bought at the Pet Store a few years ago. 

I have had less success with cheap fish from Pets stores like PetSmart or Petco than I have from most independent stores. There also isn't that much of a difference in price either. One of those guys had a sale on Red Wagtail Play for $1.00 a fish, and then I walked into an independent store and they had almost full grown beautiful colored ones for $1.49 each. Those are both cheap prices!


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## BWG

Keep bettas together gets a whole lot easier when it's a species other than B. splendens


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## easeltine

My experience with Betta has showed me that they can be a weird fish. I have had some in a Community tank that were pretty aggressive and some that get along fine. I have not bought females for years. They are probably nicer looking than they used to be considering all the breeding for that fish?


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## easeltine

Good point on the Betta, I forget that there is other species. Oh, that's right, "To Russia With Love," give the dead one to the cat. LOL!


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## Agent13

easeltine said:


> Many of the fish we had were caught in the wild back then, and they seemed more aggressive and stronger to me than fish we get in the store nowadays. .


I can't deny this. I keep F1 (mostly and if not, close to that) African cichlids and have noticed when I veer from the close to wilds they behave different and are weaker it seems. But I do recommend having a test kit on hand for 2 reasons.. 1) when something goes wrong it may help you understand why 2) when setting up a new aquarium it helps you know where in the cycle you are. But after you get it well established .. Well at least for me.. an then after the cycle is done and nothing new is gong on I may test for fun every few months...maybe. You just need to know your fish and their behaviors
..


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## easeltine

I know you are right! I have had serious problems with my water quality. 

The situation of a test kit may even be more needed since I have just built one of these CO2 generators for my swordplants from a 2 Liter and I have heard that it can screw up the PH of the tank. I have used them before, but I could be making my aquarium even worse.


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## Agent13

Nooo. just get root tabs for swords! They are root feeders and once you know this they are one of the easiest to keep plants...hell I have runners that are now full plants in my little 16 that I need to get rid of and none of that high tech crazy stuff


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## easeltine

Ok, I will look for that! I have 10 sword plants right now and they are breaking into little plants but not growing large.


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## easeltine

The tank set-up I have right now is pretty screwy...

I bought it used, and it may be cursed. It is a 30 Gallon Tall acrylic tank that was used as a saltwater tank by the previous owner. It had some scratches on the inside due to him cleaning off the algae too vigourously. While he was cleaning off the algae he was stung by one of his Lionfish he kept in the tank. There was no antidote for the poison in any hospital and he said that the only relief he got from the pain of the poison was to pour boiling water on it. 

It has a nice cabinet with a door, at the bottom it is water damaged. Not having black pain I put black shoe polish on the exposed chunk of water swollen particle board. 

The top is an Eclipse 2. The lighting broke so I bought a round under-the-cabinet 9 watt CFL. This brand has a habit of getting too hot, so I used gorilla glue to glue on Computer Heat Sinks to difuse the heat. 

At the present time I am using these pond cut-out carbon like things as a filter element for the Eclpse 2. 

Gravel, Driftwood, Seashells and some small. It is not bad lookng. The background helps the fish show their colors.


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## Tolak

Watch that particle board, once it gets wet it is nowhere near as structurally sound as it was. You can always reinforce it with some 2x4's & such, a leaking 55 & a melting stand is what got me into building my own stands & racks long ago. One side sank almost an inch, talk about a situation. Older sturdy furniture can often be pressed into service as a stand, this can often be found on the curb, battered but serviceable. I have a couple old night stands as end tables in the basement, yes, next to that couch, that have been used as stands for 20's in the past.

Look into using cheap craft/pillow stuffing from WalMart as media, it's a staple in fishrooms, filter floss. You want the cheapest stuff, no flame retardants. 

So why slate bottoms on these old metal frame relics? Way back they used to heat them with small oil burning lamps, glass would crack. This was well before my time, shortly after the discovery of fire, but before the wheel was invented.


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## jaysee

Radiant heat - very interesting


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## rickey

The Goldfsh and its Culure 1902 
Out dated, full of information that were accepted standard practice at a time when there were no pets stores, but the chapter on building you own aquariums is interesting. It really make you wonder how this hobby ever survived. 

R


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## DKRST

Couldn't resist chiming in on this one.
Problems with today's fish (my personal hypothesis based on my re-entry into the hobby in 2011). In the early 1980's I owned an aquarium cleaning and setup business, had no issues with fish then and never quarantined anything. Only disease issue then was ick.

1) genetic issues due to inbreeding depression, an issue in some species.
2) fish "back in the day" may have taken weeks to go from the wild to the local fish shop, with any weaklings dying from illness during the very stressful shipping process (pre "Fed-Ex"). This left only the very strongest specimens for sale!
3) DISEASE - recirculated central filter systems moving disease through multiple shop tanks, massive aquaculture and rapid shipping get sick fish to stores and into our homes. Why should the big-box shops care? I have personally spent >$20 in meds to save a $2.50 fish I purchased. Not a bad business model if you sell sick fish and then the meds to treat them! Went through literally 15 juvenile angels from a big box store before I started medicating the QT tank automatically, then lost zero after that.

More fish, better prices, but at a cost...

Regarding test kits. Helpful, but not a requirement unless you need to adjust the water for particular species and/or are impatient to see if your tank has cycled fully!


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## rickey

DKRST said:


> .
> Regarding test kits. Helpful, but not a requirement unless you need to adjust the water for particular species and/or are impatient to see if your tank has cycled fully!


You have to admit our understanding of the hobby as change radially in the passed 30 or so years. 
The livestock doesn't seem as healthy as in years past. Living and working in the heart of the fish farming area I understand the business model. My thinking for the pass 20 or so year has been to rise a few very high quality Goldfish ( around 500 so a year) that I can sell at what some would think are absurdly high prices. I sell out every year and it pays the bills for my hobby farm.

R


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## DKRST

rickey said:


> You have to admit our understanding of the hobby as change radially in the passed 30 or so years.


Yep, but I still miss my old wooden-handled nets :-(. 
I do water changes much, much, more often now than I did then, with much better planted tank results now than I had 30 years ago.

Kudos for keeping up the quality!


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## beaslbob

interesting thread.

I developed "my" methods after reading a freshwater and marine aquariums article in 1979 by Robert Gasser. and have never looked back.

It worked then and works now.

With no water changes and in about 1/2 dozen cities in the US as I traveled around in the air force.

I also use no mechanical filters or circulation.

which is why my advice is worth at most .02


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## rickey

DKRST said:


> Yep, but I still miss my old wooden-handled nets


DIDO, So years ago I was buying up a lot of the 60 era aquarium and equipment I think I still have an air driven HOB filter hanging around.

r


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## easeltine

Beaslbob, 

You said, "no mechanical filters or circulation," does that mean you are using a Bottom filter with an air pump, Bottom Box filter with an air pump, or side filters with an air pump. Do you use a Sponge Filter? What exactly do you use? 

Rickey, 

You used the terminology, "HOB," is that a Bottom Filter?


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## jaysee

HOB is a hang on back - a power filter.


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## easeltine

Like the unbreakable Aquaclear? Ok, thank you!


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## beaslbob

easeltine said:


> Beaslbob,
> 
> You said, "no mechanical filters or circulation," does that mean you are using a Bottom filter with an air pump, Bottom Box filter with an air pump, or side filters with an air pump. Do you use a Sponge Filter? What exactly do you use?
> 
> Rickey,
> Imeant i use no filter at all. the only electrical is the light
> You used the terminology, "HOB," is that a Bottom Filter?


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jaysee

Haha I didn't want to answer for you ;-)


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## easeltine

Wow Beaslbob! 

So, just Fish, Plants and Light?

One of the large pumps my mom and dad had when I was really young was called, "The Silent Giant." 

We had brass valves for the tubing to go to the different tanks. The first type of filter we used was the bottom/undergravel filter. Those work, but they get dirty. 

Then we had the hang on the side using with the air pump that you put charcoal and floss on top of it. I recall that you would start that almost by suction. 
This works as well or better that any of those Aquaclear/Penguin/Wisper side power filters in my opinion, but the old Aquaclear power filters would last a very long time. I think in one of the 5 gallon tanks we had about 100 guppies...lol...we had so many that my mom just let the angelfish have a feast one day. 

My parents never used a bottom box filter, I have used that a few years ago, or the sponge filters. I have never used a Canister filter in my life. The filter I currently have on my 30 gallon tall is a Marineland Eclipse 2, and it is very quiet. They don't sell those very often due to the price. I got it with the used tank for a very inexpensive price as a set. 

***
My mom, my daughter, and I each have had the same type of dream. The angelfish come out of the tank and start swimming in the air towards us.


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## beaslbob

Yep just the fish plants and light. Actually my current 55g with a couple of goldfish doesn't even have the light. but I do use a heater in winter as it is on a back pourch (2 sides in the outside of the house). It got cold enough here there was once a sheet of ice on the top. :lol:

I'm organizing the garage (an on going multi year effort) I found a couple of the old silent giant pumps. And there is someone on the web that still rebuilds them. they were the first pump to use silicone diaphram. And had a lifetime warranty and would be rebuilt at no charge.

I also had an old air powered hob filter.

the good ole days. :lol:


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## Agent13

easeltine said:


> Like the unbreakable Aquaclear? Ok, thank you!


Well technically.. Not true. Dropped one and cracked a corner of the outflow lol (still works!! but don't use it )


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## easeltine

I bought a ph Test Kit today and found that the aquarium ph is running at 7.2 and the tap water is running at 7.6 or above, (very blue).

Now I am thinking that the Anglefish, since they prefer 6.5-6.8 may have actually died from a ph change. 

What do you think? I have this stuff called proper ph 6.5 should I use it?


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## Tolak

Don't touch pH chemicals, I breed angels at 7.6.


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## easeltine

So, it is possible to keep these fish at that level? At least there is not too much difference between the aquarium and the tap water. I can barely see the difference in color.


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## Tolak

Angels at that pH? Sure, been doing it for years, pulled a spawn from a pair of silver veils this morning, got a pair of hybrid blacks that are looking tubey & sparring a bit, so probably tomorrow for them.


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## Hallyx

easeltine said:


> I bought a ph Test Kit today and found that the aquarium ph is running at 7.2 and the tap water is running at 7.6 or above, *(very blue).*


Sounds like you're using the _low range_ pH test to read pH of your tapwater that would more accurately be measured by the _high_ range test....not that it makes much difference.


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## easeltine

Yes, it was the low range test kit. I just didn't realize I would get a reading like this.


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## beaslbob

easeltine said:


> Yes, it was the low range test kit. I just didn't realize I would get a reading like this.


If your tap water has a pH above 7.6 then the high range test kit is appropriate.

PH and other tank parameters IMHO are more a function of the tank environment and process then the amount of water changes. Unless you are doing very large daily changes.

that is especially true of pH where carbon dioxide is a determining factor. Once in the tank, carbon dioxide increases lowering the pH. If you had a tank environment that sucks out the carbon dioxide, like live plants, then the tank pH will rise.

Also IMHO you should measure pH just before lights out.

my .02


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## easeltine

I am currently adding CO2 via a DIY2 Liter Bottle. There has not been any notice of ph change yet.


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## keepsmiling

Even the best of the best can have a tank crash.
Steve Weast..*sigh*
Best to not get too confident or complacent. 
In my opinion all fish deserve the best you can give them, whether they cost $1.00 or $150.00.


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## keepsmiling

beaslbob said:


> If your tap water has a pH above 7.6 then the high range test kit is appropriate.
> 
> PH and other tank parameters IMHO are more a function of the tank environment and process then the amount of water changes. Unless you are doing very large daily changes.
> 
> that is especially true of pH where carbon dioxide is a determining factor. Once in the tank, carbon dioxide increases lowering the pH. If you had a tank environment that sucks out the carbon dioxide, like live plants, then the tank pH will rise.
> 
> Also IMHO you should measure pH just before lights out.
> 
> my .02


WOW>>Just noticed this user name! Could this really be you? I haven't seen you around in oh...a decade? 
My user name has usually been 'waterfaller1'


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## beaslbob

keepsmiling said:


> WOW>>Just noticed this user name! Could this really be you? I haven't seen you around in oh...a decade?
> My user name has usually been 'waterfaller1'


 
Yeppers. LOL

SWF and RC I believe.:lol:

Worth much more then .02


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## Flear

i'm skipping ahead

i have a 29 gallon, ... last i changed water was ... i had an ammonia spike (didn't realize it) as the PH shifted and it killed half the tank before i did an 80% water change (ammonia test kit still red significant readings)

before that, well months again since a water change, just topping up the tank to handle evaporated water.

i treat my tank like a science experiment, ... i've added greenwater, , ... it died  i can't bring it back in the tank 

i've started regular clipping & pruning of my plants, ... then i dry them, then i cut them up, then i add them to a bucket where they break down, i test the ammonia readings, i stir things up till all the decomposed plant matter is mixed, i add this to the greenwater bucket, i take water from the greenwater bucket & add it to my tank, ... i still can't get greenwater started again 

it's been, ... 3 or 4 months since the ammonia spike.

i've been adding PH up as a source of potassium (potassium is actually really hard to find to dose a tank with)
i've added epsom salts for magnesium

still no water changes
my PH was beyond the limits of what my PH test kit allows, ...it's slowly dropping, the plants are slowly sucking back the potassium from the PH up, 

i've got algae all over (various types)

i'm doing what everyone else would keel over from a heart attack from

no cleaning going on in the tank, ... an HOB filter, that i have taken to cleaning into the same water that is breaking down the removed plant clippings.

it's currently a tank based solely on bacterial activity.

wait, my calcium levels are too high, ... i'm removing snail shells so they stop dissolving into the water column (will also help lower the PH, over a very long stretch of time)

in time, i'll see about getting daphnia/moina/rotifers (something) in there for live food, as well as blackworms (more live food, more activity in the substrate)

there's nothing i'm doing that agrees with current practice
there is no chemical filtration, strickly bacterial

what comes out, goes back in, ... mostly because i realized at one point, pruning plants is removing nutrients, which is not good when things are already out of balance.

so i'm going to side with the OP, what we're doing now, ... isn't needed, and we're doing it anyway, because someone else has said, and we don't really understand what's going on, but we're doing what we're told because it's what everyone else does.

i've got 1 tank, 2 buckets, so that when things do get added to the tank, they're safe again.

and also found, ... the water from the decomposed bucket (for lack of a better term) has the same high PH as the tank, ... next round i'm thinking of adding some peat moss to the mix to balance the PH going through the system.


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## beaslbob

Interesting experiment. How's it going?

FWIW I disagree with your observation that whatever is going on is bacterial. To me it is bacterial and plant action.

my .02


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## jaysee

Chemical filtration has nothing to do with detoxifying the water of ammonia and nitrite, unless it's left in there for so long that beneficial bacteria colonizes it. Which it will do.

Problems maintaining a steady pH are probably due to your water change schedule.

Your assessment of why people do things now is no different than the reason people did things then.


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## Flear

the tank is going well, still 90% research, made harder as it explores avenues not talked about, or topics that the hobby has overrun with it's own propaganda

well, bacterial as much as breaking down things and making nutrients available for plants, reducing ammonia to nitrates for plants, etc.

i'm missing a huge area in the food chain that would really help things. one day, just not today, too many hungry mouths to feed in the tank would decimate live food cultures in the tank

---

my water PH, ... is very stable working on bringing it to where i want it, but it's stable.
when it was 6.5 i wanted it to be higher, i was doing stuff to intentionally raise it higher, and the tank resisted me for months, right now the only shift it's got is plants are slowly consuming nutrients in the water column that are affecting the PH, it's stable, very very stable.

i have no chemical filters, not purchased, just bacterial activity

the reasons people do things now vs. then, ... mostly marketing, that's always been the same, ... marketing seems to trump stability and understanding a system

Edit:
my water change schedule, ... i don't have one, i don't change the water, i just add to it.


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## BWG

[5:50:26 PM] Cory Leed: OK...I've been trying to resist, but I'm bored. My being bored leads to bad things like me asking the following question. What propaganda? 

Potassium compounds are very simple to find. I use them. Have I fallen for the propaganda? Is the pH UP the propaganda? Everything is propaganda?

There is some actual marketing and propaganda in the hobby, but I think you are going a more than a bit overboard in listing everything you consider new fangled to be useless. It's especially confusing since you're using pH UP which I would never recommend.


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