# Help my fish keep hiding?????



## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

My fish Tank​Ive had my tank for maybe 5 months now and i can't figure out whats wrong. Whenever anyone walks in my room, including me, my fish hide. When i lay down on my bed from the side i can see they live together fine. I have 30 gallon tank setup. I do weekly water changes and pH is perfect. I have probably 6 plants varying in size and a small center piece. For some reason the convict comes out every now and again but the rest hide behind the center piece. 

Fish

Green Terror 4"
Blood Parrot 4 1/2"
Black Convict 3 1/2"
(2)Cuckoos Catfish 4", 3"
*I know they will need a bigger tank one day. My brother has a 125 tank setup and needs more fish


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## Blackfeet (Jul 23, 2012)

Without knowing more about your parameters and tank setup I have to tell you that they are still juveniles. More importantly your tank is too small for any of your fish. The minimum tank size for a convict pair is 40 gallons the others need a 55 minimum. When they reach adult size they will kill each other.


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Blackfeet said:


> Without knowing more about your parameters and tank setup I have to tell you that they are still juveniles. More importantly your tank is too small for any of your fish. The minimum tank size for a convict pair is 40 gallons the others need a 55 minimum. When they reach adult size they will kill each other.



24 long 19 high and 15 wide. I know the tanks to small read the blue at the bottom i won't have them in there forever.


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Bump i still need help


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## thekoimaiden (Oct 19, 2011)

Most fish hide due to stress. It sounds like they might be overcrowded. But why not just put the in your brother's 125 gal and get something more suitable for your 30 gal? Suitable fish won't hide because they won't be stressed, and you'll still get the enjoy these fish as they grow out in a nice large tank.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

To answer your direct question, there are two reasons. The first--which is normal and about which you can do nothing except stay in the room more:lol:--is simply the fish's involuntary reaction to a perceived threat. My fish do this. I have a fish room with my 7 tanks, and only enter it specifically to observe the tanks or feed or work (water changes, etc) on them. The fish, being used to no one moving about in the room for most of the day, will naturally hide when I enter the room. This is a natural reaction to escape a predator. Once I am sitting in the chair for a few moments, life returns to normal. But if I make any sudden movement, they usually disappear (some are more prone to this than others). I have noticed that on the day I do the water changes, they are far less inclined to hide after I have been in the room for maybe an hour, moving around from tank to tank.

The second reason has already been touched on by Blackfeet. I realize the fish are still "small" relatively speaking, but they are now in much too small a space together. And this does cause problems that lead to stress and this weakens the fish's immune system making disease much more probable later down the road, and it may increase their natural aggression or just the opposite--make them withdraw to the point that they die from that. So the fright response may be heightened due to this too.

Fish grow continuously, and they need sufficient space throughout their lives to be able to do so normally. They also have behaviours that cannot be changed because the fish species evolved accordingly. Even if no physical aggression is observed, the pheromones and allomones released by all fish are chemical signals that other fish read, and this causes stress just as much. Stress is the direct cause of almost all fish disease and health problems; you can read more here:
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-articles/stress-freshwater-aquarium-fish-98852/

Byron.


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Byron said:


> To answer your direct question, there are two reasons. The first--which is normal and about which you can do nothing except stay in the room more:lol:--is simply the fish's involuntary reaction to a perceived threat. My fish do this. I have a fish room with my 7 tanks, and only enter it specifically to observe the tanks or feed or work (water changes, etc) on them. The fish, being used to no one moving about in the room for most of the day, will naturally hide when I enter the room. This is a natural reaction to escape a predator. Once I am sitting in the chair for a few moments, life returns to normal. But if I make any sudden movement, they usually disappear (some are more prone to this than others). I have noticed that on the day I do the water changes, they are far less inclined to hide after I have been in the room for maybe an hour, moving around from tank to tank.
> 
> The second reason has already been touched on by Blackfeet. I realize the fish are still "small" relatively speaking, but they are now in much too small a space together. And this does cause problems that lead to stress and this weakens the fish's immune system making disease much more probable later down the road, and it may increase their natural aggression or just the opposite--make them withdraw to the point that they die from that. So the fright response may be heightened due to this too.
> 
> ...


I spend most of my day at school leaving at 6 and coming home at 7 maybe even 9 so would maybe turning my tv on work or letting my dog in because even when i just sit they hide. Another question is there any way i can maybe just more the parrot into the 125g. Ive raised the GT since he was super little (my first fish) and i would love to keep him in there as long as i can. I plan on getting a much larger tank soon, however my parents wanna wait awhile.*Any suggestions for fish that i could put in a 30g that are still pretty big. 

Thanks for the feedback


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Emerald Terror said:


> I spend most of my day at school leaving at 6 and coming home at 7 maybe even 9 so would maybe turning my tv on work or letting my dog in because even when i just sit they hide. Another question is there any way i can maybe just more the parrot into the 125g. Ive raised the GT since he was super little (my first fish) and i would love to keep him in there as long as i can. I plan on getting a much larger tank soon, however my parents wanna wait awhile.*Any suggestions for fish that i could put in a 30g that are still pretty big.
> 
> Thanks for the feedback


It is movement around the room that matters, and I doubt the dog would achieve this; the TV would not. Whgen i used to have my fish tanks as part of my living room space in a condo, the fish were used to me moving about and this was never as evident. But i still think this is only part of the issue. The combination of fish in the small 9to them) space is I think affecting them.

You have no space for more fish unless you take out all that is now in the tank, as these individually are outgrowing that tank fast.


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Byron said:


> It is movement around the room that matters, and I doubt the dog would achieve this; the TV would not. Whgen i used to have my fish tanks as part of my living room space in a condo, the fish were used to me moving about and this was never as evident. But i still think this is only part of the issue. The combination of fish in the small 9to them) space is I think affecting them.
> 
> You have no space for more fish unless you take out all that is now in the tank, as these individually are outgrowing that tank fast.


How big of a tank would i need to keep all three and maybe a pleco or two? And lets say i got rid of all three and put them into my bros tank what kinda decently big fish could i have in the 30?


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Emerald Terror said:


> How big of a tank would i need to keep all three and maybe a pleco or two? And lets say i got rid of all three and put them into my bros tank what kinda decently big fish could i have in the 30?


A 30g is not sufficient space for any "large" fish, depending upon what you mean by large. I have a 30g and a 33g (and other larger tanks too) and my 30/33 have small shoaling fish in them.

Off the top of my head I am not sure you can mix those cichlids successfully without a very large tank, but I'll defer to one of our resident cichlid experts.


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Byron said:


> A 30g is not sufficient space for any "large" fish, depending upon what you mean by large. I have a 30g and a 33g (and other larger tanks too) and my 30/33 have small shoaling fish in them.
> 
> Off the top of my head I am not sure you can mix those cichlids successfully without a very large tank, but I'll defer to one of our resident cichlid experts.


Alright im pretty sure they will be fine none of them show any signs of physical damage and there in my puny tank.


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## Blackfeet (Jul 23, 2012)

Apistogramma and ram cichlids are the only cichlids for your tank size but only one pair of them. There are rainbow fish, sailfin mollies, and angels. It depends on what you consider large and the parameters of your water


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Do you think the green terror, parrot, and convict can live together for three more months?


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Emerald Terror said:


> Do you think the green terror, parrot, and convict can live together for three more months?


Still need this


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## Blackfeet (Jul 23, 2012)

No that will allow enough time to establish territories and then the aggression will come out


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Blackfeet said:


> No that will allow enough time to establish territories and then the aggression will come out


But they have been in this tank for a long time and none of the fins are hurt. O and this topic is pointless for some reason my fish learned within these days to come up when i walk up to the tank. I love seeing them there super awesome


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## Blackfeet (Jul 23, 2012)

They are coming up because the think you are feeding them. Fish adjust to a routine quickly feeding the same time of day encourages this. 
In that case consider yourself lucky. I only have personal experience with convicts but the ones you have are close to full grown and will start taking a territory and defending it any time now. The ones I had attacked and killed all the other dither fish I had in the tank with them and then the female


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## djembekah (Feb 13, 2012)

I'd really take their advice, and move them ASAP. You don't want anyone dead, do you?


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## Emerald Terror (Sep 16, 2012)

Blackfeet said:


> They are coming up because the think you are feeding them. Fish adjust to a routine quickly feeding the same time of day encourages this.
> In that case consider yourself lucky. I only have personal experience with convicts but the ones you have are close to full grown and will start taking a territory and defending it any time now. The ones I had attacked and killed all the other dither fish I had in the tank with them and then the female


I took the green terror and the convict out for now my parents plan on getting me a much larger tank soon so until then ill have to live with my parrot


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