# Ich treatment progress....



## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Hi. Advice needed....

I'm currently into my 8th day of treating for ich. I'm using the high temp/salt method. Only three loaches were visibly affected on day 1. The protocol for day 9 calls for lowering the temp by one degree (which would be 84 degrees) and a 20% water change. My problem is that I'm still seeing white spots on those same three loaches but none on the other tank inhabitants.

I'm concerned as tomites must be in their free swimming stage in order for the treatment to be successful. After falling "off" the fish how soon do the tomites emerge? Do the tomites have only 48 hours in which to find a host before they die?

I guess the main question I have is: How many days after the last visible white spot is seen do I maintain the current 85 degrees & current salt content? It's been 8 days since the my last water change. 
I've been checking water parameters every day and they remain spot on.

I don't know in the days to follow if I should:
~maintain the 85 degrees, or begin to adjust one degree lower each day until 78 is reached?
~do or not do a water change? 
~add or subtract salt?
~or a combo of any of the above?

The directions I'm following never mentioned what to do if visible spots were still visible on day 9 of treatment.
I have no idea how to proceed and really need advice with this.
Much thanks in advance to anyone & everyone who can help.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I'm on day 9....can anyone advise what I should do????


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

If the white spots are still visible, I would maintain the high temperature and keep the salt content steady. If you need to do a water change for regular routine purposes, go for it, just replace it with same-concentration salt water.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Common sense told me that was the answer but wanted it verified by a pro. I saw only one spot left this morning so will continue with temp/salt. How many days after the last white spot is seen do I continue treatment? Two days, three to be safe?

I'm not sure how I determine the amount of salt content to put back in the tank after the water change is complete. I know that salt does not evaporate. I have no idea how to calculate for this. Math was never one of my better subjects.... 
Considering that my water parameters are still perfect I think that waiting a few more days isn't going to hurt anything. Would you agree?


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

I agree. The free-floating ich parasites need to find a host within 48 hours, so just to be on the safe side I would say three days after the last white spot is gone would be a good time to start lowering the temp and reducing the salt content.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

That's what I thought and I thank you so much for confirming!!


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## satwood (Oct 6, 2007)

Hi,

I hope your progess is good. I went a full 5 days after my last white spot was gone before I started lowering the temp and changing out water. I did two water changes during the cycle and used salted water for those changes. Don't be in too much of a hurry, an extra day or two seems to be no problem once the fish get used to the new conditions I think. My tank went an extra week altogether and only some dead leaves on the plants showed any syptoms of what I was doing. My mollies and platys all had babys during the cycle and my cories actually gained weight - :-?

Tell us how you make out.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

As of this morning I still see two white spots remaining on one of the clowns. I started treatment on 11/10 and am surprised that there are still white spots. The fish are doing just fine but my plants are suffering horribly. The ferns have disintegrated, the cabomba has broken into a bunch of pieces...leaf litter is everywhere. I'm doing a water change and hopefully have it looking a little better. I'm keeping the temp/salt right where it is for 72 hours after the last white spot is seen. I hope that is soon.... 

I've already resigned myself to the fact that I'll most likely lose all my plants and have to start over in that department but priority number one has always been the fish!

Thanks for checking in and I'm glad your tank is now healthy. I'll be glad when mine is!!!


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Arrrgh.....I'm getting so discouraged!

I started treating for ich w/ the high temp & salt method on 11/10 and here it is 11/25 and I'm seeing new spots crop up on my clowns! The clowns are the only fish in the tank showing symptoms. Do I keep continuing with the current salt content and 85 degrees??

I'm concerned about my otos & Denison barbs. Preferred water temp for the barbs according to the stats are 60-77 and prior to this treatment I maintained my tank at 78. 
This morning I found one of my otos belly up.  

I'm not sure what I should do. Water changes until the salt is removed, slowly lowering the temp back down to 78 and then treat with meds? Or continue w/ the salt & temp??? I'm at a complete and total loss as to what I should do.......


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

Hmm that's really discouraging. Do you have a hospital tank you could move the clowns to? There's no sense in continuing treatment in your main tank and destroying your plants and killing your other fish. I would think about continuing treatment in the hospital tank for the loaches and getting your display tank back to suitable conditions for your other fish before any more of them succumb to the stress of the elevated salinity and temperature.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I don't have a hospital tank so I'll start looking for one on craigslist now. What size should it be for seven clowns? They are all 2 inches, except for one who is 3 inches. 
If I can't quickly find what I need on craigslist would an Eclipse 10 suffice?? Too small?? Use some substrate and also remove some bio balls from my current tank to speed up the cycle in the new tank?

The list required to set up this tank would include: a tank, a heater, a filter, hood w/ a light. Anything else? I assume I'd leave it bare-bottomed but some driftwood for the loaches comfort??

I'll have to break down the entire tank in order to net the loaches. Man, what a mess...


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

After some quick browsing: Nothing on craislist but did read where Tyyrlym posts "Something non-reactive that holds water will do just fine. I'm using a 15 gallon clear rubbermaid tub."

I'll use this idea unless something else becomes available between now & tomorrow. Sound ok??


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

That sounds fine. Actually, skip the light. The dark will help keep them calm, and as the ich needs light to survive the darker the better. It should just need a heater and if possible, a filter from your main tank moved over. If you aren't running any other filters, a cheap HOB stuffed full of media from your wet/dry should be ok. Just keep an eye on the water parameters.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I just went out and bought a heater tonight and an Eclipse 12. I'll return the Eclipse and get a rubbermaid tub instead. I'll pull off the extra H.O.T Magnum that I run on my main tank and use that as a filter on the tub.
Thanks so much for the advice & help. Truly appreciate it!


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## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

Did you dissolve salt thoroughly and add gradually? If not, they are at a risk suffering from osmotic shock. Loaches in particular are prone to this. I never had issues treating my own loaches, catfishes and a few others with table salt last time they were struck down by ich.


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## Tyyrlym (Jun 1, 2008)

Moving the loaches to a seperate tank isn't a guarantee to cure yourself of ich. While ich doesn't have a "dormant" stage that will wait for months they suddenly erupt and reinffect all your fish you can have unnoticed parasites on the other fish that can continue the ich life cycle. If you don't treat your main tank there is a very good chance that you'll have another outbreak of ich down the line.

My advice is this, run your temp up a bit higher than normal. A few degrees won't hurt the fish but it will accelerate the parasites life cycle. If you keep it at 78 normally run it up into the low eighties, 82-84. Now treat your whole tank with the meds. After you no longer see any visible cysts on your fish keep treating, you want to continue treating at full strength for at least three days at a minimum, five days preferably and seven if you're really paranoid.

Once your tank is clear it should remain so. From now on use that quarantine tank on any new fish. QT for at least four weeks. That gives any diseases or parasites the fish might have time to flare up and become obvious.

Read up on this website. Best source of ich info I've ever seen. The Skeptical Aquarist


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

Lupin said:


> Did you dissolve salt thoroughly and add gradually? If not, they are at a risk suffering from osmotic shock. Loaches in particular are prone to this. I never had issues treating my own loaches, catfishes and a few others with table salt last time they were struck down by ich.


Yes, I used fully dissolved API Aquarium Salt and used a slow drip method to add it into the tank. The last salt addition was on 11/13 so I'm fairly confident osmotic shock isn't occuring. This morning I notice only one visible cyst on one clown. :-?

Tyyrlym: That link you sent is the exact link I've used as an information resource since all this ich began. I've been running the tank at 85 degrees since 11/13, which is 13 days. There is a blurb in that article about some fish having immunity after being treated with meds. I can't help but think that the other fish in the tank may have developed immunity somewhere down the line. Since I have not had them since birth and purchased them at half their potential size who knows what prior illness & medication treatments may have had?? 

I wish I understood my complete reluctance to treat the main tank with meds...instinctively something in my gut tells me not to treat the main tank with meds at this point in time. Either way I've decided to keep the Eclipse 12. It'll be a nice hospital/QT tank to keep on hand.


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## Tyyrlym (Jun 1, 2008)

In most cases treating your entire tank with meds IS the exact wrong thing to do. In this case it is the appropriate treatment however. Look at it this way, if you treat the tank properly and wipe out the ich infestation then QT all new arrivals the chances of having to deal with this again is very, very low.

When it comes to QT there are two types of people. Those who QT and those who haven't yet had the privilege of watching half their fish die because the new addition had something. Always QT your fish. Setting up a QT tank costs a few bucks but to me that's small potatoes compared to the assurance that when fish go into my display tank they are healthy and won't be infecting the rest of my fish with something.


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## Kim (Apr 30, 2008)

If there are still parasites on the fish, then they will still be in the tank. In this case quarantining the visible affected fish is not going to help. You may have to try an ick medication that contains malachite green. I'm not an expert on how specific species of fish will react to it, but if anyone can point out any that would not react well (feel free to chime in now anyone!) you could always move them to the eclipse and treat them separately with the high temps and salt. If you choose to use the medication I would take the plants out as they will just die anyway and pollute the water. It's a real bummer, but it may be time to bring out the big guns.


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## iamntbatman (Jan 3, 2008)

Just so that people understand why I made the QT suggestion:

I realize that once you have visible signs of ich in the tank, you have it all over your tank, but her other, non-infected fish were suffering because of the high temps and possibly salt content. I merely suggested moving the fish and continuing treatment in QT so that she could get her main display back to normal temperatures and salinity (gradually, of course) to prevent further ich treatment-induced problems in the display. I'm also not sure medicating the display tank is the answer at this point, as your other fish weakened by the salt/heat treatment may be further stressed by being medicated and may not survive.


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