# future tank?



## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

In theory could glofish, zebra danios, white cloud minnows and dalmation mollies live together?


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## kane chisholme (Mar 17, 2011)

I don't see why not.. Though some people might say the faster fish would annoy the mollies, but I think they would be fine


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

I'm daydreaming an empty tank I've got. So if you've got any suggestions for a 20 high I wouldn't mind.


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## kane chisholme (Mar 17, 2011)

Well what kind of fish do you like??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

Well first of all I have neons and a betta. The fact that I couldn't have 90% of what the stores sell made me want them way more. I can't say that I'm set on anything in particular, and there's nothing I absolutely wouldn't do. So long as its not a $5-10 fish I'm willing to try it. I'm not experienced enough to spend that kind of money on a fish since most of those have to be schooled. With that list I was trying to pick smaller fish that would school together to prevent having 5-6 of one kind (I just think Dalmation Mollies are pretty and don't care if they can spawn or not).


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## kane chisholme (Mar 17, 2011)

What about swordtails?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

I don't mind them either. I'm rather partial to flashy colored/patterned fish. My original plan was panda cories and danios...clearly that has changed.


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## kane chisholme (Mar 17, 2011)

Cool. Well whatever you decide on, good luck for you and your fish. I'm sure you'll do a great job
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

If I ever manage to make up my mind, or get a job...


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## kane chisholme (Mar 17, 2011)

Fair enough hahaha
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## martian123 (May 21, 2011)

right now i have two dalmatian mollies and one is just soooooooo agressive with all of my other community fish

i really dont suggest them at all


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

alidawn15 said:


> In theory could glofish, zebra danios, white cloud minnows and dalmation mollies live together?


My answer to your initial question is, no. Water parameters are different. Primarily temperature first. Molly should be warm, no less than 78F. By contrast, the White Cloud Mountain Minnow is a col water fish, room temperature or very low 70's, no higher long-term or it will literally burn out. The Zebra Danio and Glofish [which is a man-made genetically modified form of the Zebra] do best mid-70's.

Then there is the hardness and corresponding pH. Danio are somewhat accommodating in this, but Molly must be in hard water. Some suggest brackish, which won't hurt the molly but would hurt the others, but this is not essential for the molly.

Second issue is tank size. Danio and Minnow are active swimmers, molly is not. So the molly would do better in a 20g high than either of the others. A 20g long would suit the Danio better.

Byron.


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

Thanks Byron. I already have the tank since it was just sitting empty in someones basement. I was hoping to run it without a heater at least in the summer. We had two days where it was in the 90s and my 10 gallon stayed at 80 degrees (without a/c running). Would I be better off doing something like the less active tetras?


Edit: I know I have access to glofish, danios, platys and mollies within an okay distance, but i don't think they have minnows anyway.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

alidawn15 said:


> Thanks Byron. I already have the tank since it was just sitting empty in someones basement. I was hoping to run it without a heater at least in the summer. We had two days where it was in the 90s and my 10 gallon stayed at 80 degrees (without a/c running). Would I be better off doing something like the less active tetras?
> 
> 
> Edit: I know I have access to glofish, danios, platys and mollies within an okay distance, but i don't think they have minnows anyway.


There are lots of fish that would be ideal in a 20g high. You may have to drive somewhere initially to get them, but in the end you will have a better aquarium with suitable fish which means healthier, more interesting, and enjoyable.

Earlier in this thread you mention colourful fish, so with that in mind, there are some options depending upon water parameters; this becomes more important with some of these fish because they will be wild caught.

Soft, slightly acidic [pH will tend to lower naturally, if the hardness is not high, so soft to medium hard tap water will usually work its way down for these fish]: pencilfish [several in our profiles, any will work except Nannostomus beckfordi which is more active], Ember Tetra, dwarf rasbora like Boraras brigittae, Scarlet Badis, pygmy sparkling gourami. Dwarf and/or average Cory species for substrate, Twig Catfish, even a Whiptail Catfish. Otos, a small pleco such as a Bristlenose Pleco. Thinking slightly larger upper fish, some of the Hyphessobrycon tetra in the rosy clade like the Black Phantom tetra, Roberts Tetra.

Basic, medium hard to hard water: Some of the foregoing manage fine, and there are fish that need this higher hardness like Dwarf Emerald Rasbora, Celestial Pearl Danio, the endler livebearers. These are all smallish fish, so a larger group of 2 or 3, with substrate fish.

Byron.


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

My ph is 6.8 and according to petsmart my water is hard at 150. I found a lfs an hour away that I really want to check out. They had good reviews on the internet and I'm hoping they'll buy mystery snails if mine produce any. As more of a personal choice would it be wise to buy a used $5 2.5 gallon for quarantine instead of the .5 gallons I've been using?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

alidawn15 said:


> My ph is 6.8 and according to petsmart my water is hard at 150. I found a lfs an hour away that I really want to check out. They had good reviews on the internet and I'm hoping they'll buy mystery snails if mine produce any. As more of a personal choice would it be wise to buy a used $5 2.5 gallon for quarantine instead of the .5 gallons I've been using?


The hardness at 150 has to be ppm (parts per million), so that equates to 8-9 dGH, what we term medium hard. You can go either way with that, but a 6.8 pH suggests soft water fish would be best. Livebearers and such will need more hardness to be healthy, and that means increasing the water hardness with minerals which would proportionally raise the pH. I would suggest soft water fish for less issues.

A QT is always good, and the larger the better up to a point. I would not go over a 20g for a QT, but a 10g or even 5g will suffice.


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

Do pygmy sparkling gourami have the same aggression issues bettas do?

I'll check to see which ones are available but I think I've come up with a possible list to choose from.

Cherry Barb
Glowlight Tetra
Lamp Eye Tetra
Flame Tetra
Bloodfin Tetra
Harlequin Rasbora
Black Phantom Tetra-are they schooling fish?
Tiger Barbs-are they too big?

Ideally I'd like to have a selection that works well enough to have only two or three of each. If the cost difference isn't too much I'd even be willing to do sand and a few cories. Basically I want the fish my betta keeps me from having, that are pretty to look at, and aren't too delicate.

P.S. I blame you Byron for the fact that my hornwort has turned into a monster. haha.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

> Do pygmy Sparkling Gourami have the same aggression issues bettas do?


Yes but no. All gourami males are territorial, and some species can be rough (similar to a Betta) but these are not. I have had them for years, currently I have a group of 7 that spawn regularly, fry sometimes survive too. The males are territorial as I said, and they chase each other, protecting the bubblenest and such, but with floating plants and a proper environment damage is almost never done.



> I'll check to see which ones are available but I think I've come up with a possible list to choose from.
> 
> Cherry Barb
> Glowlight Tetra
> ...


All of these are shoaling fish that must be in groups, minimum is usually 6, more is always better if space allows, some must have more. Keep the numbers in mind when selecting because it is important for several reasons including the health of the fish and compatibility.

Last first, forget Tiger Barb. You do not want to introduce this fish in a community tank unless it is large and the tankmates are robust. This fish in naturally aggressive and the probability is trouble, esp in small groups and small spaces. Read our profile [click the shaded name] to see why. A group of 8 on their own in no smaller than a 30g is recommended. They are also more active than the others listed, which means tank length is more important.

Bloodfin Tetra is another risk; the species in this particular genus are fin nippers to some extent. Combined with something like gourami, even the pygmy, would not be wise. The gourami would be stressed and possibly chewed up.

Any of the others are fine. All are less active swimmers, so the 20g high will work. A group of 7-9 of whichever would be my suggestion. Some are better with more, like the rasbora [this is one of the most peaceful of fish, and it is a great "schooling" fish] and the Phantom--the displays of the males is simple but very beautiful. The more in the group, the more evident such natural behaviours will be, and that is a great joy in this hobby--to observe fish behaving naturally.

For a 20g planted tank, I would even suggest two groups of 7 from your list, plus the substrate fish (corys, whatever). Weekly partial water changes of 40-50% and the plants should be fine.



> P.S. I blame you Byron for the fact that my hornwort has turned into a monster. haha.


Most of us have this plant fall to pieces.:lol:

Byron.


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

I ran across another thread about the tiger barb right after I said that :-? It'll most likely be sand along with the bit of gravel that came with it, and I've learned to love plants (except the jungle val that won't stay planted). Oh and my Sagittaria Subulata has a runner on it :-D


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

There you are. You'll be tossing out plants before long.;-)


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

I'll be giving things away to his brother soon. My hornwort is doing the exact opposite of falling apart. I had to cut it so it would stay where I wanted it. It when from less than baseball sized to being at least softball sized in a month. So would you just not do a filter in the 20 at all?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

alidawn15 said:


> I'll be giving things away to his brother soon. My hornwort is doing the exact opposite of falling apart. I had to cut it so it would stay where I wanted it. It when from less than baseball sized to being at least softball sized in a month. So would you just not do a filter in the 20 at all?


I like filters in tanks. I tried a 10g without, after a few months bought a sponge. Water is much clearer.

I was just re-thinking the fish. I might suggest just one group. Looking at my 20g tall, i can't really see two groups of 7 of the medium tetra. A group of 7 of the rasbora, with 4-5 corys, would be lovely. And a group of 5 sparkling gourami. And for some more colour, you could look at one of the "dwarf" species with these, say Ember Tetra. Or Dario dario, these really are beautiful fish.

I also missed the Lamp Eye, which i assume is the same as our Beacon Tetra. These are a bit too active for a 20g, and they get large.


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## alidawn15 (Jan 31, 2011)

To be honesty cories are the only fish I'd think about paying that much for with as little experience as I have now. I've found a place online where I could get 6 panda cories for $15 plus shipping. Are the gold barbs petco has on their website a variety like the cherry barb? I'd prefer the non-substrate fish to be brightly colored or sparkly in some way. Also, would there still be room for a mystery snail or ghost shrimp as I'm not sure you mean whether there wouldn't be swimming room or if the tank would just be completely stocked.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

alidawn15 said:


> To be honesty cories are the only fish I'd think about paying that much for with as little experience as I have now. I've found a place online where I could get 6 panda cories for $15 plus shipping. Are the gold barbs petco has on their website a variety like the cherry barb? I'd prefer the non-substrate fish to be brightly colored or sparkly in some way. Also, would there still be room for a mystery snail or ghost shrimp as I'm not sure you mean whether there wouldn't be swimming room or if the tank would just be completely stocked.


Gold Barb is a different fish, larger and not suited; we call it the Golden Barb, see profile.

Panda corys are ironically one of the most sensitive of the cory species. Make sure the tank is *well* established before they are added. I have lost a lot of these over the years, mainly due to introducing them to un-established tanks. I've had a trio for 2 years now, the longest yet for this species with me, though one of them died last week, no idea why.


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