# How long does a tank stay cycled w/no fish?



## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I really should know the answer to this question but I don't. A quick search gives conflicting answers. How long will a tank stay cycled without fish in it to provide what the beneficial bacteria need to survive? (Assume the tank has no plant life)


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## LisaC144 (Oct 22, 2009)

Hmmm, can't you just "feed" it with fish food to keep the cycle going? Just a thought.


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

I remember reading, a 1% daily die off of beneficial bacteria .
Don't have a clue if that info is even close to being accurate.


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## JMILLER (Dec 19, 2009)

From what I've read the first day initial die off of bacteria is very small, just a few %, but after the first day it speeds up tremendously. How fast?, I never could find anything definite but I did see 50% loss after 3 days and after 5 days you might as well start over. Of course no one posted scientific research to back any of that up so it could all be BS.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Thanks for the info. I guess a few flakes of fish a day ought to keep it cycled. It's only a 10 gl.


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## JMILLER (Dec 19, 2009)

Do you have an Ace Hardware store around you? They sell pure ammonia (no additives). It's the Ace Brand janitor strength. Cheap too.


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## Austin (Feb 1, 2010)

I'd think very quickly. Bacteria has a short life span I believe and if they don't have food they won't be able to survive and reproduce. (I don't think the beneficial bacteria live too long with fish I think they just die and reproduce quick enough?)

I'd do the the flake food or ammonia  Putting maybe as much flake food as ud normally feed your fish.... keep the colony nice and large.  But I think if water quality deteriorates too much they'lld ie as well.


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## rsn48 (Nov 26, 2009)

Another technique that works well - remember to test for ammonia - is to use one cocktail shrimp per 10 gallons. Put the shrimp in a woman's nylon, weigh it down with a rock or the like and let its rotting condition seed your tank. Remove the remaining shrimp after approximately one month.


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

aunt kymmie said:


> Thanks for the info. I guess a few flakes of fish a day ought to keep it cycled. It's only a 10 gl.


and what are our plans for this 10G???


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## Ulyaoth (Jan 9, 2010)

What about if you go from 7 fish to 1 in a 16g? Will the one still support the bacteria enough or will there be a dieoff still so that I'd have to slowly add the fish in again rather than just put them all back? I've been planning to put all the fish in my tank but my betta outside in a tub pond for the summer.


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## Mean Harri (Dec 14, 2009)

What's the chance of closely calculating the amount of ammonia deposited in to a tank with a stocking of fish including food? Then dose pure ammonia as mentioned by the back of the head guy lol.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

JohnnyD44 said:


> and what are our plans for this 10G???


It's my 10gl hospital tank that is now empty. It's a cycled tank and I'm trying to figure out how to keep it that way since there are now no fish in it.


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## MOA (Aug 16, 2009)

hello,

These are not super-scientific sources, and not really germane:lol:, but these might add to the discussion:

http://www.screencast.com/users/MOAtank/folders/Jing/media/6c60663d-e526-4dde-96fb-4c70306664f3

http://www.screencast.com/users/MOAtank/folders/Jing/media/87c9de90-df1b-4a65-b4dc-88c0b213f13b

The above can be accessed in context here: http://sites.google.com/site/moashowmanyfish/tutorials-and-videos


MOA


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## jeaninel (Aug 24, 2007)

Ulyaoth said:


> What about if you go from 7 fish to 1 in a 16g? Will the one still support the bacteria enough or will there be a dieoff still so that I'd have to slowly add the fish in again rather than just put them all back? I've been planning to put all the fish in my tank but my betta outside in a tub pond for the summer.


I believe what happens is that the bacteria colony will die off to just the amount needed to support the ammonia source. Since their food supply dwindled so does the colony. So there will be some die off. You'll have to add fish back in slowly to give the bacteria colony time to catch up. Make sense?


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

@ MOA- I see your name posting to my thread and I *shudder*. The person who reminds me how lacking my education is in math and science. Thanks for the links. ;-)

@ Jeaninel- makes perfect sense. Since at best (hopefully anyway) the most I'll be treating at any one time will be one fish so I should be able to keep it cycled well enough for that when that day arrives. 

Thanks for all the replies. :-D


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## JMILLER (Dec 19, 2009)

If it's your hosptal tank filter just run it along side a regular filter in one of the other tanks. That way it will always stay cycled for when you need it.

"back of the head guy" :lol:


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

JMILLER said:


> If it's your hosptal tank filter just run it along side a regular filter in one of the other tanks. That way it will always stay cycled for when you need it.
> 
> "back of the head guy" :lol:


"back of the head guy" has brains in there. Great idea! Thanks.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

aunt kymmie said:


> Thanks for the info. I guess a few flakes of fish a day ought to keep it cycled. It's only a 10 gl.


 I have a quarantine tank that I keep a few trumpet snails in to keep the biological filter working. Just sprinkle a little food in the tank every other day for snails and the waste produced by them does a fair job. Trumpet snails won't munch the plants like some of the others.


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## karjean (Feb 4, 2010)

Good idea 1077 with the shrimps, my recommendation was to probably keep a sacrificial fish in it.


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

JMILLER stole my idea. Just move the filter to an occupied tank temporarily to keep the bacteria well fed and alive.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

I have sponge filters going in most of my aquariums that could simply be moved into a new tank but they are quite large, Too large for 10 gal. quarantine. Quarantine doesn't seem to set for too long cause I'm always trading fish to fish store for new ones ,or moving fish from one tank to another for rescaping. Have found the few trumpet snails to work pretty well for keeping the filter active. Don't know bout shrimps,maybe glass shrimp.Would be concerned with possible reaction to possible meds if needed.
Wouldn't hurt for me to lose a few trumpet snails but then they too might create an ammonia spike if all were to die suddenly as a result of medications.
Happily (knocks on wood),, I seldom need medications.
For just keeping the quarantine tank 's filter ticking,,the trumpet snails work well so long as I' don't use meds.
Have also used a dozen or so of these snails to cycle aquariums in the past. Just feed em sparingly and between the food,and waste created by the snails, the maturing process (cycling) takes place without daily dosing of ammonia or testing.;-)


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

1077 said:


> I have sponge filters going in most of my aquariums that could simply be moved into a new tank but they are quite large, Too large for 10 gal. quarantine. Quarantine doesn't seem to set for too long cause I'm always trading fish to fish store for new ones ,or moving fish from one tank to another for rescaping. Have found the few trumpet snails to work pretty well for keeping the filter active. Don't know bout shrimps,maybe glass shrimp.Would be concerned with possible reaction to possible meds if needed.
> Wouldn't hurt for me to lose a few trumpet snails but then they too might create an ammonia spike if all were to die suddenly as a result of medications.
> Happily (knocks on wood),, I seldom need medications.
> For just keeping the quarantine tank 's filter ticking,,the trumpet snails work well so long as I' don't use meds.
> Have also used a dozen or so of these snails to cycle aquariums in the past. Just feed em sparingly and between the food,and waste created by the snails, the maturing process (cycling) takes place without daily dosing of ammonia or testing.;-)


This morning I looked into mounting the filter from the 10gl to my display but it's not going to work due to how the display is set up. I just don't have the room due to the way the built in wet/dry and limited openings are set up on that tank. How many MTS do you think I'd have to put in a 10gl to keep it cycled? I have MTS I could take from another tank and put in the 10 gl.


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## JMILLER (Dec 19, 2009)

If that's the case then I would buy the ammonia from Ace Hardware. That way you can dose it exactly, no guessing. It took 8 drops to put my 5.5 gallon at 4ppm. A quart of it was 2.49


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

aunt kymmie said:


> This morning I looked into mounting the filter from the 10gl to my display but it's not going to work due to how the display is set up. I just don't have the room due to the way the built in wet/dry and limited openings are set up on that tank. How many MTS do you think I'd have to put in a 10gl to keep it cycled? I have MTS I could take from another tank and put in the 10 gl.[/quote
> 
> 
> About a dozen large MTS or two dozen Small ones would work. Just feed em a little food every other day or every two days. Not too much for as you know,,they reproduce in relation to food available.
> ...


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

1077;351686
About a dozen large MTS or two dozen Small ones would work. Just feed em a little food every other day or every two days. Not too much for as you know said:


> I'll put in a dozen or so MTS. The problem with adding media from my display is that it's a wet/dry filter. When needed would I just take out a few bioballs and let them float around in the 10gl??


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

aunt kymmie said:


> I'll put in a dozen or so MTS. The problem with adding media from my display is that it's a wet/dry filter. When needed would I just take out a few bioballs and let them float around in the 10gl??


 
Ahh,I see. (no mechanical material ? pads,foam,sponges)
Were it me,I would then use the snails and as mentioned,the combination of fish food (sparingly),to feed the snails and waste created by them ,,should keep a colony of bacteria alive.
Another option would be to add some biological media perhaps enclosed in a small mesh bag to the biological media you already have. Then when you need some seed material, you could simply remove the bag holding the media,and place it in the filter or hang it in front of return flow on the ten gal.
A small sponge filter hidden in display tank might also be considered but some folks don't appreciate them for aesthetic reasons.Then when you need to set up quarantine,you could simply move the sponge filter to the quarantine tank and you have instant biological filter already colonized.
Have also placed a small mesh bag of media (ceramic noodles,beads,Eheim substrat Pro) in my main tank and just let it set out of site on substrate. Bacteria will colonize this media just as it does the substrate. 
A cup full is usually sufficient.


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