# Ryukin Goldfish has swimbladder issue, Petsmart no help..



## green2727 (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi ~
I've had my Ryukin goldfish for a couple months now, I've previously kept fish. She's a medium size. In a 20 gallon tank, alone, with 20gallon filter. Tank temp 69.7 F, ammonia tested yesterday 0, 0 nitrite, 7.6PH, we have hard water here. I don't have a nitrate kit, is the nitrite an indication? Should I get a nitrate kit too?

Petsmart told me to give her Omega-One goldfish small pellets. Later, she got swimbladder and floated completely upside down for a while (for 30 seconds, I thought she died), then it got better. I now know fancy goldies are prone to this. Petsmart guy recommended HBH Super Soft Spirulina that helps their goldies when they get like this. I tried it - it make her WORSE. Even after soaking it, it still is bad. So I am not using that anymore. 

I tried the pea tactic and it works wonders, but I am afraid to feed her peas ALL the time, I am sure it's lacking in something they need. Today I tried the Omega-One food presoaked again and so far, no floating. 

Is there a premium food out there that prevents swimbladder? Can a fish recover from this? Should I supplement peas daily with the fish food or leafy greens?

And I am very confused. The back of these fish food containers says 'feed 3 times daily, as much as can be consumed in 2 minutes'. I think that leads a novice to overfeeding. I feed twice a day and am giving her 6 pellets per meal + peas. Is that okay? After the 6 pellets she won't eat anymore and it's waste on the bottom of the tank. 

Should I give her some freeze-dried bloodworms as a treat? Or no..?

I do a water change every 2-3 weeks and replace the filter every month and a half. Is this good?

Thanks in advance.


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## willow (Sep 9, 2006)

hello and welcome. 
the filter shoould only need washing in old tank water,when you do the water change.
you can completly cange one filter pad at a time,leaving a long gap between changes.
i would advise for any Goldfish that the food is always pre soaked,so the fish don't gulp
in a tonn of air when feeding.
to help with food on the bottom,only feed very small amounts,and twice a day is plenty,
haha they can be such piggies when it comes to food,they would eat all day.
the other question was about the Nitrate tester,yes i'd get one.
the kit most if not all of us here use is the API master test kit. 
hope i've been a help.


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## SolaceTiger (Oct 4, 2008)

I could be wrong so someone correct me if so, but I think you need a stronger filter and a bigger tank for one thing. Get a filter that's rated for more than your tank size. Not sure how to help with the swimbladder issues.


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

I also have a goldfish with swimbladder disease. He has had it 4 mounths now. I give him peas daily and a small amount of flakes in the morning. From what I have read, 1 pellet a day is enough to keep a goldfish healthy and growing. Jungle Labs makes Fungus Clear which claims to cure swimbladder disease. They sell it at DoctorsFosterandSmith.com. I think I may try it.


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## Chrisseh (Aug 24, 2008)

There are no preventative foods. From what I understand peas are the only treatment that yields good results. I would keep feeding peas, she doesn't need much.

Your tank size and filter sound good to me. Although, I would suggest gravel vac-ing more often. Taking out about 10 - 15% each time. That way your fish gets more clean water.

I hope your fishy feels better!


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## green2727 (Dec 8, 2008)

Chrisseh said:


> There are no preventative foods. From what I understand peas are the only treatment that yields good results. I would keep feeding peas, she doesn't need much.
> 
> Your tank size and filter sound good to me. Although, I would suggest gravel vac-ing more often. Taking out about 10 - 15% each time. That way your fish gets more clean water.
> 
> I hope your fishy feels better!


Hi,

I've heard 10 gallons per goldfish is enough, but I surely hope 20 gal. is good enough for one goldfish, medium size. I don't have any big decorations in the tank, only a few fake plants. I may eventually get a 40 gallon filter, as I have heard that double the tank size is better from many people. Petsmart said 2 goldfish this size would be okay in 20 gallons, man are they always off. Whatever it takes to sell more fish! 

I did the peas and it helps when she's floaty. I figured out it can't be actual swimbladder because it went away for a day now. I heard actual swimbladder can be permanent. It must have been constipation/bloatiness. The peas got her back to normal. Then I soak her food twice a day for 20 minutes before dumping it in. So far, after 2 feedings, no floatiness after giving her the soaked food. 

I setup my calendar to vacuum/siphon every 11 days. If I vacuum every 11 days, should I take out 15% or 20%, or how much? 

She's doing better already! 

Thanks.


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## aperfectoblong (Nov 20, 2008)

just for everyone, DO NOT ASK FOR ANY ADVICE IN PETCO OR PETSMART, they're amatures and will only mislead you and you're fish is gonna die. better go to a store where they specialize / breed fish people who work there atleast know what theyre doing.


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## Kim (Apr 30, 2008)

Well, swim bladder disorder can be caused by bloating/constipation because both these conditions put pressure on the swim bladder which leads to the symptoms that you see. If what you are doing seems to work, then I would continue doing it. There was a post in the freshwater pictures section where a goldfish was eating some brocoli. Your fish may like this as well.

I think your new maintenance schedule sounds much better. I would do a 20% change personally. Your nitrate test levels will really tell you how much you should be changing and how often to keep nitrates as low as possible. Even though your tank is cycled, nitrates can still build up and cause problems for your fish, so finding a good schedule by testing nitrate levels will be the best for your fish.

And yeah, pet store people for the most part know nothing about fish. You wouldn't belive how much bad advice I've gotten or heard of from those places. I don't even bother asking them ANYTHING anymore. Just do your own research, walk in, get your stuff, and walk out


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## Chrisseh (Aug 24, 2008)

I work for PetSmart. I don't give bad advice. I usually know the answer (not guess) and if I don't I look it up in a book. Otherwise I tell my customers I don't know, or don't have enough information to help them. Mom and Pop stores aren't all that great, either. I have seen goldfish with bloat not just in the tanks but decorated and prazed, being called the "upside down goldfish". I have it on good authority that nothing was done to help the fish. So, I would judge each store separatly and not just lump everyone together. Sorry about my off topic rant, it's just a hot button of mine. On a lighter note, I am glad that fishy is feeling better.


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

Chrisseh, my petsmart has 2 great people working in the fish department. Think the store has a high turnover rate with their employees. Always new and untrained people working there. Sounds like you are one of the good ones! Keep up the great work! I bet you have saved a lot of fish lives, and you can be proud of that!


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## Chrisseh (Aug 24, 2008)

Twistersmom said:


> Chrisseh, my petsmart has 2 great people working in the fish department. Think the store has a high turnover rate with their employees. Always new and untrained people working there. Sounds like you are one of the good ones! Keep up the great work! I bet you have saved a lot of fish lives, and you can be proud of that!


Thank you

Yes, we do have high turn over rate. On top of that my department is the hardest part of the store. It really takes a long while to get used to it. About 3 months to get a decent understanding of fish, even longer to have "actual" fish knowledge. But I guess it is the same in any pet store.


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## Kim (Apr 30, 2008)

Chrisseh, sorry if I offended you  . That is why I always say "most" because I know that there are knowledgeable people working there, I actually may try to get a job at one of them for the summer. I did meet one guy once who actually seemed to know his stuff. He was worried when I bought some cories for the first fish for my 15 gallon until I told him that I had already fishless cycled it  He also told me that he keeps saltwater setups and is also a member of a fishforum. The worst part is that the fish department of that store closed  And, that was the one store that usually had fish that were in good health and carried other good stuff as well. I mean, they still have the dry goods section, but what I really need is a good place to get fish! Anyway, I guess the reason that I am so cynical toward people asking advice from pet stores, is because that guy is the ONLY knowledgeable person that I have met yet! And, there are so many posts on here where people have been gived just down right dangerous advice from bad pet store employees. So, I'm sorry if I offended you, that comment was certainly not intended to you or anyone else who actually does the research to do their job right. Forgive me?


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## Chrisseh (Aug 24, 2008)

Kim,
It's all good. I just am looking out for slander against a company that has been so good to me. I know that sometimes our fish are crap (I blame the breeders) and I know that my co-workewrs give bad advice (like a heater for an out door pond!). I just don't want people to start "playa hatin'" on Petsmart when every store is so different. I still live by a few suggestions when entering Petsmart.
1. Ask simple answer questions to see if the associate knows what they are doing.
2. Ask the associate if they like fish (or whatever animal you are there for)
3. Ask them which one is their favorite? (extremly helpful when getting small animals)


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## green2727 (Dec 8, 2008)

Kim said:


> Well, swim bladder disorder can be caused by bloating/constipation because both these conditions put pressure on the swim bladder which leads to the symptoms that you see. If what you are doing seems to work, then I would continue doing it. There was a post in the freshwater pictures section where a goldfish was eating some brocoli. Your fish may like this as well.
> 
> I think your new maintenance schedule sounds much better. I would do a 20% change personally. Your nitrate test levels will really tell you how much you should be changing and how often to keep nitrates as low as possible. Even though your tank is cycled, nitrates can still build up and cause problems for your fish, so finding a good schedule by testing nitrate levels will be the best for your fish.
> 
> And yeah, pet store people for the most part know nothing about fish. You wouldn't belive how much bad advice I've gotten or heard of from those places. I don't even bother asking them ANYTHING anymore. Just do your own research, walk in, get your stuff, and walk out



Hi Kim,

I am changing the water every 11 days, 20% change. Today I just did a fish test strip because she is hanging around the bottom. Usually did this just in the morning (I think she was sleeping?), but today she is doing it all day. She only swims and moves when I get near the tank because I am 'meal time'. I fed her some peas today. I am still soaking her food before giving it to her - but some days - even after soaking it - she gets floaty and was on her side a few seconds!

Results: 

Nitrite = 0 
Nitrate = Faint 20 ppm
Hardness = 150 hard
Chlorine = 0 
Alkalinity = 80-120
pH = 7.8

Should nitrate always be zero or does it go up and down a little naturally? 

Hardness - I do have some white mineral deposits on some equipment, but cleaned it (with water) before putting her in the tank. The test strip paper says 'hardness affects fish ability to maintain correct balance between internal body fluids & external environment' Should I be worried? 

If she's hanging around the bottom of the tank, does that means it's the beginning of the end or ...? I am doing a water change today. 

Thanks everyone...


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

My goldfish with swim bladder disorder has been hanging around the bottom for a very long time now. ( 4 or 5 months) Dont think it means your fish is anywhere close to dying yet. Cant even count how many times i thought mine was dead, only to see it quickly wake up when I approach. Your water sounds great! you are always going to have some nitrates, 20 ppm is a good number! I just give my guy peas every night and a small amont of food in the morning. Sound like thats about all we can do for them.


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## Kim (Apr 30, 2008)

In a cycled tank you will always have some levels of nitrates. With your fish's condition I would aim to keep it at 20 ppm or lower. Right now your water sounds fine. I think it's just going to be something that you will just have to maintain. Good luck.


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