# i want to add live plants to my already established tank.



## Rip

is it as easy as just sticking the plants in there?

i have a cycled 55 gallon tank that's been running for 3 months, it finished it's cycle about 1 month ago, and i've had no issues with fish deaths. i'm up to 23 fish in it now. ammonia and nitrite are at zero. i'm also currently cycling a planted 10 gallon tank, and noticing that the plants are doing well, especially the anacharis which grows like crazy. it grows to the top, then i cut it off, and replant it, and it grows even more, and branches out. but anywayz, the success with the plants here, make me want to introduce them to my 55 gallon tank as well. so here's a few questions.

does adding plants to a cycled, non-planted tank, throw off the ammonia or nitrite levels temporarily, which could cause fish to die?

i currently only have about 45 pounds of gravel in this 55 gallon. is that enough? i think i should add another 25 pound bag or so. is it advisable to add fresh gravel to a cycled tank, granted i rinse it thoroughly?

i've also been looking at live plants that come in tubes, some amazon swords for example. they claim they are snail free. i was wondering if anyone else has bought these, and had success with them.

it seems like i had some other things to ask, but i'm spacing them out. i'll use another post later, when i think of them. thank you.


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## DarkMaster Y0da

does adding plants to a cycled, non-planted tank, throw off the ammonia or nitrite levels temporarily, which could cause fish to die?

*No it will not affect any of your levels*

i currently only have about 45 pounds of gravel in this 55 gallon. is that enough? i think i should add another 25 pound bag or so. is it advisable to add fresh gravel to a cycled tank, granted i rinse it thoroughly?

*You should have 1lb of gravel per gallon of water, so yes you would need to add more and adding new gravel to a tank that is cycled will not affect anything the old gravel will seed the new creating a bigger area for bacteria to grow*

i've also been looking at live plants that come in tubes, some amazon swords for example. they claim they are snail free. i was wondering if anyone else has bought these, and had success with them.

*I have never bought them in the tubes but have had very good luck with swords in previous tanks, i would be leary about buying them due to you don't know how long they have been out of the water. could have shock and drop leaves if you add them to water.*


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## El Nandez

*Need advice on aquarium plants*

V v


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## sik80

I'd read Byron 4 part stickies in the Aquarium Plants section of the forum. Everything you need to know is there including lighting, substrate, filtration, fertilizer etc :-D


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## Grimmjow

As far as I know theres no downside to plants, only benefits.

Ive bought a lot of plants in the tubes, the only ones Ive ever had problems with were the already dying ones but even those are doing fine now, most of the plants in my 75 gallon I recently set up are from the tubes. Just make sure you dont get any semi-aquatic ones.


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## DKRST

Regarding the snails... I was very "anti-snail" when I initially set up my tank. After seeing the snails go to work on some Amazon Sword leaves that were getting "hairy" with algae, I've learned to appreciate the little scavengers. If my population eventually gets too high, I'll trap them out with the zucchini slice method that's been recommended on the forum. 

IF you want a planted tank without snails and purchase plants from tanks one option is to quarantine the plants in another tank and treat with maracide (malachite green) to kill any invertebrates. I'm not certain how long you'd need to wait for any potential snail egg masses to hatch out and re-treat. I don't know how susceptible the eggs are. Apparently, the new maracide formulation won't harm plants (or so they say, I have not verified this!)


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## Byron

I concur with advice already given by previous members, but will add a couple things.

First just a comment on the snail issue, I love seeing these busy little beavers in my tanks. Provided they are the correct sort, they will work there way throughout the substrate (Malaysian Livebearer snails) better than anything else, they will get into places nothing else can reach to eat detritus (again MLS, plus pond snails, bladder snails), they do eat algae though this has its limits but they help. Those mentioned do not eat plants, but will consume dead or dying leaves, another benefit.

Now to the plants. Light is the single most important issue. Fish don't need any light, they would be quite happy without a light over them, since most of them come from dimly-lit forest streams and ponds. But plants do need light to photosynthesize (grow) and it must be adequate in terms of spectrum and intensity and duration. If you tell us what light you now have (please be specific, with type, name, watts, kelvin,...whatever you know about it) we can go from there.

Plants also need nutrients, all of which are unlikely to be available in the aquarium, so a good liquid fertilizer is in my view essential. _ Flourish Comprehensive Supplement for the Planted Aquarium_ is the best I've found for a low-tech setup.

Byron.


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## Rip

i currently have two lights in this tank, both 15 watts, one over the right side, and one on the left side. they are both 6500k. i bought them from Lowe's. it seems like 15 watts is the highest wattage i could find for 18 inch T8 tubes. it would be nice if these would work, so i wouldn't have to buy a different hood that would accomodate a larger tube. and i also have the Seachem liquid fertilizer that you recommended to me a few weeks ago.


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## Byron

Rip said:


> i currently have two lights in this tank, both 15 watts, one over the right side, and one on the left side. they are both 6500k. i bought them from Lowe's. it seems like 15 watts is the highest wattage i could find for 18 inch T8 tubes. it would be nice if these would work, so i wouldn't have to buy a different hood that would accomodate a larger tube. and i also have the Seachem liquid fertilizer that you recommended to me a few weeks ago.


I think you can get some decent plant growth with the lights you have. It will be close, to be honest, but not un-workable. Spectrum is good.

Sword plants should manage. Pygmy chain sword for a "substrate cover." and/or some of the crypts. I would stay away from stem plants as they are fast growing plants and that means higher light and nutrients. One exception is Brazilian Pennywort, which also has the bonus of being a very lovely floating plant, ideal in fact. Fast growing but easy to trim to keep it from covering the surface.

I have never come across a fish that doesn't appreciate floating plants, it obviously adds a sense of security.

There are some of the above in our profiles, and some other plants, any that require low or moderate light will probably be worth trying.


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## ghostgirl

I know what you are talking about with the "tube plants" you get at like petco. I have had nothing but problems with them. All of my other plants have been wonderful. Those just kept dying and causing my ammonia to rise. I hate them and do not recommend them at all.


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## Rip

last night i added one stem of anacharis from my 10 gallon to the 55 gallon. in less than 24 hours, the PH rose from 7.0 to 7.3. i checked the PH in the planted 10 gallon, and it was at 8.0.


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## Byron

Rip said:


> last night i added one stem of anacharis from my 10 gallon to the 55 gallon. in less than 24 hours, the PH rose from 7.0 to 7.3. i checked the PH in the planted 10 gallon, and it was at 8.0.


I can say with certainty that this rise in pH has nothing to do with plants. There is the normal diurnal pH cycle in heavily-planted tanks, but that is in a well-planted tank; in my 115g and 90g tanks the pH only shifts .3 during this cycle. So to find the reason, some questions:

What is the pH out of the tap [you should let tap water sit overnight before testing, as CO2 in the water will give a lower (false) reading]?
What has the pH been in your tanks, normally, from week to week after the water change [always test before a water change to see what it has done during the week]?
What type of gravel?
Any rocks?

Byron.


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## Rip

on 01-28, i tested the tap water, although i didn't let it sit overnight. but the PH was 7.4.

i've only had a liquid test kit for less than a month. i tested the PH in the 55 gallon tank a total of 3 times, and it was alwayz 7.0, just now rising to 7.3. i guess i can't claim that last night it was at 7.0, since i didn't test it last night, the last time i had tested it was 01-23, and it showed 7.0. 

i had a bunch of rocks in one section of the tank, even building a little cave area. on 02-01, i took it apart for a few reasons. first, fish would hide out in there, and i couldn't see them. second, i felt it needed a good vaccuum, which it did, really bad. and last, i felt i needed to get rid of alot of those rocks, so i had room for plants. the rocks were stacked on top of each other, and took up approximately 25% of the tank, the back left section. i took them all down to clean, and only replaced a few of the bigger ones. i still have more than 20 rocks on the other side of the tank, varying in size, mainly just for show. they don't create alot of hiding places like they did on the other side, before i removed them. if you want, you can see how it was set up before, by looking at my aquariums.

oh, and the gravel was petco brand, black gravel, which i bought two 25 lb bags of.


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## iamgray

I would like to add to Byron's point about fish preferring dimly lit areas. :-D

I can definitely vouch for fishes' preference for subdued lighting. My light is centred over the tank, and I've piled rocks to form caves in the back corners; those dark corners are definitely a favourite hangout spot for some of my fish - especially my honey gouramis and loaches, but my angels can also often be spotted lurking in those shadows.


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## Rip

after letting tap water sit out over night, the PH was at 8.0


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## Rip

i ended up buying 3 of the plants in tubes. Petco had them on sale, buy 2 get 1 free. i also bought another 25 lb bag of gravel, and added about half of it, so now i have about 60 lbs in the 55 gallon tank. for the plants, i got 2 Amazon Swords, and 1 Gold Ribbon. i planted both Amazon swords in the clumps they came in, but the Gold Ribbon was in 3 seperate clumps, so i planted those seperate, but in a nice row together. i'll see if i can get them to grow with my low lighting, otherwise i might upgrade. i'll post pic of the new layout in a lil while...


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## Rip

i googled Gold Ribbon, and it sounds like it's not even an aquatic plant. and it will rot if submerged. is that correct?


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## Byron

Rip said:


> i googled Gold Ribbon, and it sounds like it's not even an aquatic plant. and it will rot if submerged. is that correct?


If you found a photo of the plant you have under that common name, was there a scientific name? That will allow me to answer you, but without it I'd be guessing.


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## Byron

On the issue of the pH. If you tapwater is pH 8, that is likely what the tank will be. However, some things will impact this. One major thing is the hardness of the tap water. Can you find out from the water supply people what the hardness is? Get both GH and KH if you can, but any "hardness" numbers will suffice, and make sure to include the measure, it may be mg/liter, ppm (parts per million), or dGH (degrees General Hardness) etc.

Aquaria naturally acidify due to biological processes. This lowers pH and removes some minerals to slightly soften the water. The rate this occurs depends largely on the hardness of the source water (tap), hence my request for this info.

Other substances like tannins from real bogwood, leaves, peat can help soften and acidify the water. Here again their effect will depend upon the initial hardness which acts as a buffer on pH.

Rock and stone/gravel that is calcareous [limestone, marble, lavarock, coral] will slowly dissolve mineral into the water, raising the hardness (and corresponding the pH). That's why I asked about rocks. Any idea what type they are?

Stability is important in hardness and pH. I previously mentioned the diurnal pH fluctuation in planted tanks, but that is very minimal and of no harm to the fish. It occurs in nature just as it does in the aquarium. But a pH shift of say 7 to 8 in less than a day is likely to cause stress, particularly if it continues back and forth in relatively short periods of time.

We can continue this when we know the hardness numbers.


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