# Angelfish acting strange



## tiny

So I have posted this question twice in two other forums on this site with no help so far. I always get good advice in this forum so here is my post...

So one of my four angelfish, a vail half black is having an issue? It is staying in one corner of the tank behind a plant near the bottom of the tank and is swimming in place completely vertical head up (like when it feeds from the surface of the water). When I come close or another angel comes close it swims away or nips at the other angel. What is the issue? Maybe swim bladder disease? ASAP help is needed!!! thanks


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## MoneyMitch

you say you have four angels, you might have a pair in there but this is definately sounds like a territorial/aggression issue.


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## tiny

I would agree it looks that way but they have been acting normal for the last three to four weeks. Also any time this fish goes out and interacts with the other angels there is no issue. This angel is acting very stressed, it sounds like swim bladder problem but its head it pointed north unlike the normal way when the head points down. I just don't want to lose this fish...but thanks for the advice.


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## aunt kymmie

I've never kept angels but what MoneyMitch says makes sense. We've got a number of angel keepers/ breeders here on the forum so hopefully they'll chime in soon!!


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## 1077

Some more information would be helpful. How long has the tank been running with fish in it? how long have the Angelfish been in the tank? Were they all placed in the tank at the same time? How large are the Angelfish? Does water test zero for ammonia and nitrites and nitrAtes under 40ppm? What products or chemicals other than dechlorinator are used in the tank? 
The fact that the Angelfish have been doing well for sometime,and that the Angelfish in question seems to swim and eat? ok when interacting with the others,,, could very well be simply territorial issue. Could also be that a clutch of eggs has been deposited near the area where the fish exhibits the behaivor described. Might look closely to see if there are any eggs on plant leaves,glass,or filter uptake near this area. I am not thinking it is swim bladder disorder ,or it seems fish would exhibit the head up,tail down,posistion more frequently. I might were it me, perform twice weekly water changes of ten gal in this tank for the next two or three weeks and observe the fish. I might feed these fish sparingly ONCE a day for the same duration. I might also see if fish will take some freeze dried or frozen Daphnia once or twice a week. If fish are feeding well,, and the angelfish in question has no trouble staying right side up and or swimming normally when it swims with others,, then the twice weekly water changes along with reducing the feed temporarily,, could benefit the fish more than attempting to medicate at this point.
I would also try releasing the foods offered below the surface of the water as opposed to scattering flake food on the surface. This may help fish by limiting the air they may take in while feeding from the surface.
I believe I saw a power head? in photo of your tank. With the Emperor 400 on this tank,, it is more than enough circulation and perhaps the powerhead is making it difficult for wide bodied fish such as angel fish to hold themselves where they want in the aquarium.
Is also possible as Mitch observed,, that the fish are pairing up for possible mating. If this happens, you may have to place the mating pair in a seperate tank. Angelfish can do well in groups when they are small but when and if pairs form,, they are less and less tolerant of other angelfish that they think may be trying to win the affection of fish that they have selected or would like to. Hope some of this helps. Again ,I would not be in a hurry to medicate the fish but rather try some of the above and see how fish respond.


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## tiny

1077, all great advice. Now looking at it from your stand point I believe that it might of laid eggs, just cant see them clear. I believe there is a cluster in the corner where the two pieces of glass meet and are sealed. The angel sits and points at that location where i think they are most of the time now. So my best guess would be there are eggs because the same koi angel keeps coming by but no other fish really come by. so if there are eggs, what are my options? I have a pleco and two cory cats are they a problem for the eggs? If anything does happen to the eggs how would this affect the vail?


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## 1077

I have seen female angelfish lay eggs without a mate. Eggs will be eaten by corys if they can find em.
Without a mate to fertilize the egges ,they will not be viable. If you see a pair form, Don't ask me how to tell male from female,, then placing them in seperate tank would prolly be best if it is young fish you are hoping for. Haven't personally bred them but have kept many. Someone who has bred them will need to help you in that regard. Good Luck!


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## tiny

Well anyone that is a angelfish breeder can you help me out with this? First I'm not gonna set up a breeding tank being in college I just dont have the time for breeding. But if these eggs have been fertilized (which I dont know), I would like to give the fry a fair chance. So I have seen those "fry hiding mats" at like petco, do these work? Also the breeding tanks that you put into your tank, should i use that? This is all just if the eggs do hatch. Some other questions are, is it normal for the female to sit and guard the eggs? How old do the males have to be to be able to breed, cause my best guess for the mates age is around six months (female is about a year). If you have anymore advice it would be great, I know its alot of questions but I know I'll get the correct info on here. Thanks


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## Byron

tiny said:


> Well anyone that is a angelfish breeder can you help me out with this? First I'm not gonna set up a breeding tank being in college I just dont have the time for breeding. But if these eggs have been fertilized (which I dont know), I would like to give the fry a fair chance. So I have seen those "fry hiding mats" at like petco, do these work? Also the breeding tanks that you put into your tank, should i use that? This is all just if the eggs do hatch. Some other questions are, is it normal for the female to sit and guard the eggs? How old do the males have to be to be able to breed, cause my best guess for the mates age is around six months (female is about a year). If you have anymore advice it would be great, I know its alot of questions but I know I'll get the correct info on here. Thanks


It's been years since I last bred angels, but the answer is straightforward anyway. The female guards the eggs, fanning them continuously with her fins (that's why she is head-up) and doing her best to keep other fish away. Never use a breeding tap or anything with angels; the pair should preferably be isolated in their own tank to be successful. But, angels are usually not successful the first few spawnings regardless, they will themselves eat the eggs. So this is just for your info. When a pair forms, they are moved to their own tank and conditioned with foods, etc., and hopefully they spawn.

In the present case, I would just let nature do its thing. One of the other fish will probably get the eggs, or if they hatch the fry. If they were fertilized and do hatch, the female will shepherd the fry around, trying to protect them. Usually unsuccessfully with any other fish in the tank.

If the eggs are not fertile, they will turn white. Sometimes the female will pick out the infertile eggs. But as I said, often the first few spawnings end with the female eating all of them regardless.

Byron.


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## tiny

Well thank you Byron, you just enforced the little research I have been trying to do. Well then I believe the best step is just let nature do its thing and not worry about it. Well thank you everyone for your advice and help. Learn something new everyday about keeping an aquarium.


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## Fishin Pole

I wasnt hesitant to post anything here concerning angel breeding, because i dont consider myself an angel expert, since i recently acquired mine less than 6 months ago, but i can say, everything Byron has stated has also been my short time experience............I traded some shrimp for 6 Neon Blue Angels and put them in a 37 gallon hex tank, hoping to get a breeding pair, and low and behold i ended up with a pair.....Removed the other 4 to another tank and next thing i know i had eggs layed and fertilized........Parents slowly ate them and onyl 2 or 3 hatched, they didnt last a day.........The next spawn, was a little better, they allowed all the eggs to go to free swimmers, only to eat them all as soon as they could...........I'm hoping the next eggs are laid on something i can remove and i will try hatching them free from the parents in a smaller tank or breeding net in the same tank...............I'm gonna keep trying to get a successful spawn, and hopefully the paired fish learn how to become better parents...........


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