# Making a cave



## dprUsh83

Hi all,

I was looking in my tank and figured it's never a bad thing to have more cover, but I want something that will look good too. Right now I bought a couple small fake plants and some PVC piping. I was wondering what kind of paint I can use to paint this PVC piping.

Also, right now I'm planning on using silicone caulk to cover the cave in the same gravel that I'm using for my substrate, but if anybody has seen anything that looks better I'd love to hear it!


----------



## jinithith2

Here is a link to an amazing slate cave
enjoy!

http://www.plantgeek.net/article_viewer.php?id=6


----------



## dprUsh83

Yeah, I wanted to do that and make something with slate, but I couldn't find it anywhere I went tonight. Wal-mart and Home Depot both told me it was "out of season".

I told them I'd wait until "Slate Season" started again... :roll: :lol:


----------



## dprUsh83

Any ideas on the paint that can be used? 


:?: :?: :?: :?:


----------



## crazie.eddie

Those slate caves look cool, but looks dangerous for fish, since there are allot of sharp edges.

You can make slate caves from slate tiles and buying a electric wet tile saw (about $80 USD) and using aquarium silicone. They would look like this...











In the tank, you can burry them like this...


----------



## dprUsh83

So..................The uhh......PVC cave I'm making.....which is inferior to these, but um...if I were to paint the pipe, um.....what kind of paint would I use?








:lol:


----------



## crazie.eddie

I've never seen anyone paint anything placed inside the tanks, with the exception of ceramic stuff, which is baked on. I know you can buy colored PVC pipes.


----------



## dprUsh83

crazie.eddie said:


> I've never seen anyone paint anything placed inside the tanks, with the exception of ceramic stuff, which is baked on. I know you can buy colored PVC pipes.


Blast....already bought the white. When I use the caulk to cover it in rocks I'll just make sure I get everything covered.


----------



## crazie.eddie

LOL

The colored PVC is hard to get off the shelf and usually purchased online and allot more cost. What you are doing is common. Some people put some silicone inside and put some rocks in there, so it looks allot more natural.


----------



## dprUsh83

Well I'm using the adhesive to cover the PVC pipe with rocks, but i didn't account for how gross this is, lol. Also, it takes a lot more than what I thought, but having said that....it is going to look pretty good! I'm excited for the outcome.

My goal is to get it covered with rocks tonight, then tomorrow morning I'll spot check it for more rocks, tomorrow afternoon I'll put a couple fake plants on it, then wait 24 hours.....at which point I'll soak it for another 24 hours just for safe measure.


----------



## crazie.eddie

Wait, what kind of adhesive or caulk are you using? Aquarium epoxy and silicone are the only ones I know are safe. I know people have used silicone from hardware stores, but it needs to be silicone with no additives to prevent molds and stuff. I'm paranoid and still prefer to use aquarium silicone. Silicone will not adhere to PVC pipiing too well, but if you sand it to provide a rough surface, then it would adhere better.


----------



## dprUsh83

It's 100% silicone, but I didn't sand it prior. To be honest I can see now that it's had a night to set that it would look good, but mine looks like crap right now. I don't know if I should continue siliconing more rocks on or if I should scrap it and just go out and but a new PVC pipe. I love the idea and with the black rocks it has a lot of potential, but I don't know that it'd be very durable like this.


----------



## crazie.eddie

It will still adhere to the PVC, but if you don't like it, you can easily peal it off. I know. I tried it also and I, too, think it looks VERY CRAPPY. So I decided not to use it. Using rocks leave large gaps. You can probably mix rocks and sand. The sand would fill in the gaps nicely. I'm planning to redo mine over some day.


----------



## dprUsh83

Yeah, I think I'm going to scrap this one all together. I've seen the finished result look good in some places online, but this one just isn't panning out. I can tell it could look so good if I could manipulate the silicone/rocks a little easier, but I don't know that it would last in time even. 

I'm going to go back to the drawing board, caves will be had eventually! :lol:


----------



## Amphitrite

Do you have a picture of what you've done so far?


----------



## crazie.eddie

dprUsh83 said:


> Yeah, I think I'm going to scrap this one all together. I've seen the finished result look good in some places online, but this one just isn't panning out. I can tell it could look so good if I could manipulate the silicone/rocks a little easier, but I don't know that it would last in time even.
> 
> I'm going to go back to the drawing board, caves will be had eventually! :lol:


Yeah, I know what you mean. It's funny how projects look magnificent in our heads, until we actually start doing it, then it's a totally different story.


----------



## dprUsh83

katherine73 said:


> Do you have a picture of what you've done so far?


I'll be sure to get a picture before I toss it out. :lol: 

I figure even a failed project can provide some knowledge for somebody, I hope!


----------



## JouteiMike

I want to make a cave sometime soon. I've been noticing one of my Goldfish trying to squeeze in these caves I made for my loaches, and sometimes it appears he's stuck! Just a little while ago I had to lift one of the rocks up so he could swim out. PCV pipe would be far too small for a growing goldfish, unless I could find some real wide pipe, and I really like your slate idea eddie, so I think I'm gonna make something similar to that. I have this enormous slate rock that I broke and used for some of my other caves. I still have a nice big chunk of it which I could use for a bigger cave. Only thing is I'm worried about how jagged it is.


----------



## crazie.eddie

It's best to cut the slate tiles instead of breaking them. Slate is fragile and can split and breaking it would create sharp edges. 
I've seen someone making slate caves and actually using a Dremmel to round off some edges. It actually made the slate caves more natural. But that's too much work for me. Besides, I would have to buy a Dremmel tool kit anyways and I don't have the funds for it.


----------



## fish_4_all

Don't give up on the PVC pipe caves, I have seen some very nice ones made and and they look awesome. 

Some key things to remember:
I know it will take more time but smaller rocks make a much better appearance. The size of a dime or smaller is the best I have seen. 
If you want to cover a white pvc pipe, use a paint brush and spread the silicone quickly all over and spread sand over the top. This gives a completely covered look for pllacing rocks where you want and not see the pipe. 
Also remember to let the cave cure for at least a week. I know it sounds rediculous but with the amounts you can use it can easily have wet spots after a couple days. 

There is nothing more satisfying than making it yourself and having your fish love it.


----------



## pleco_cory_fan

I will prob put in some pvc pipes for a bristlenose spawing cave put i love the look of the slate caves


----------



## joeshmoe

i like how pvc comes out when u glue rocks fake plants too it


----------



## Jaysn

I've read about heating pvc in the oven until it's pliable, and then rolling it in aquarium gravel to disguise the fact that it's pvc. You can deform it with your hands too, making it look like a hollow root or something. I plan on doing that in my tank soon, as I have a length of pvc in there that one of my voilet gobies and USD catfish like to hang out in.


----------



## dprUsh83

Jaysn said:


> I've read about heating pvc in the oven until it's pliable, and then rolling it in aquarium gravel to disguise the fact that it's pvc. You can deform it with your hands too, making it look like a hollow root or something. I plan on doing that in my tank soon, as I have a length of pvc in there that one of my voilet gobies and USD catfish like to hang out in.


That sounds awesome, be sure to post pictures...I'd love to see how that turns out


----------



## crazie.eddie

Sounds dangerous. Hopefully no dangerous fumes are released.


----------



## Brandon

tell me how it goes cause i'd like to try it


----------



## fish_4_all

Supposedly you can do the same thing with plexi if you use a thinnner piece. I willhave to find the information but the one I saw used some rocks positioned on a cookie sheet and drapped the plexi over them then baked them in the oven. Kinda like vacu forming but letting the plexi "slump" over the rocks to make the cave. The same could be done with fiberglass, epoxy, and probably many other materials.


----------



## blueblue48

where can you buy aquarium silicone??


----------



## Lupin

blueblue48 said:


> where can you buy aquarium silicone??


There are hardware stores that have them in stock. Make sure you use the proper aquarium silicon. Some silicon are designed for glasses but not for aquarium and can be toxic when used for aquaria.


----------



## crazie.eddie

Make sure it's silocone with no mildew/mold prevention type chemicals included.


----------



## Amphitrite

A few online fish stores sell it, I got mine from eBay for a decent price.


----------



## davethetester

Nearly all non aquarium silicone will have fungicide in it !!!!!!

May I suggest considering black silicone for making caves etc, if you can see a bit it tends to be less noticable.

The process for heating plastic and letting it sag over a shape to produce differing mouldings is called "drape forming" You should be able to achieve this quite easily at home. Most manufacturers sheet acrylic (regardless of trade name) becomes workable around 140/150 deg C. To avoid any chance of accidents set your oven to no more than 150 deg C in the first place and work up if it's not hot enough. In order to get a nice "form" it's important that you heat whatever you are using to drape over to the same temp as the oven prior to placing the plastic on it. This helps keep the temp even throughout the forming process. It is really important if you want a regular shape as differing temps through the material cause warping.


----------



## magic_marty

I build r/c model planes and have used 2 liter bottles to make engine cowling as well as canapy covers, what i did was first make a mold out of hardwood to the desired shape i needed then take a 2 liter bottle or similar bottle and place it around the mold.Then take a high temp heat gun and simply heat the plastic witch causes it to shrink around the mold.I believe you could find a nice looking stone of some sort and perform the same thing with good results.You could lightly coat it with silicone then roll it in some sand to give it a thicker look then add gravel to it.


----------



## beaverwell

*paint you can use*

you can use water based acrylic,none toxic.Use a none toxic undercoat for acrylics.Leave to dry for at least 24 hours. You can also use none toxic Fed Foam to make your own caves,of any style or shape.Just remember that it must be sprayed onto something heavy to weigh it down for it is very buoyant . For instance a blue brick which you can bury in the substrate.Paint it with the above :lol:


----------

