# Help with fish selection



## psilo357 (Apr 2, 2009)

I'm about to finally be investing in my 75 or 90 g tank. I have a few fish selected that i would like to be stocking in it, and want some advice and recommendations on what else I should get, just looking for lots of ideas I guess. 

Right now I have a 20g (long) with 4 small african cichlids, a common plec, and 2 clown loaches...( I know, i need a bigger tank, and thats what im doing here ) So I plan on taking the cichlids back to the fish store, so i can have a more community tank with all different fish, here is what I like so far:

3 - clown loach (love these guys, one more to add to my 2)
1 - common pleco that i already have

Current thoughts of what else (in order of interest), this part for more debate:
2 - pictus catfish (or other cool catfish, just like these so far)
1 - special pleco of some type (royal or emperor or another type i dont know about)
1 - Red Tail Shark
1 - Black ghost knife
maybe some schooling fish of some type
maybe a fressh water eel
maybe bala sharks

some other colorful fish that swim in front of the tank really, all but the top part is really up for debate.

Please, any recommendations welcome.

I will be using a small gravel substrate most likely, maybe sand if i can be talked into it, but i use this small gravel sand right now in my 20, from some sand products company, cheap too, which is why i like it, comes in 50 lb bags, and is dirty to start out, but once you flush it out a half dozen times, works great, and not too sharp, the cichlids love digging in it, and the loaches skimming over the top.

I will be putting rocks, driftwood, and maybe some rooted or floaing plants in, a teracotta pot or two, maybe a half one for a neat cave or soemthing, a clear tube if i get a black ghost knife, as they are really cool...

thanks for any and all discussions, help me pick my fish!!!


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## mollies (Mar 27, 2009)

good ideas. the ghost knifes are realy sensitive to difrent waters. might read up on them first. i like mollies. and tetras. the pictus cat are hard to. the water has to be just right.


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

the clown loaches and common plecos both get over a foot long, as well as the bala sharks. 

personally im a fan of large schools of neon tetras.


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## mollies (Mar 27, 2009)

i agree with the com plec would be way to big i found out the hard way.


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

clown loaches and common plecos will get too large for that tank, like the others said. 

as for a smalelr pleco, you could try a brittlenose? I am also in the same boat as 1fish, i love big schools of neon tetras, and in a 90G tank you could get a pretty sweet assortment of colors that would look great, like 18 of them


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Following the same line as the previous answers, I wouldn't mix all your suggested fish together in a 55g. The clowns and sharks will grow, and the knifefish is something I would not add until I knew a lot about them (which I don't). You're on the right track, asking before buying, so you should be able to avoid trouble and be successful. Read up on any fish you are considering; even simply do a Google search of "neon tetra" for example with bring up several sites with info on their requirements; do that for all the fish you're considering, and then decide which ones will be compatible. All the fish in a tank must be similar in water requirements--temperature, pH and hardness. Know the parameters of your tap water so you'll know beforehand what needs to be done to accomodate the fish you want; you either have to alter the water for the fish, or select fish that like your water. While many fish are somewhat adaptable, it comes down to replicating their natural needs as closely as possible if they are to be healthy and free of stress.


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## parakeeto225 (Apr 2, 2009)

Suggestions:
fish:
- 5 or 6 tiger barbs.
- plecos (grow huge!)
- Maybe a pack of serpae tetras.
- More clown loaches (awesome fish)
- 2 or 3 xiphidus (might get eaten)

plants:
- nymphaea lilly red or green (could get plant bulbs for three dollars in walmart. 3-5 inches of growth.)
- anubias nana
- water weeds

hope I helped!!!


:BIGcool: :BIGcool:


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## psilo357 (Apr 2, 2009)

Alright...so much info so little time...thanks for all the posts already

So, i think i have decided to attempt a Discus tank instead...i was thinking this as my mix

4 discus (buy them young)
2 German blue ram
~12 cardianal tetras (or maybe a mix of cardinals and neons?)
3 clown loaches
1 pleco (this guy i still have, if i start to see problems with him messing with the discus, he will be given to the lfs for sale to someone else)

How does this look for a 75 or 90g tank? More fish? Less fish? different fish?

sorry for all the questions, want to get this all planned out before i spend money that i have to lose by giving back to the fish store, like im about to do with my african cichlids...

Thanks everyone


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## onefish2fish (Jul 22, 2008)

discus are going to need excellent water conditions and juvees need multiple daily feedings. i dont have experience with these fish but i have a feeling that 4 is to many in this size tank, someone please correct me otherwise.


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## psilo357 (Apr 2, 2009)

man...seem like with most fish that are even somewhat nice, you get to have 1 in a 90 gallon tank...gets a little carried away IMO...ive seen lots of wonderful aquariums in my day, and they are the livelier ones that seem to do better. Especially when you go to state aquariums and whatnot, there are TONS of fish in those... 

However, if it is too many, then its too many, but 9 nice fish in a 90 gallon tank seem acceptable to me, plus those little tiny neons...

Now what about:

2 discus
2 angel fish
2 blue ram
~10 cardinal or other tetra
3 clown loach
1 red tail shark
1 common pleco (until he gets too big or hurts other fish, if so, he is gone...would need some other algae eaters and bottom cleaners...cory cats maybe?)

thanks


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## mollies (Mar 27, 2009)

you have to relize how big some of the fish get to. I have a few more then 9 in a 55 but they dont get very big and im moving them to a 135 long wide. so that way i could add more later. my loachs r the only one that will get big there only 3 inch now. so i will have time to move them. so as long as u get them smaller then want to go bigger later in a year i would as long as they get along.


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## DropquickMurphy (Sep 30, 2008)

The red tail can sometimes be aggresive. best to have a little cave or something for them to claim as their own like Cichlids, which I'm sure you know about. The black Ghost Knife is a cool fish, i was thinking about getting one myself. Another cool fact about them is they have an organ in their body like the elephant nose fish, that generates AC which is used to kill their prey in the wild, because of their bad eye sight. however if you get one only get one cause they are aggresive to their own kind. The Angel fish are a cool fish but they can get territorial. And there are certain types of plecos that don't get as big as the common, like the clown pleco which will only get about 5". .


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

Four Discus would be fine in 90 gal tank so long as you are willing to perform water changes that will be needed for their long term health. As mentioned,, the young discus need several small feedings per day to achieve proper growth. The Discus do most of their growing within the first year. Angelfish would not be a good fit with Discus for they are much more aggressive at feeding time and Discus could get short end of the stick in that regard. Unless the Discus you purchase are tank raised,They prefer somewhat soft and acidic water where Angel fish would prefer harder water.But many fish can adapt to varying Ph values IF the Ph remains stable. Cardinal and neons tetras would work as long as your water isn't too hard. Chocolate pleco or (Rhino Pleco) could also work they seldom exceed ten inches. Clown loaches would behave like a group of puppies and may make Discus nervous which= sick Discus due to their ability to stress over furniture that's re-arranged . As stated The water in Discus tank must be near pristine for their long term health. If you decide to go with Discus, I would be happy to advise on what to look for and what to avoid in selecting them. They are a beautiful fish but can test your dedication in order for them to thrive.


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## psilo357 (Apr 2, 2009)

I'm definitely interested in discus...and my current tank has great water, however, its ph is a little higher as the african cichlids enjoy that. The large pieces of limestone inside also help that.

I do have hard water where I live...all of our water comes out of an aquifer under southern Texas, which is a limestone aquifer, so it does make it hard, is there something that can easily 'soften' the water other than an entire RO system? Most RO I have seen are expensive.

I'm really wanting the discus, as they are very unique and very beautiful, but i can also be talked out of them. I just want a nice colorful assortment of different fish.

Also, the clown loaches MUST stay, as I have fallen for them, as cheesy as that is, they are fun to watch and very good looking fish IMO. Though I do have one that likes to play dead on me from time to time, which worries me, but as soon as i give the tank a little tap, he gets up to greet me...lol.

I like

clown loaches
colorful fish in general
catfish
a few larger fish
schooling fish

This will be a thread that will run for a while as this tank won't come until i finish some house remoddelling, i just want to have my plan completely ready whenever i do...

so...why is there so much freaking conflicting information on all these fish, its very aggrivating as someone somewhat new, but experienced enough to know the basics of fish keeping, for instance:

Walter's Discus Page - Compatible Tankmates

this page says clown loach is a fine and dandy tank mate for discus...

anyways, the plan continues

now at:

4 discus
2 german blue ram (and maybe 2 golden)
3 clown loach
~10 schooling brigh colored fish
1 common pleco (for now, if he gets too big or aggresive, to the lfs with him)
1 red tail shark

Sound good? Maybe would a few cory cats be good here too to help cleanup, especially if i dump the pleco? I would love to trade out my common for one of those zebra plecos, they look amazing, but it seems some people try to charge hundreds for them, I would have to see if my LFS could get them, if not, anyone know a good online seller for < $50?

thanks


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Keeping discus healthy is dedicated work, much more than probably any other freshwater fish; so say all those who have had them. And they will not be healthy at a pH suitable for African rift lake cichlids. These fish are at opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of water conditions.

Discus need quitet surroundings. I do not believe clown loaches will provide that level of quiet. As 1077 said, this will result in stressed discus which will be sick and probably die. I checked out your link, but I do not agree with that person's view. Clown loaches ar shoaling fish as are corys and should be kept in groups. In a discus environment a group of clown loaches would be havoc in my opinion.

I don't know what your level of expertise is with fish, so pardon me if I am assuming incorrectly; discus are not a fish for beginners. Most people are in the hobby for years before they will consider discus.

There are many, many colourful and interesting fish for a 90g aquarium.


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## psilo357 (Apr 2, 2009)

I have been keeping fish now for about 2 years, so not a beginner, but definitely would not consider myself a pro.

What im really looking for is some nice colorful fish for a large tank. i would like a community, im getting rid of the african cichlids, then get the discus, the plan was NEVER to keep them in the same tank.

As difficult as they sound though, i may look into something different. I would like 2 - 4 larger (not huge or anything) fish that enjoy swimming in the top of the tank, my loaches on the bottom, and maybe some type of catfish or something neat to go down there with them. i would also like many smaller colorful fish that enjoy to school. I have kept the tank I have now without loosing any fish, other than when i had this one gourami that would kill anything i put in with him, he was ultra evil, so i gave him back to the fish store, as he was the only fish left after he executed everything i put in the tank with him. I now have 4 cichlids, 2 loaches, and 1 common plec, and they are all doing great. I know the loaches don't necessarily belong with the cichlids, but since they are the largest in the tank, its not a prob right now, but nowing what i know, im getting rid of the africans and going for a more community tank.

So, with these expectations and experience levels, i do want some uniqueness to my tank, not just run of the mill everyday stuff (hence my interest in the discus)...so, any more fish suggestions for me to look up? As i get theim in i will look them up, and see what i can put together, also, do some more reading of other posts to see what i can find out.

thanks all

peace


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

psilo357 said:


> I have been keeping fish now for about 2 years, so not a beginner, but definitely would not consider myself a pro.
> 
> What im really looking for is some nice colorful fish for a large tank. i would like a community, im getting rid of the african cichlids, then get the discus, the plan was NEVER to keep them in the same tank.
> 
> ...


We're all here on this forum to offer advice from our own experiences in the hopes that our past problems may help prevent you from going through that difficulty and frustration. I've kept fish for almost 20 years and I am still learning from others on this forum, and by reading the good magazines and buying books when I can afford them. I still say you're on the right track by thinking ahead and researching the fish before you get them, so keep on this track and you are more likely to have success.

In your first post you mentioned the substrate, and my preference is for small grain aquarium gravel. You mentioned plants, and that is very good for several reasons I won't go into now. Sand is used by many, but it can compact and form gas pockets which are dangerous. Interestingly, every book I've read on planted aquariums favours gravel over sand, with the caution that sand can be used but be careful. My recomendation is to stay with the small grain gravel. If you look at the photos of my two aquaria, you'll see what is possible with plants in gravel, minimum light, and no CO2.

Your water parameters haven't been mentioned before, so do you know the pH of your tap water? As I mentioned before, if you plan on keeping fish that prefer water that is vastly different from what comes out of your tap, you must consider the way in which you are going to provide that water in the aquarium; fish are somewhat adaptable, but in my experience this is not as wide a range as some expect and keeping fish in water that is not reasonably close to what they "prefer" leads to stress and that leads to disease and sometimes fish loss. Hardness is also important, but that is usually connected to the pH. If you could say what the ph of your tap water is, and if its hard or soft water if you know that, we can go from there.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

I am with Byron in regards to fine gravel over sand for planted tank. The fine gravel wiil allow nutrients to reach the roots of plants. Sand would be detriment in this respect and root tabs would be needed on regular basis for sustained growth of some ,if not most plants.


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