# Ick??



## IceChamber (Mar 9, 2014)

Last Sunday I noticed a few white spots on one of my platy's and I immediate freaked out and thought it was ick. I went to my local fish store and talked to the owner and he recommended that I use Sentry AQ Mardel daily until I notice it is gone. Well I been using for a week now and it still has the white spots, no other fish does. So now I am wondering if it really is Ick or something else.

Please help

1. Size of tank? 55 gall

2. Water parameters
a. Ammonia? 0ppm 
b. Nitrite? 0ppm
c. Nitrate? 80ppm when I noticed the spots now down to 40ppm after a few water cycles
d. pH, KH and GH? (I haven't tested because I was told that freshwater will adapt)
e. Test kit? API Master Test Kit

3. Temperature? I keep tank between 75-80

4. FW (fresh water) or BW (brackish)? Freshwater

5. How long the aquarium has been set up? Since July 2013

6. What fish do you have? How many are in your tank? How big are they? How long have you had them?
See my signature for my fish, I bought the 2 golden dojo loaches on 1/10/14 and those are the last ones I added, rest been in there since October

7. Were the fish placed under quarantine period (minus the first batch from the point wherein the tank is ready to accommodate the inhabitants)? No but no fish recently added

8. a. Any live plants? Fake plants? Fake Plants no live
b. Sand, gravel, barebottom? Gravel
c. Rocks, woods, fancy decors? Any hollow decors? See pic

9. a. Filtration? Marineland Penguin 350
b. Heater? API not sure model but designed for 70 gallons

10. a. Lighting schedule? What lights are used? I turn on my light at 8am and off at about 10pm. I use a florescent 
b. Any sunlight exposure? How long? No

11. a. Water change schedule? See below
b. Volume of water changed? see below
c. Well water, tap water, RO water? Tap Water
d. Water conditioner used? Seachem Prime
e. Frequency of gravel/sand (if any) vacuumed? gravel vacuumed every time I water change

Before the spots formed I changed about 15 gallons of water (because I haven't been doing ever two weeks like I should of). Spots formed about 3 days after the water change. Since the spots formed I did a 5 gallon change after three days of using the medicine, and then 10 gallons today to help lower the Nitrates.

12. Foods? New Life Spectrum Community Fish Formula and API Algae Wafers
How often are they fed? At night

13. a. Any abnormal signs/symptoms? I had one fish get swim bladder (so the local fish store said), that is why I did the 15 gallon change before the spots formed. 
b. Appearance of poop?
c. Appearance of gills?

14. a. Have you treated your fish ahead of diagnosis? Local fish store said it was probably ick since it was white spots
b. What meds were used? Sentry AQ Mardel 

15. Insert photos of fish in question and full tank shot if necessary.


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## Sylverclaws (Jul 16, 2012)

In that first pic it looks like another fish has it, or is that stuff floating around? 

It looks like ich...He may have a thrashed system and they're able to get at him easier than the rest, but it could also be internal on others. Have you noticed any white stringy poo on the others or on this one? Odd weight loss? Also symptoms if it's internal.

I don't know anything about the medicine recommended. The best treatment I know for ich is salt and heat, but your cories, pleco and probably your loaches wouldn't approve of that and once it's in the tank on anyone, it's usually infected the entire tank, visible or not on other fish.

Hmm, oh, I wish I could remember some of the meds that are good for ich. I THINK ones with copper are good, but have risks...unfortunately I cannot remember, but I suggest you look into other medicines, or ask on here if anyone knows some good ich medicines that are safe for all your critters and plants. There are a lot of users that could give you some good info. Ask for personal experiences with them instead of recommended stuff from others so you know it will work...unless you want to risk the salt and heat method, because that medicine is not working. 

From what I've read that medicine is supposed to work well. Perhaps it's a really nasty bacterial infection or cysts, bites or some other parasite you have going on that...well, oddly resembles ich. lol Can you mix that med with an antibacterial like melafix? If so, try that out and see if it helps. It shouldn't hurt anyone if it's ok to mix if it doesn't work.


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## IceChamber (Mar 9, 2014)

Yeah the spots on the other fish is a particle that floated by. 

I called the local fish store and was told that it might be a bacterial infection or fungus since the ick meds aren't working. It is the brand he always uses and normally 3-5 days of it will cure it. I am going today to pick up some antibotics for the tank.

As for the other symptoms, no. Actually even this fish is acting normal. It just looks like white cottony spots on his body, I wish I could take a better picture of him.

Thanks for the advice.


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## jaysee (Dec 9, 2009)

Some of those spots are way too big to be ich. Doesn't mean ich is not present as well, though.

I would definitely not use salt with loaches and Corys, especially since the salt does not have any impact on the effectiveness of the heat treatment. Simply raising the temp to at least 86 is all that's required to cure the fish - it really is that easy.

Some meds work better than others, and with fish like loaches I would not use meds to cure ich - not when all you have to do is turn up the heat.


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## Sylverclaws (Jul 16, 2012)

Will heat hurt his loaches? I had a nasty a few years back and turned my heat up to 81(was slowly upping it to 85 over the course of a couple days from 77 degrees) and they started having visible trouble and floating at the top breathing hard. Mine were black Kuhli loaches though, perhaps there is a difference. 

The one thing I do know about meds and loaches, is you need some that say they are safe for loaches or scaleless fish. They can be delicate to that kind of thing. Melafix is ok for them, or at least says it is and I had no problems when I used it to treat one for a trio of cysts on it's back, also used it to help with a guppy who had finrot in the same tank...but that stuff is pretty light. If THIS is a bacterial infection, and it could also be a fungal infection(oh, you'll know it it starts getting stringy or poofy), and it could very well do so so grab an antifungal too.

I've never seen anything like that that was so...all over besides ich, but Jaysee is right, some are too big, and both fungal and bacterial infections are a more likely culprit, but some look more like ich. Other than his spots though, that fish looks pretty good and seems to have normal poop. =o That makes me think fungal or cysts. Be a very...weird case of Lymphocystis, but because of varying sizes, those two are your likely culprits. 

Do yourself a big 40-50% water change and vacuum well before adding in any new meds. =)


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## jaysee (Dec 9, 2009)

Out of about 60 species (hundreds of fish) I have not found a species that couldn't handle the heat, and I treat at 88-89. Probably have administered the treatment to 20 black kuhlis, in addition to 4 other species of loach. The only threat the heat poses is exacerbating some preexisting condition. Parasites, heat, meds, salt - all stressful - all have the potential to do a defective fish in.

Heat can be dangerous with some bacterial infections though, so if you raise the temp make sure you keep a close eye on the fish.


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## sandybottom (Nov 29, 2012)

i would also do a heat treatment.add an airstone to up the oxygen content of the water.ich is just one type of ectoparasite.i believe there are more than 8,000 types in the subclass of copepods alone,if i remember correctly.


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

sandybottom said:


> i would also do a heat treatment.add an airstone to up the oxygen content of the water.ich is just one type of ectoparasite.i believe there are more than 8,000 types in the subclass of copepods alone,if i remember correctly.


Not to mention dinoflagellates, such as the type that causes velvet. Its helpful in diagnosing fish disease to look up images on line and compare to what you see on your fish. I can't really see from the photos you posted.
Hope you get your fish better soon. Good luck!


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## IceChamber (Mar 9, 2014)

Thanks guys.

I am going to go out and look for an anti fungal/bacteria tomorrow. I don't believe it is ick because the spots are getting more and more fiberous (like cotton) and coming off his body. He still is the only one with it.

I been changing 20% of the water every 3 days since he got the spots as well.

So I hope the new meds might work.

Also thanks for the advice about the loaches, they are my favorite fish I don't want to lose them.


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## IceChamber (Mar 9, 2014)

Ok two TRAGEDIES HAPPENED!!! I lost two of my spectrum Tetras... No signs of the white stuff on them and they looked healthy before this happened.

So I did a 25% water change, checked my levels Amm and Nitrite is 0ppm, Nitrate is 40ppm. While doing the water change I noticed some of the fake plants had a white stringy film coming from them, it almost look like poop but it was translucent.

I also picked up Melafix and Pimafix and started the 7 day treatment for fungus and bacteria.

I hope this works... I really don't like sick fish and I REALLY don't like it when they pass...

Does anyone have any other suggestions?


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

White stringy stuff sounds like bacteria. I would look into antibiotics. Tertracycline is usually available at lfs.


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## IceChamber (Mar 9, 2014)

Should I use that while I am using Melafix and Pimafix?? 

Also is it safe for my loaches? That was the reason I went with the Mela and Pima... I almost picked up some fungus and bacteria meds but the package didn't say they were safe for them


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## rsskylight04 (Nov 9, 2013)

Loaches are very sensative, I would check by searching the forum. In the banner just under where it says "TropicalFishKeeping.com" youll see a button that says search. Type in "loaches" and "antibiotics" and see what comes up for threads. Wish I.could give you a.more definite answer but I'm not sure and i don't want to steer you wrong.
Good luck!


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## sandybottom (Nov 29, 2012)

http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/...edication-scaleless-fish-invertebrates-99508/

here is some info that olympia put together on treating scaleless fish.


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