# how do you decide which fish to get?



## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

like it says! how do you folks pick on which fish you put in your aquariums?? im having such a hard time deciding and i want! i have a 55 gallon that needs to be filled with life!!


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## KPainter (Jun 12, 2012)

First consider your water parameters. It's much easier to have fish that work with your existing water than trying to make your water work with your fish.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Stocking an aquarium requires some thought. I'll just run over some of the main points.

Water parameters. The GH, KH and pH of the source water (presumably tap water). Some fish have preferences, some are somewhat more adaptable, but there are limits in all species. Selecting fish suited to your water makes life much easier, is less expensive, and the fish will be healthier if they have suitable water. Temperature is another water parameter, and some fish need higher or lower temps.

Tank size. Some fish need to be in groups, some may need a special harem or pair relationship, some need to be on their own (thinking species here).

Tank aquascape. This can be crucial for many fish. Some have special needs, like chunks of wood, or rock caves (whether real or fake doesn't usually matter). Some need dim lighting, so floating plants of less overhead light. Some need a water current, some the opposite (the filter matters here).

Compatibility. The last thing to consider, because if any of the afore-mentioned needs have not been met, compatibility won't matter much as the fish will be weakened and in poor health from the start. But not all fish get along with all other fish.

Byron.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

yeah im having problems!! its either a cichlid tank or a dirted tank or a sand bottom planted tank with tons of bright lil fish. lol :/


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

rexpepper651 said:


> yeah im having problems!! its either a cichlid tank or a dirted tank or a sand bottom planted tank with tons of bright lil fish. lol :/


Well, this is the first decision, and it is yours entirely.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

hahah for once byron youre no help


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## flight50 (Sep 30, 2008)

KPainter said:


> First consider your water parameters. It's much easier to have fish that work with your existing water than trying to make your water work with your fish.


As soon as I saw the topic this was the answer I was gonna give,lol. 

But after thinking a bit, I think the hardest decision is deciding whether you want to go planted or not. Solve that and the decision is cut in half. Now you can consider your water parameters. For beginners it will be much easier to use your current water conditions from tap. Find fish that fair well with what you have. Get that experience under your belt before branching out to making water parameters fit the fish you want. Also for this I would recommend the largest tank that you can afford and fit within the space your placing your tank. Believe it or not, larger tanks are generally easier to deal with. Now it does depend on the complexity you make a larger tank due to the maintenance level you must provide. Last decision for a planted tank will be on the substrate. Sand, soil, aquasoil etc, are all substrates so the decision is derived from cost, plant needs and maintenance itself. Accessories and equipment are options and are generally not part of the core setup right away.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

yeah see im having troubles deciding cichlid tank or dirt planted tank and which fish to put in lol i know its all about opinion. just was curious to see how some people choose what they have ended up with


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## flight50 (Sep 30, 2008)

Well one thing that aided in my decision was the type of fish I wanted to keep. Docile community. Community tanks look stunning in a moderate-heavily planted setup. I had cichlid when I first got into the hobby and the aggression just didn't sit well with me. For one I started with a 10g trying to keep cichlid. I learned fast that was a mistake, lol. I then got turned on to planting a tank and the hobby really opened up for me.

Awhile back, I remember seeing a thread somewhere in one of these forums that did a poll on what type of system everyone liked and why. The poll was marine saltwater or planted freshwater and there were lots of good valid points made for planted. Those points opened up yet another dimension of keeping planted tanks for me. Currently I have been collecting and researching for a multi tank setup for the past year. Once I have 80% of my setup I will start posting my progress. This hobby can really grow on you once avenues starting opening up.


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## JDM (Dec 9, 2012)

rexpepper651 said:


> yeah see im having troubles deciding cichlid tank or dirt planted tank and which fish to put in lol i know its all about opinion. just was curious to see how some people choose what they have ended up with


Don't get hung up on needing a dirt substrate for plants, sand works perfectly well and adding a comprehensive fertilizer and a few root tabs as needed is far far easier than going dirt for a lot of reasons. Even the "plant substrates" that are not dirt are not needed.

As has been mentioned, if you go with fish suited to your water parameters, it is easier and cheaper in the long run. That is what I did and I have very hard water so my fish options are more limiting than someone on a city water supply with soft water.

I started with a cockatoo dwarf cichlid as my fish of choice... that certainly changed but for the better.

Jeff.


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## SeaHorse (Dec 27, 2010)

If you are thinking Cichlids are you thinking African with lots of rock... or South American that can be in a planted tank? (I may be wrong but I do believe these need 2 different water parameters and should not be mixed) The African prefers the high ph in the 8's.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

hmmmmmmmmmmmm


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## SeaHorse (Dec 27, 2010)

Once you have sorted all that out.... I make a trip to the LFS and wander either ... the Cichlid aisle.... or the Community Fish aisle, ie... platies... or mollies... etc. The whole darn store.... sigh.... Green stickers, yellow stickers, red stickers....gotta mind that sort of thing too. I make a list of what I like, price etc. Then I go home and research again! I don't take the LFS staff's opinion unless you have someone you have worked with for a long time and trust their judgement. (I actually have a guy like that, he actually talks me out of stuff, and so... I go back and spend more money at that store, funny how that is.) I respect them at this particular store. 
And finally... when I've made a decision... I WANT "XXX"... I go to the store... Shoot!! they don't have any left... or they've just come in and they won't sell them yet. I don't live close. :evil: Or they only have 2 and I need a group 6 to 8. That sort of thing. I would phone ahead but what fun would that be?


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

ugh i know but i look and i want every fish lol. i dont trust a damn think my pet stores say. shoot i asked one lady the other day if they ever get in white cloud minnows or german blue rams an shes like " i dont even know what those fish are so no we dont"


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## Bongox3 (May 11, 2013)

You can always consider purchasing ur fish online...usually online shops provide brief write ups of each fish (and this site is just a click away)... Most online stores come with a guaranteed shipping/arrival and offer a larger variety of selection than LFS. While it will take some days to receive ur fish order, if u haven't done so - you'll need quite a few additional days (preferably weeks)to get your tank cycled, up and running. Fish selection should never be a hurried choice, which generally happens when dependent on LFS and the excitement to start.... Please take ur time, start cycling ur tank, and smartly add fish.... Ultimately, your fish will be a great deal healthier and you'll be a great deal happier.... Congrats on starting by the way....


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

i have media ready for the new tank just chillin in my filter as we speak  i picked up some nice rocks yesterday on my lunch break. now its down to substrate and then plants n fish
! ive wanted to try dirt for a while now. i have a sand planted tank that is working out rather well. its not growing so crazy i have to trim them all the time. hmmmm its a hard choice! haha which i know it shouldnt really be


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## JDM (Dec 9, 2012)

rexpepper651 said:


> ... ive wanted to try dirt for a while now. i have a sand planted tank that is working out rather well. its not growing so crazy i have to trim them all the time. hmmmm its a hard choice! haha which i know it shouldnt really be


OK, I won't try to downplay the dirt, it has it's advantages and disadvantages, BUT I think that there needs to be a "why?" behind the decision. "Just to try it" works, but is a weak argument for going away from something that is working for you already.

I'd vote for the sand.

Jeff.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

yeah i know man only reason i got lol is cuz i havent done it but i think youre on the right track here with the if it works use it idea. im starting to like this idea of using black sand blasting sand. black diamond is a company local to my city and its very cheap but im a lil concerned of what else would be in this sand besides coal slag


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## JDM (Dec 9, 2012)

I don't recall that you decided on fish yet, you might want to do that and let it help with your substrate decision... to me the idea of blasting sand sounds like it is abrasive (that's what it is for after all) and if you are going to have any bottom dwellers you might do better with a softer sand.

Jeff.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

im not going to have any bottom guys/gals


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

i think.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

this stuff seems legit yo http://www.menards.com/msds/101672_002.pdf


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## Bluewind (Oct 24, 2012)

You never gave us your water perimeters hun. Would you mind?

Cichlids are usually not beginner fish IMO unless your water chemistry is naturally suited to their needs. Anytime you have to alter your water chem to suit your fish it's usually either a bad idea or an undertaking suited for expert or at least intermediate aquarium enthusist. 

Sand is a great substrate. Although gravel may look cleaner, it is actually far from it. Poop, uneaten food, and any other type of matter falls into the cracks between the rocks where bottom feeders cannot get to it. There, it sits and rots becoming a nitrate factory. You could try vacuming with it, but if you have rooted plants, how can you dig into gravel to get the junk out without distubing the roots? Itz's why I have sand. Everythin sits right on top for easy cleaning and if you get multiple colors, the debre wont show up.

So, what type of sand? Right now, you may be thinking of looks, but one day you might want a soft bellied species and can't get it because of your substrate. I mean, who wants the freakin headache of changingout a substrate including stressing out all your fish? Believe me, it's no fun So which sands would I recomend? Here are my experences with a few...
1. Pool Filter Sand: This has the texture of a facial exfoliant and I looked at everal brands, so it's not for soft bellied fish or inverts. It took me a couple hours to clean using a hose. My plants grew well in it, but I believe it contributed to my brown algae outbrake, so I changed it out. Plus, I wanted to add bottomfeeders.
2. Play Sand: This has the texture of driveway dirt. Not as dirty as soil, but you better be ready for some cleaning! And remember, all brands are NOT created equal. Rather you will be spending 2 hours or 12 cleaning it depends greatly on the brand.
3. CaribSea Supernaturals: This namebrand has a texture like beachsand. It does require rinsing (like any sand) but it will take you less than an hour (took me 20 min). Only drawback is it's price.

On a side note, although I have not had it, sandblasting sand is in fact made to be abrasive. Are you sure that would work for your tank?

Now, on to fish. In a 55 gallon, you can house a variety of fish. Once you find fish that suit your water chem, you can start narrowing the list down. The best way to maxmize the space in your tank is to divide up the swimming levels and use at least 2 of them. Have bottom dwellers and mid level swimmers or something that will be working th walls while your other fish work the middle.

Then once you have an idea of what swim levels you want to fill up, decide what size of fish you want. Big fish plus small fish usually equals the smal fish becoming lunch. You need to decide about what size the average fish will be in your tank and rather or not you want a schooling species. Some species are amazing when in groups, but skidish or violent when stocked in too small of groups. And keep your filter in mind when choosing as the current may be too strong fo some species. 

Now what about compatability? The species you select must all survive together in the same water at the same temp with the same plants/decor and the same filter. So you shouln't put a fish that lives in water that is 72-76F with one that lives in water that's 78-84F. Even if you split the difference and make the water temp 77F, they are both living outside their recomended rane which isn't good for either one. It's like giving a kid the adult dose of a medication. Sure it may work in a pinch, but there's a reason why you shouldn't do it if you can help it. And you shouldn't put fish together that as a rule of thumb do not get along. You might as well just hand th shop owner a fistfull of cash and walk out without the fish than buy them, deal with the fighting, and have to either spend money on treatments to heal the injured fish or euthanize it. That is, if the agressor didn't just eat what was left of the other fish before you were the wiser.

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure


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## Bluewind (Oct 24, 2012)

rexpepper651 said:


> im not going to have any bottom guys/gals


While I repect your decision (it is your tank after all), I was hoping I might get you to reconsider. Some nice algae eaters can help keep your tank clean and thing like Loaches are good at clening the sand. There is a type of snail (someone help me with the name please) that will stir your sand for you. Bottom feeders add life to the bottom of your tank so it looks more active. 

Also, consider the fact of teritory. You have a 55 gallon correct? That is nearly 2ft deep. If you add only mid water fish, you will only be able to add so many because each one will need x amount of space, none of which being the bottom of the tank. That mean that your tank could in fact handle the bioload of more fish, but not have room for more midlevel swimmers. Make sense?


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## JDM (Dec 9, 2012)

rexpepper651 said:


> im not going to have any bottom guys/gals





rexpepper651 said:


> I think


That blasting sand would be fine without them but the data sheet keeps using the word "abrasive" and it's not sand so much as glass... sort of.

Oh, you might want to careful of the melting point... 2500 might be too low :roll:

Jeff.


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## JDM (Dec 9, 2012)

Malaysian Trumpet Snails, AKA MTS.

Jeff.


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## Bluewind (Oct 24, 2012)

Thanks Jeff. I for the life of me couldn't think of what they were called! XD


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

rexpepper651 said:


> im not going to have any bottom guys/gals


Cichlids have been mentioned, they are substrate filter feeders, so rough sand is not advisable.

A note on black, I tried this and will never go back again. It shos everything, at least my tank did. I never notice detritus on my mixed sand (play sand), but every little speck showed up with black.


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

lol thanks for all that useful info ya got there. i already have a pool filter sand bottom planted tank that i do enjoy a great deal. i might pass on the blasting sand you had a good point maybe in the future. i changed my gravel to pfs and that sucked. maybe a black sand substrate will be better for the fish less pleasing to the eye but thats ok. lol dont worry about my water dude haha i was just trying to get some ideas of how some people pick and choose their set up thats all. everything you said made perfect sense. 
im glad you got so detailed but i do know all of which you speak of. 

haha better keep it away from my heaters then right? lol 2500


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

lol thanks for all that useful info ya got there. i already have a pool filter sand bottom planted tank that i do enjoy a great deal. i might pass on the blasting sand you had a good point maybe in the future. i changed my gravel to pfs and that sucked. maybe a black sand substrate will be better for the fish less pleasing to the eye but thats ok. lol dont worry about my water dude haha i was just trying to get some ideas of how some people pick and choose their set up thats all. everything you said made perfect sense. 
im glad you got so detailed but i do know all of which you speak of. 

haha better keep it away from my heaters then right? lol 2500 jeeze


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## Bluewind (Oct 24, 2012)

Well, if you realy want to know how I (who is a she btw  ) chose my fish, I'll show you.

1st, water perimeters. My water is soft with 6.5-6.8pH. That rules out a lot of fish!

2nd, tank size. I have a 10gal and a 25gal. That rules out more fish (especially in the 10)

3rd, swim level and size of fish. I want smaller fish and something on both the bottom and mid level for lots of movement. I wouldn't mind a school or 2 if they would fit.

4th, live plants or no? Some fish will graze on live plants and some with flat out distroy them. I wanted live plants.

5th, compatability between fish inclding that impulse buys when I was a newbie.
In the 10gal, I have my little impulse buy, a male VT Betta named Gus. So, what goes with him AND my water? Kuhli Loaches, Otos, and the smaller types of Corys are all good options for me. Kuhlis thrive in 20gal+ tanks, but can live happy lives in a 10. However, I had bought Mystory Snails and as Kuhlis can eat snails, I ruled them out (btw, snails and soft water do not mix. I have 1 healthy adult. The rest did not make it because the water was contraindicative to shell growth). This leaves me with Otos and Corys. As Otos are not readily avaliable in my area and have a higher bioload, I will be getting Corys to add to it soon.
For my 25gal, I decided to make it a betta sorority as I love the breed. To add movement to my entire tank as well as a cleaning force, I will be adding the 2 breeds I really liked but could not add to my 10gal - Kuhli Loaches and Otos

And that's it in a nutshell


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## Bongox3 (May 11, 2013)

It would be neat to see ur progress from start to finish....would u consider posting pics? Ya sure ya want sand? Not to stir the pot lol... If I ever get to my other tank (completely dried & empty now) i was considering going with a think soil base with substrate mid level, and smooth small natural gravel/sand top surface.... How's it coming along with you?


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

yeah! see thats what i was lookin for! ill take pics def. ive been considering the dirt. i think i found my fishes too. so far im thinkin cardinal tetras and marble hatchets. not sure yet on what else


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## Bongox3 (May 11, 2013)

I really dig cardinals...don't know much about m. hatchet fish - but both are from SA, cardinals chiefly in the Orinoco and ***** river - I'm not trying to show off by listing the rivers (which I probably spelled wrong!) but YouTube both and check out the natural habitat for ideas... I was doing this all last night in regards to my cichlids and in my humble opinion, i think that's the best way to go....the more natural the more stunning... And the videos are fascinating....Just my two cents.... If the pros say these guys are compatible, I say go for it!!!!

Also, just for kicks, YouTube blackwater aquariums... Don't know much about them, but so far they seem very interesting.... Definitely going to research more....

Cheers! -mike


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## rexpepper651 (Dec 25, 2012)

im really diggin the cardinals too and the jumbo neons. ill check out those videos! thanks


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