# Black moor dying help!!!



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

i recently bought some black moores to keep as pets...about 2 weeks l8er 1 of them started to thin out and his tail started to seperate into little sections. His scales look rotten and he only move with 1 arm. Now he sits at the top of the tank and gobbles 24/7. What should i do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
o btw what does it mean when a goldfish gobbles at the surface of a tank?


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

it sounds like its either ammonia poisoning, nitrite poisoning or lack of dissolved oxygen, please include these information please 

1. Size of aquarium (# of gallons)
2. Is your aquarium set up freshwater or saltwater?
3. How long the aquarium has been setup
4. What fish and how many are in the aquarium (species are important to know)
5. Are there live plants in the aquarium?
6. What make/model filter are you using?
7. Are you using a CO2 unit?
8. Does your aquarium receive natural sunlight at any given part of the day?
9. When did you perform your last water exchange, and how much water was changed?
10.How often and what foods do you feed your fish?
11.Is your aquarium light incandescent or fluorescent and how often is it kept on?
12.What specific concerns bring you here at this time?
13. Water are your water test results for:
pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate?


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

*thanks for reponding*

1. 9" *9" *15"
2. fresh
3. 2 weeks
4. moors and common red goldfish
5. no 1 fake with pebbles on the bottom not much should i add more
6. i dont have a filter i change water every 1 or 2 weaks its a bowl so a filter wont fit
7.no should i what is that
8. yah some what
9. like 75% every 1 to 2 weeks
10.once a day
11.no lights just sunligh i guess
12.i dont want my fish to die does he have bacterial infection?.
plus he doesnt eat every often
13. no i bought drinking water from walmart lol
7 fish 3 moor 3 common 1 bottom feeder


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

ok, many problems here, first problem and the biggest problem you have, the tank is too small for it, two goldfish alone require 30 gallons or more, i can go on forever on why they need a bigger tank but that will take a couple of pages.

Ok all your other problems are connected to the fact you cannot have goldfish in a bowl. Also im looking for water parameters not what type of water that you use. But this wont matter as i know exactly what is wrong without you telling me the parameters

The goldfish is suffering from a highly toxic ammonia poisoning. In case you didnt know ammonia is created after a fish poops as the poop decays. Ammonia will burn the gills like acid litterally suffocating the goldfish, the goldfish is in dire need of oxygen so it "gobbles" water from the top of the bowl which carries the most oxygen. No matter what you do you cannot fix this problem in this bowl simply because it is too small. It will die if you dont act fast.

Now what you do: get the goldfishes a bigger tank, a tank bigger than 30 gallons for them with filtration enough to filter a 60 gallon, if possible you can give them away to someone who has a tank that can house them or a pond as a pond will be even better. Thats all you need to do, simple as that, as you are getting the goldfish tank ready, do daily 50% water changes this will buy you a tiny bit more time. Once set up immediatly move the goldfish into the big tank, if you are able to keep the ammonia down in the 30 gallon using water changes (no chemicals) the goldfish will heal by itself. Please act fast, the goldfish wont last long in a bowl. I wish you the best of luck.


Do not blame yourself for this, it is the companies that make and sell bowls fault, they shouldnt advertise bowls for goldfish, the only fish that can fit in a small bowl is a betta (there might be more but the betta is the most common) Its sad to know that the second most popular bowl fish is actually one of the worse for a bowl.


Please also understand i am here to help, whatever questions you have ask them, however stupid they sound, this forum will help you out great. I wish you the best of luck with your goldfish, i hope it will be alright.


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok thx ill defiently listen but the thing is my rents wont buy me a new taNK but i am can add a filter to the tank would that help. see my rents care about 2 things money and good grades boy do i hate them at times.
but ill thing to an alternative
if not ill try to buy one my self thx for helping me.


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

hmm if you cant get a bigger tank do you know anyone else who will take in the goldfish? It is a really big concern of having this goldfish here, even with a filter the ammonia levels are too high. There are other fish that can go into the bowl better though, this includes bettas


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

well i guessi could convince ym mom and my dad cu zmy mom is better at taking care will my dad is just a cold blooded monster lol ok of course 30 gallon or higher
how much will that cost?


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

o and 1 thing the dying fish wont eat so is that cuz of ammonia


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

you can get a second hand 30 gallon tank cheap, maybe like..... 75-100 dollars with everything included, filter, stand etc

The fish not eating might have stuff to do with ammonia, if not it could be swim bladder disease from the gulping of the air at the top of the bowl, the ammonia could have opened another doorway to an internal paracite but it could just be from poor water conditions. you are going to have to ask someone for better help on this as i am no good with feeding disorders.


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

thx u r very good help thx alot but ill ask u ? l8 though but i message uso u dont hae to hceck this very now and then


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

no need to ask me personally, there are many more people here who can help you with the fish, posting with threads are the best way to go  pm me for off topic things or other stuff, if you have a question, ask the community, we are all nice here.... i think 

I also forgot to welcome you to the community... so welcome :wave:


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k167/henrytheleo/DSC00207.jpg separated tail
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k167/henrytheleo/DSC00206.jpg
seperated tail
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k167/henrytheleo/DSC00205.jpg
white marks on scale

http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k167/henrytheleo/DSC00203.jpg
white patches on scale
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k167/henrytheleo/DSC00205-1.jpg
look that this one i showed the patches


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

ouch it seems like there are many things going on with this goldfish, the fins that are breaking off seems like fin rot, the white spots seems like either a bacterial or fungus infestation, im sorry to say but this fish doesnt seem like it has much of a chance, unless you can get the 30 gallon in less than a week i would recommend enthuanzizeing the goldfish, but wait for other peoples comments before you go on with the enthuanize


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

umm what is fin rioting cuz i found some mild cases on my other fishes and 1 of my reds swims with 1 arm omg this sucks...ok well i will get a filter this weekend and i am trying to get a tank will that help? or do i need treatment


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

*what is fin rioting andfish swiming iwht 1 arm lop sided*

    :x :x :x :?: :?: :?: :?: 
what is fin rioting andfish swiming iwht 1 arm lop sided


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

a 30 gallon tank and treatment, the 30 gallon will help get rid of whats causing the sickness and the medication will stop the sickness.


----------



## Tracy (Aug 4, 2006)

Awww...the poor black moor . If you cannot afford to buy a 30 gallong tank right now, at least buy a 10 gallon tank. It is not too expensive and gold fish (such as the black moor) do not require heat. you can use the 10 gallon tank as a 'hospital' tank until you get a larger one. Keep up with the water changes; add meds if needed but watch your 'biological' filter (the 'good bacteria), as meds can kill them. I hope your black moor survives! I used to keep black moors in a 20 gallon, they were big and gentle and wonderful as pets


----------



## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

Hi.

Fin rot is bacterial infection wherein the fins appear disintegrated with the ray membranes sticking out and having white edges. What are your water parameters? The 'arm' you mentioned is pectoral fins.


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

well i am mixing to get a bigger tank with a filter i just need ot know wat medication and how fast the thing spreads


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok wta meds should i try
?


----------



## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

Fireonthetrack, you might notice an odd flow of posts. I merged your two threads as this is getting confusing. One thread is better than two.

You have not posted your water parameters it seems. Pls post them as soon as possible.

The white patches appear to be a case of columnaris.


musho3210 said:


> the fins that are breaking off seems like fin rot


Separated fins does not always mean it's finrot. It can be a case of torn fins which Melafix can cure. Use Jungle Fungus Eliminator if you clearly suspect finrot. It also helps against columnaris. No need to add salt as Jungle products already contain salt.


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

i dont no wat water parameter is as u can see my fish is in a bowl wiht no filter...should goldfsih be exposed to sunlight? thx pl zhelp


----------



## Lupin (Aug 2, 2006)

fireonthetrack said:


> i dont no wat water parameter is as u can see my fish is in a bowl wiht no filter...should goldfsih be exposed to sunlight? thx pl zhelp


If I were you, I would buy a filter as soon as possible and try to start it. If you have no filters, then your water parameters are most likely at their worst for the fish. I am suspecting you may have ammonia and nitrites at detectable level and nitrates exceeding to dangerous levels already. What is your schedule for water changes?


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

the fish are normally fine in sunshine, as long as it isnt too strong, the problem with it is that the sunshine will promote algae growth which can steal nutrients from the goldfish, expesially oxygen.


As for getting a 10 gallon, i would advise againts it as you are still going to need a 30 gallon tank for it. It, to me that is, would be a waste of money. Do your best at getting a 30 gallon


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok ill do my best at getting a big tank and i change water now 1 to 2 days cuz of no filter but i am getting one this weekend and planning to change water from now on 1 week thx guys i owe u one


----------



## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

You should be changing water at least once every day. Is there someone you can give these fish to? Are there still 7 goldfish in this bowl? An air pump with an air stone dropped in will help with circulation and oxygen production. Keep the water cold, 65 - 68 degrees. Warm water contains less oxygen. Everyone here has all given the same for the best advice in this situation... get those fish out of that bowl as soon as possible, and don't feed every day... only once every other day and just a few pellets. Make sure they eat it all within 1 minute. If they don't finish the food within 1 minute, scoop the rest out.
Good Luck!


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

thx!!!


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok i bought a filter now i have 4 goldfish with 1 bottom fedder in the tank


----------



## musho3210 (Dec 28, 2006)

wow, its worse than i thought, what food do you feed them? try feeding them pellets as these create the least waste.


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok i feed them tetra food


----------



## fireonthetrack (Feb 14, 2007)

ok i got a filter with the same tank and i found out i suck at fish keeping...one of my red fishes have black spots on his back and he lacks movement as he swims and sits at the very bottom of the tank help????


----------



## bettababy (Oct 12, 2006)

fireonthetrack,
I don't wish to be rude, but you do realize that you're going to sit there and just watch the fish die, right? Everyone here that has attempted to help you has given good advice, and if you notice, everyone has said the same things... those fish can't stay in that bowl or they will die. The filter and daily water changes might buy them a few days or weeks, but I tried hard to make it clear in my last post that this is strictly TEMPORARY to get the fish through until you can move them. If you can't take care of them properly, you need to get rid of them. Give them back to the fish store and find something that WILL fit into that bowl. 
Goldfish are a lot of work even in a proper environment. Put bluntly, you are poisoning these fish, please stop! It is pointless for you to keep asking for our help if you don't wish to listen to the advice given. There is no way to make this work, no matter how expert you are at fish keeping... your situation is impossible the way it is now. The right thing to do now is to get those fish out of that bowl and into a proper environment, whether you provide it or someone else provides it, doesn't matter... they are going to die if you don't.


----------

