# My fish need your help :(



## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

My fish, well whats left of them, need your help. -tear-

Started out in December...a friend moved and gave us his 50 gal tank...fully stocked, great fish (i loved them..rip).

They did great...a month later my 2 1/2 yo son pours the whole container of food in...the water was brown...couldnt see anything...so I need to clean it...I take out some water..add some water...take out some water, add more water...the fish died. They were beautiful fish. The only 2 that survived were the 2 'sucker' catfish...one was the lil albino kind.

I found an ad on craigs list...someone was giving away fish...so I went and picked up 4...pliates? (sp) fish..they were HUMUNGOUS, looked pregnant overfed idk...one died the first night. So now im thinking great now I have 'infected' my tank with some diseased fish. here we are a month+ later 1...maybe 2 of those 'plieates' fish are still alive. I SEE 1...idk where the other is...maybe dead inside one of the decor? They dont even 'swim' around. Just sit at the bottom of the tank and hide.

This week the rocks.gravel w/e were turning green...so i added the algae stuff...my albino fish died. and another of the pleid.. blah blah fish.(which is why im confused did 3 die? or one is missing?

I've been cleaning the filter...took out the carbon filter for a night. today I just added more algae stuff took out the carbon filter. The water is 'cloudy'....NOT alot...just not nice and crystal. 

What should I do? Take out my only surviving sucker fish? Clean the entire tank rocks, decor, all? I think im going to throw that last craigs list fish in the pond!


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## Livelifelaughlove (Jan 11, 2009)

have you checked the parims of the water? that would help alot


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Im wondering if the cloudy is just the algae dying...or if its them 'blooming'


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## adpierin11 (Jan 2, 2008)

First thing we need to know what is the ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, pH levels? Knowing these levels will head us in the right direction into figuring out what possibly could be going on with your tank, and how to help save your other fish.
Adding products to your aquarium to get rid of the algae I think only make it worse. If you are having an algae problem it could be do to a lot of things. How many hours a day is the light on? Is the light old? Is there natural light, like the sun, on the tank? How often do you do water changes, and how much do you think you take out when you do the water change?
When your son poured in the entire bag of food and you did those water changes, I am afraid that those water changes did some damage. Doing those large water changes in such a short amount of time (that's how I understood it) is not good. 
Do you have any pictures so we can figure out what fish you have so you know how exactly to care for them?
Hopefully you can answer these questions quickly so more people can give you some input.

**Forgot to mention, that the cloudy water could be the beneficial bacteria blooming, so with all the cleaning you have done you most likely have sent your tank back into a cycle, which is deadly for most fish. When dealing with an aquarium it is best to leave the filter and biowheels alone unless they are broken. The beneficial bacteria lives on those and the gravel/decor in the tank so when you do such a clean all at once you will send your tank back into a cycle** 
Stop the cleaning until we know exactly what's going on.... thanks!


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

im leaving it alone until i get a test kit.

I took some pics...posted them here..look on the 'tank' tab over <----- there.

Only got 2 fish.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Another thing....its got kinda alot of snails...well the past couple days they all climbed to the top @ the water line...as if they are 'escaping' something. Well...Now I think they are all dying. I see the shells littering the bottom of the tank. From the algae treatment?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

I'm very temped to throw out all the rocks/dead snail included....empty the tank | clean it start fresh. put my sucker fish in a bucket for a week and pitch that other fish.


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## Cody (Dec 22, 2007)

For a week? Most definitley not. Your tank needs to cycle which obviously is the reason why everything is cloudy and dying. And we know nothing because you dont have a liquid test kit (which you need). 

And you have got a pleco and a platy.


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## Sj45 (Jan 5, 2009)

That's not really an option unless you have another cycled tank. Please just don't throw out the platy, I'd hate to see you do that, what you can do is take the rocks out one by one and clean them well (without chemicals/soap) and then get a python water changer and syphon your gravel, that will make a big difference. I've also seem to of heard that these "algae controllers" don't work that well and a normal aquarium scraper/sponge works pretty good for taking algae off the walls.

Definitely get an api master test kit, you probably lost your fish due to high ammonia/nitrite levels. Tell me what happens, don't flush the platy!


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

I think i'll toss all the rocks and get fresh clean new ones...that way I dont have to 'weed' through them picking out the 100 dead snails. (the snails are good right?) I also want to get the 'bottom' filter for under the gravel. I dont exactly have the time to suction my tank every week takieg the "10-15%" of water out and refilling it with 'non cholorine water"...what does that mean anyway? I have to buy like 6 gal bottled water every week? forget that!

I've got the magnetic scraper/brush thing I use often. Will also be getting my test kit ...maybe tomorrow or saturday. I just want a CLEAR tank with pretty fish...-sigh- I do miss those poor fishy i killed. I cried...and still do once in a while over it. 

Also what is the deal with the platy fish? Are they like 'weird' hiding fish? I had 3 others that came with the tank originally...and they were no where near as HUGE as the ones I got on craigslist. They were small and seemed social. Swam around the tank...didnt hide like this other one. Also...are they supposed to look like their stomachs are going to pop? I thought they were pregger when the woman gave them to me.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

ok great I just found one of the 'missing' fish...dead in one of the decorations. yuck. now there is some 'slime' floating in the tank.


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## Cody (Dec 22, 2007)

spammyann said:


> I think i'll toss all the rocks and get fresh clean new ones...that way I dont have to 'weed' through them picking out the 100 dead snails. (the snails are good right?) I also want to get the 'bottom' filter for under the gravel. I dont exactly have the time to suction my tank every week takieg the "10-15%" of water out and refilling it with 'non cholorine water"...what does that mean anyway? I have to buy like 6 gal bottled water every week? forget that!
> 
> I've got the magnetic scraper/brush thing I use often. Will also be getting my test kit ...maybe tomorrow or saturday. I just want a CLEAR tank with pretty fish...-sigh- I do miss those poor fishy i killed. I cried...and still do once in a while over it.
> 
> Also what is the deal with the platy fish? Are they like 'weird' hiding fish? I had 3 others that came with the tank originally...and they were no where near as HUGE as the ones I got on craigslist. They were small and seemed social. Swam around the tank...didnt hide like this other one. Also...are they supposed to look like their stomachs are going to pop? I thought they were pregger when the woman gave them to me.


An undergravel filter will not make up for doing water changes. Dechlorinated is tap water with no chlorine... you can buy a dechlorinator for like $4. And it takes 15 minutes to do a water change. That's what I do on a 40G REEF anyways. 

The platy is acting odd because of A) the terrible water quality or B) not having other platies. They are social. 

You need to be doing daily water changes to help this tank if you want it at all.


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## Mike420 (Mar 13, 2009)

If it were me then I would take the fish and place him/them in a 10G pale with an air hose and stone in with it and take all the water out. When you add the water back in use Aqua Plus Tap Water Conditioner. Just follow the instructions I have a few tanks and that's the best stuff to use and the only chemical I use for my freshwater tanks. Good luck with it though.


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

spammyann said:


> I think i'll toss all the rocks and get fresh clean new ones...that way I dont have to 'weed' through them picking out the 100 dead snails. (the snails are good right?) I also want to get the 'bottom' filter for under the gravel. I dont exactly have the time to suction my tank every week takieg the "10-15%" of water out and refilling it with 'non cholorine water"...what does that mean anyway? I have to buy like 6 gal bottled water every week? forget that!


You need to do a 15% water change everyweek! A "bottom filter" will not help with your situaiton. You do not need to buy 6 gallons of bottled water everyweek. you can use tap water and buy a $5 bottle of de-chlorinator. Changing fish water is the weekly care that fish require, it's crucial for their survival!!! You wouldn't say "forget that" if you had a dog that pooped all over your yard would you? Fish need their water changed.



spammyann said:


> I've got the magnetic scraper/brush thing I use often. Will also be getting my test kit ...maybe tomorrow or saturday. I just want a CLEAR tank with pretty fish...-sigh- I do miss those poor fishy i killed. I cried...and still do once in a while over it.


Everyone wants a "clear tank with pretty fish", thats impossible without weekly care. Losing fish is part of the process though, it happens and the thing you need figure out is....WHY? what's wrong with your tank that killed your fish? Which leads into you needing a test kit.

May sound harsh, but it's the truth. Fish need to be kept for, just like any other pet. If you keep up with your water changes (which will take no more than 20mins, once a week) Your tank will be "clear and have pretty fish in it" for long time. 

Right now you're cylcing, you need to do 10-15% water changes almost daily to get your tank to the level of which you desire


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

ok great so thats is what i needed to hear...that i need to change the water for several days while it 'cycles'. will get the test kit tonight.

our friend who gave us the tank never said i need to 'change' the water weekly. i think he just said add water every week. hes had this tank for years and years.

also i need a 'longer' tube to syphen the water straight into my kitchen sink...would make easier then putting it in a bucket and having to dump that. I've made a mess every time i did that.

the bottom filter would make it easier though to clean the bottom sediment right?


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

with a gravel vac, you can just jam the end of the tube (where the into the siphon is) into the gravel and pull out all the detritis......

How far is your kitchen sink from your tank? I believe for a siphon to work properly.....the drainage bucket (in this case your sink) needs to be below the level of the water you a draining(your tank).....so if you run the siphon out of your tank, down the side of your stand and along the floor and then up to your sink again, I dont think it will drain properly.....

^^^I'm not Bill Nye the science guy, but I think thats how it works!


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

Taking care of fish is alot of work. First you need to make sure u have
~tank
~Heater
~filter
~hood
~gravel vacume
~hospital tank
~water conditioner
~water testing kit
~1ish gallon bucket (no metal on it. use for water changes)
~substrate
~hiding places
~stand
~quarenteen tank (if you add any new fish keep them in a seperate tank for a few weeks to make sure they are not sick
~food
~live plants are good, but not necessary 

You NEED all of these. Do a 15 percent water change once a week (make sure you dechloranate water before you put it in the tank) I vacume gravel once every 2 weeks. If any fish show sighns of illness put them in a differnt tank, away from the other fish to treat ( you can find medication for almost any fish disease at a pet/fish store). hospital tanks should be bare bottom with maybe a flower pot to hide in. If you decide to get new fish, put them in a qt tank for a weeks to make sure they are healthy and happy. check ur water perameters about once a month, or any time a fish looks "off".


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

JohnnyD44 said:


> with a gravel vac, you can just jam the end of the tube (where the into the siphon is) into the gravel and pull out all the detritis......
> 
> How far is your kitchen sink from your tank? I believe for a siphon to work properly.....the drainage bucket (in this case your sink) needs to be below the level of the water you a draining(your tank).....so if you run the siphon out of your tank, down the side of your stand and along the floor and then up to your sink again, I dont think it will drain properly.....
> 
> ^^^I'm not Bill Nye the science guy, but I think thats how it works!


 
The kitchen sink is 3 foot from the tank. I have about a 4 foot tube...it works...to a certain point. lol


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## Cody (Dec 22, 2007)

Look up a Python. They are gravel vacs that attach to your sink.


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

were you able to get a test kit yet? if so what are you readings?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

I did the test strip kind......5 in 1....everything was fine.

Nitrate looked to be 20
Nitrite was 0
hardness was up looked to be 150 which is the top of the 'ok' scale. can that kill ur fish?
alkalinity was in the ideal range somewhere between 120 - 180
and ph looked to be 7.8 -alkaline-

which well...could mean it was higher 3 days ago.

I think the water looks to be settling down...I THINK it's clearer.

It was never REALLY cloudy...just wasnt crystal clear as I would like.

I'll be waiting before I get more fish. Darn things are expensive!


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

did you get a gravel vacume? they are a huge help!


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## Cody (Dec 22, 2007)

Ugh... Me and others specifically mentioned a LIQUID kit. Test strips are completely in-accurate and do not work. Because of this, you still have not posted your parameters.


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

I used to have test strips, and they worked ok.......


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## Sj45 (Jan 5, 2009)

spammyann said:


> I think i'll toss all the rocks and get fresh clean new ones...that way I dont have to 'weed' through them picking out the 100 dead snails. (the snails are good right?) I also want to get the 'bottom' filter for under the gravel. I dont exactly have the time to suction my tank every week takieg the "10-15%" of water out and refilling it with 'non cholorine water"...what does that mean anyway? I have to buy like 6 gal bottled water every week? forget that!
> 
> I've got the magnetic scraper/brush thing I use often. Will also be getting my test kit ...maybe tomorrow or saturday. I just want a CLEAR tank with pretty fish...-sigh- I do miss those poor fishy i killed. I cried...and still do once in a while over it.
> 
> Also what is the deal with the platy fish? Are they like 'weird' hiding fish? I had 3 others that came with the tank originally...and they were no where near as HUGE as the ones I got on craigslist. They were small and seemed social. Swam around the tank...didnt hide like this other one. Also...are they supposed to look like their stomachs are going to pop? I thought they were pregger when the woman gave them to me.


It is very possible the platy you have is pregnant if it has a dark stomach and looks as though it will pop. Pregnant platy's will also rest on the bottom of the tank to save energy during pregnancy.

it is very easy to get de-clorinated water, all petstores will sell a "de-clorinator" which will instantly declorinate water from your tap, from there, if it is the right temperature, you can add it to your tank.

I do not recommend an under-gravel filter as I've heard they don't work the magic they claim and are a hassle to clean.

Just make sure your water temperature and parameters are correct. Your platy should begin to become more active when they are or you add more platy's. Although they are not "schooling fish" they feel more comfortable in a group.

If you bought test strips, just live with them but follow the instructions "perfectly" what is your ammonia reading?


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## Cody (Dec 22, 2007)

veganchick said:


> I used to have test strips, and they worked ok.......


Worked, yes. Correct, no. They are completely inaccurate. No questions asked.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

So some of the snails I thought were dead...aren't. They are crawling around the tank .(though im sure alot of them ARE dead)

When I first got the 4 platy fish they all acted 'weird'. like sitting on the bottom of the take and hiding.

I saw one of those gravl suction things...basically just a tube...note I just went to walmart last night and didnt have time to get to the pet store today is my sons first bday party.


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

snails are weird like that! Talk to lupin if you want help with them!


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## Spoon (Feb 22, 2009)

Hi Spammyann. and Happy Birthday to your son. Take your time with the tank. Like I saw on someone's signature, nothing good happens fast in a fish tank. Let it settle out, don't add anymore fish. Hopefully some will survive. You really need the liquid test kit. I got one for $23 with shipping on amazon.com. API master test kit. If your are going to try to let the tank cycle (bacterias grow, feed on ammonia, feed on the nitrites, blah blah) with fish in the tank you are going to have to water changes till the bacteria kicks in. I cycled mine with angelfish, but also did 33% water changes daily. I also added a lot of bacteria from a donor tank.
Good luck, and thanks for the laughs!


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Another Dip stick test...

nitrate: 0-20 range
nitrite: 0
hardness: ~150
Alkalinity: 120 - 180 range
ph: 7.2 (went down from the first time)

I still need to get a ammonia test...and declorinizer.


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

You need chlorinater before you do any water changesm and you need to do water changes now!


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## dramaqueen (Jul 7, 2008)

Thats DEchlorinator.


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

lol whoops! I spelled it wrong so I clicked the little autofix thingy and thats what I get for not looking back over it!


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

spammyann,

YOU NEED TO GET A LIQUID TEST KIT!!! it's as simple as that. Although liquid test strips work, like cody said, they are completley inaccurate. You tank is still cycling, like spoon said....to get your tank to the proper level you are looking at 30-35% water chages *daily* until your bacteria's settle out.

I know you said you were not a fan of water changes, but once you get the hang of it (which you will doing one almost everysingle day!  ) they really do not take that long and are neccessary for your fish. 

Buy a bottle of dechlorinator and get to changing your water!!!!


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

yes, yes, yes i know.

Ok so i was supposed to baby sit a little boy today, but im doing it tomorrow instead...in conclustion...

After 2 diaper changes, fresh clothes, a bottle, and typing time...I will be out the door to the pet store in I say...15 minutes

Make it 25...lol


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## veganchick (Jan 10, 2009)

lol! have fun!


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

grab a garvel vac if you don't have one already!


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

I passed on the gravel vac this time. The test supplies and dechlorinizer was $30.

soooo I got my parameters now..wanna hear them?


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## Spoon (Feb 22, 2009)

So what did you get?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

one sec i just took a pic of the cards and the tubes next to them l


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Nitrite: 0
PH: 7.6?
Ammonia:0
Nitrate: 10


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

lookin good....you're PH seems to be a little high though. I'm not sure on what you plan on keeping tho

How's the water changes doing during your cycling stage? getting the hang of it?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Just tested again...everything is the same except nitrate ( tested it 2 times in a row just now to be sure i did it right) It's down to 5 now.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

also just did a water change. my next investment will be the gravel syphen


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

if you tested your nitrates back-to-back and the reading went from 30ish to 5??? changes are you didn't do it right one of the two times. I'm not positive, it just seems really unusual for nitrates to fluxuate that quickly. Someone else may chime in on this subject.

Any fish in your tank right now?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Nitrate was at 10 yestruday afternoon...and is down to 5 now...when I tested earlier I got 5 both times.

I still have the pleco and platy in there....and the snails.

OH...and I totally tested it before I the the water change...soo...I guess I should test again?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Is it important for me to know what fish 'were' in there...you know the ones I killed...

I really liked those kinds and want to get them again. I saw one kind @..walmart that was like what we have there before.

Hell if i remember the name though...OH

So I just googled "freshwater tropical fish" and a picture of one of the kinds poped up...Tiger Barb.

Another kind we had looked like the tiger barb...just it didnt have stripes ...and it was blue/greenish..."looked like" because of the shape.

Then we had the small platy fish, and what looked to me were minnows or something, also a red tailed shark fish? He actually died before I even got the tank up and running originally...he totally jumped out of the bucket we had him in temporaily


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## Spoon (Feb 22, 2009)

Be sure to read the instructions that came with the test kit. With the nitrates it says to add 10 drops from bottle one and invert the tube several times, shake bottle two well before adding 10 drops, then shake tube vigorously and wait 10 minutes before comparing colors. With Nitrites I think you only have to wait 5 minutes.


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

FYI:
Nitate API test procedure: 
Into vial fill tank water to the fill line on the vial. Add 10 drops from bottle #1 and shake well for 30 seconds. Into that same vial now add 10 drops from bottle #2 and shake well for one minute. Put the vial down and let it sit for five minutes. After five minutes check the vial against the nitrate card for your reading.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Everything is still the same. Nitrate (yes I tested correctly) was 5.

Then last night it was looking more like 0

I'll test it here again in a minute.

What can I do for my Ph? It's high...

Edit:

Ok so the nitrate looks again like its close to 5. I can tell with the dip strips too that it is less then it was a few days ago before the water changes. The strip shows light light pink.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

aunt kymmie said:


> FYI:
> Nitate API test procedure:
> Into vial fill tank water to the fill line on the vial. Add 10 drops from bottle #1 and shake well for 30 seconds. Into that same vial now add 10 drops from bottle #2 and shake well for one minute. Put the vial down and let it sit for five minutes. After five minutes check the vial against the nitrate card for your reading.


 Must shake bottle number two for nitrate test before placing drops from bottle number two into test vial. I actually hate the nitrAte test but if directions aren't followed exactly then readings can be off.
The good part is,, Ammonia, and nitrites are remaining at zero Right?


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

Tank is looking more clear.  Nitrates are droping to.


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## JohnnyD44 (Dec 5, 2008)

what are you readings now?


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## mollies (Mar 27, 2009)

just like said befor your tank was cycl and u shouldnt get rid of the rock do to having the cycl start all over. i woldnt recomend bot wter eather as your tap water should do just fine with some water conditioner get ur ph and al of that established befor buying anymore fish dnt just chang ur filters as it could take some of the bactira out that u need. and would make it cycl again.


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

*We bought 6 baby tiger barbs last week...and they are still alive!  YAY!*

*They are so cute and small. *

*Also an unfortunate event...my bottom feeder died. Idk what happened or how long he was dead...but when I finally went looking for him ...he wasnt even a whole fish it was just pieces of fish. He was inside one of the decor..I got tired of fish going in there and dieing...idk if they were getting suck or lost or what but I smashed 2 holes in the back of it so they can escape either way.*


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## spammyann (Mar 12, 2009)

NECRO:

My 6 tiger barb babies are growing up! I got them over 2 months ago! Allso still have one of the craigslist platy fish. 

I know it's been months but I finally was able to get a gravel vac. I've done water changes for the past 3 days with it and might I say it was dirrrrrrrrty the first time. 

The water has been looking good the past 2 months, but it's looking better each day. 

We went to the pet store to scop out what fish we might like to add next. Definately need some bottom feeders and maybe 2 more platy.

I think I might also like to get one of those lil red tail shark fish things like the tank originally have.

Let me hear your suggestions: 




Edit: 

Also wanted to know how/what I can use to remove the calcium/lime deposits (fish safe of course) at the top of the tank...I tried my algae scrubber but that doesnt work and it's building up ... it looks ugly!


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