# White spot all over fsh.... catfish all died



## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

Hi , 

i set up my 55 gallon tank about 3 weeks ago . i have 7 anglefish , 5 catfish , 2 neon tetras , 2 painted glass fish , some looking skelton fish , and 2 gromies and 1 shark . i have a 35 to 60 gallon fliter system on it the heater was set to around 75 . Recently the fish got white spots a little and now fully covered . the cat fish have it really bad. 4 cats died and 1 angel fish. the and fish had like cotton on her wing and it was stuck fast. i bought COPPERSAFE and started to trest the tank and that is when the fish started to die fast. 4 in the last 3 days . so what can i do to save the fish whit out the whte spots


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## love_my_fish (Sep 17, 2006)

This seems like an awful lot of fish to have so soon in such a new tank, which may have contributed to how fast this seems to have spread. I don't know much about such outbreaks, but I think the best thing to do to save your fish would be to perform water changes and/or move the unaffected fish to another, well cycled tank.

Here is a link to what may be the problem your fish are going through and what you can do if this really sounds like problem:

http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/disease/p/columnaris.htm


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## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

Hi, and welcome...
The first thing I can say is that you should probably expect to lose more fish. That is too many fish in that size of a tank, and way too soon to have a fully stocked tank. Did you cycle the tank before putting fish into it?
In order for someone to help, we'll need to know the water quality stats for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH.
The first thing I can instruct you to do is to purchase some polyfilter if you have it available to you. If not at your LFS, you can find it at http://drsfostersmith.com This will work much faster than carbon to suck the medication out of the tank, and to help soak up waste levels at the same time. The polyfilter should be changed after about 48 hrs, and a fresh piece put into your filter for another 48 hrs. Once this is done, the water will need to be tested again. Most important is to get that medication out of the tank asap without shocking the fish with too many or too large of water changes. Small, daily changes of 10 - 15% for a while will help a lot.
If your tank is cycling, which is highly likely at 3 wks old, medications can be deadly. Coppersafe is not a safe medication to use for all species of fish. Angelfish are sensitive to copper, as are most catfish and shark species. Until we know it's safe, I'm going to say it is best NOT to medicate this tank.
In addressing the stocking of this tank, angelfish grow to 8 inches in diameter for average, and are aggressive and territorial. You mentioned catfish, can you tell us what kind? It would help a lot if you could post pictures of your fish here for us to see, so we know what species we are dealing with. Angelfish also tend to eat neons, especially in a crowded tank. Shark... what type? These also are known to be prone to stress and illness during cycling, in crowded situations, or if not enough territory. The smallest of the freshwater shark species readily available is the red tail shark, and you are again looking at a fish that reaches 6 - 8 inches long... then there are bala sharks which average 14 inches... and irridescent sharks which average about 3 - 5 feet.
How often are you doing water exchanges? How much water at a time? How often are you feeding the fish? How much each time? A temp of 75 is borderline for most of the fish you have, and would be better at 78 degrees.
The more info about your tank and fish that you can provide, the faster we can all help you here. Pics are important if you can get them!
The chances are extremely high right now that your fish are suffering from poor water quality, not enough heat, overcrowding ( which causes stress) and from being mismedicated. How much territory (decorations and plants) is in the tank?
As I said, the more you can tell us, the faster we can help.


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

Here Are some pics ......

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e747b4709b400000016108GZNGjRs2A
Catfish with white spots!
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e747b1309e000000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e74780e496400000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7478f9c8a300000016108GZNGjRs2A]
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7478efc8b500000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7478aa49c000000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e74797a098800000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e747237495800000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e747234c86b00000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e74721ac84500000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7472c749a800000016108GZNGjRs2A
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7472c4c89b00000016108GZNGjRs2A
The Food i use
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e7472bac8e500000016108GZNGjRs2A
The SHark
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6ce09b3127cce8e747b7a88b900000016108GZNGjRs2A

_Email addresses softly edited to prevent email trawlings. Pls use private messaging for this purpose. If not, pm a member regarding your email addresses. We do not want to see a member suffering spammings brought by email trawlings.
Blue_


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

i feed the fish two pinchs of food either or. 2 to 3 x a day .

i change the water about 10 to 15 percent every friday .

the temp is 79 right now. i have no idea if it is in cycle . 

i fill the tank with purfied water from my PUR water filter


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## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

I need to know the water params... ammonia, nitrite, nitrate pH test results. Until we know the answer to that question, there isn't much I can do to help... nor can anyone else. Medication is probably going to be needed, but if there is any ammonia or nitrite, or if nitrate is over 40, it'll need to be cleaned up and stabalized before adding any kind of medication. I am still browsing the pics to see if we can identify exactly what is in the tank, but from what I've seen so far, I'm definately going to stand on what I said about there being too many fish in this tank, especially this soon. Once well enough, most of them will need to be relocated. I wouldn't keep more than 2 angelfish in a 55 gallon tank, and eventually (usually within the first 1 - 2 yrs) they will need a larger tank. I would not advise keeping angels with the neons... and the catfish... maybe 1 can stay temp... I have to figure out exactly what species they are. 
I'll watch for the water test results. IF you take the water to your LFS for testing, please have them write down EXACT NUMBERS and the name brand of the test kits they are using so I will know how accurate the results are. The best thing to do would be to get your own kits, since you will need to be doing somewhat frequent testing until the problem is resolved, and it's something that should be monitored regularly to keep the tank stable. I would suggest liquid test kits because they are much more accurate than the others.


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

here are the specs .

nitrate is 40ppm
nitrite is higher than the chart it read pinker than the 10.0 ppm color 
hardness is 75ppm
total alkalinity is 80ppm
ph is 6.8


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## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

paisley tele said:


> nitrite is higher than the chart it read pinker than the 10.0 ppm color


That high?:blink: You'll need to carry out more water changes.


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

ya i figured that . i did a 10% last night . and dawn tld me to do one every night . so to nigh ti will do another


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## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

ammonia readings?


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

my tester dont do amonia readings


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## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

paisley_tele said:


> my tester dont do amonia readings


Hi Billy.:wave:

Pls buy an ammonia test kit. You'll need it while on the process of cycling.


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## joeshmoe (Aug 2, 2006)

dawns right u should do a least 10% i would probly do 25%.


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## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

With water params what they are showing, 10% is safer... too much can cause the fish to go into shock from extreme change. If the 10% is done daily, it will help.
A quick note to everyone here on the board: I have been helping in IM to get this problem sorted out. You will all be happy to know that paisley has decided to buy a 125 gallon tank to relocate the fish to, and understands that even a tank of this size will be somewhat temporary for that many angelfish. The catfish has been properly identified as a columbian shark, a brackish water fish that grows to 12 - 14 inches, and eats whatever fits into their mouths. Unfortunately, I'm not so confident that the catfish will survive given it's current condition and the time it will take to fix all of the issues.
I think everyone could learn a lesson from this, and I hope this encourages people to do research FIRST, in the future.
I must also say, paisley, I'm proud of you for taking responsibility and trying to do right by the animals. You give me hope.
As we are finding out quick, this hobby can be great and doesn't have to be overly costly, if it's done right... and fixing the problems from lack of information or from misinformation is what is most costly... both in money and in time.
Hang in there, keep up the maintenance shcedule we've set, and take it one day at a time. If you end up with an empty 55 when this is over, please come to the board here and ask questions about what kind of fish can be put into it, and what is compatible. Everyone here is always happy to help and full of suggestions. We can teach you to start out the right way, so you can see how easy it should be... and how pleasant a reward you can receive when that happens. You'll have your hands full for a while, but eventually it will stabalize enough for you to sit back and enjoy all that you've created.
I wish you and your fish the best of luck! Holler if/when you need help.


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## paisley_tele (Oct 29, 2006)

catfish just died 

shark has some mild white some and one angelfish and 2 painted tetras , the rest are ok


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## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

Sorry to hear that... with the shark, the only thing I can advise is to get that polyfilter into the filter as soon as possible. This will soak up any ammonia and nitrite, and even nitrate that is present, and it will do this quickly. I can already determine that the biggest issue is the water quality. Continue to do the daily water changes, easy on the feedings, and try to keep the stress levels down as much as possible. Irridescent sharks don't have a very strong immune system and stress will kill them quickly. With water conditions what they are, we still can't medicate safely. Once it's clear, the formalin that I suggested should help fast.


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