# Damsel not eating, lethargic



## cocolodecorazon

I have a 60 gal tank, live hawaiian black sand, artificial coral, 2 power heads, bubble wand and temp stays at 78*. Cycling for about 5 weeks now. SG = 1.025, Ph = 8.2, everything else is 0. Have a yellow tail damsel, 2 three stripes damsels, 1 sand sifting starfish, 1 spotted blenny and 6 hermit crabs. Have 2 clown fish and 1 purple something or other in QT that were supposed to go into my dsplay tank this weekend. Tonight I noticed that one of my damsels was lethargic laying about the bottom of the tank and looked like gasping for air. Managed to isolate it and put it in a small bowl just in case that it is contagious. What can be happening with it and what to do right away to fix the problem?


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## Reefing Madness

Sounds as if your fish is dying on you. Hard to say why. But if you have more than one Damsel, Im betting he got whooped, most don't have a clue about these fish, but they are some meanies. You cycled the tank with the Damsels?
Filtration? How are you keeping your numbers at 0? No live rock? No skimmer? 
Bubble Wand is not needed, and will give you a mean case of Salt Creep where ever those bubbles are popping at the surface.
Need a Calcium and ALK reading if you got it handy. But im betting he got a butt whoopin.


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## cocolodecorazon

Reefing Madness said:


> Sounds as if your fish is dying on you. Hard to say why. But if you have more than one Damsel, Im betting he got whooped, most don't have a clue about these fish, but they are some meanies. You cycled the tank with the Damsels?
> Filtration? How are you keeping your numbers at 0? No live rock? No skimmer?
> Bubble Wand is not needed, and will give you a mean case of Salt Creep where ever those bubbles are popping at the surface.
> Need a Calcium and ALK reading if you got it handy. But im betting he got a butt whoopin.


Unfortunately it did die last night. You just cleared the mistery of the excess salt on my filter. I did a fishless cycle for about three weeks then added three damsels. I did use live sand, but no live rock. Right now I am using an Aqueon HOB filter rated for 75 gal, but have no skimmer. I am using canopy lights T8/15W x 2 and 1 LED lights bar. I know that equiment is not optimal, however my numbers have been good for a couple of weeks. Just now I am starting to get some brown algae, but nothing overwhelming. I am looking at buying a better filtering and lighting system within the next couple of weeks. The reason why I am a littel upset is because I bought a couple of clown fish last week and have them set up in a QT and now I am concern that I may not be able to transfer them to the display tank if I have to restart the cycle or if I have some kind of disease in it.


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## RSully

Reefing will add in some more today but I don't think you'll get away with a 60 gallon and no skiimmer, especially without live rock. Under 30, you can get away with it.


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## Reefing Madness

Right Sully, 60g gotta have a Skimmer on it. And get rid of that Filter, but first, your going to have to add 60-100lbs of Live Rock (Macro Rock) before you do this. It will have to Cure, so it will need to be in the tank for 6 weeks before adding those other fish. The filter can then be removed. You need these things to run an optimum SW tank.


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## cocolodecorazon

Ok. So went and got a eshopps 75h skimmer, got me some cured, live rock and some more led lights. I started with 20 lbs of live rock. The plan is to add about 80-90 lbs, but the LFS said to add it slowly since the artificial reef already has some bacteria on it. He said maybe next week I could add another 40-60 for a total of 80 lbs. The skimmer is getting on my nerves because it is overflowing the cup with bubbles and water to the point that it is spilling onto the floor. I keep trying to adjust it, but it doesn't do jack. Is there a trick to this joker?


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## Reefing Madness

If you got CURED LIVE ROCK put it all in at once, it won't hurt anything, its already got the bacteria growing in it. Trick to the Skimmer, brand new, is to wash it out using vinegar, this will remove the resin on the acrylic, and act better when you hook it up. The bubbles should some to the lower portion of the neck and no more.


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## cocolodecorazon

Reefing Madness said:


> If you got CURED LIVE ROCK put it all in at once, it won't hurt anything, its already got the bacteria growing in it. Trick to the Skimmer, brand new, is to wash it out using vinegar, this will remove the resin on the acrylic, and act better when you hook it up. The bubbles should some to the lower portion of the neck and no more.


 
Ok so today I added another 50 lbs of cured live rock for a total of 70 lbs. I returned the light that I had bought yesterday because I didn't like the looks of it on the tank. Anywho, I got a corallight high output something or other which puts out 300w. Its got three different kinds of lights on it. Daylight, dusk-dawn light and moonlight. LFS said it was good for reef tanks which is good because now I am thinking on setting some coral in there to give the tank some color. The protein skimmer seems to be working although there are a lot of bubbles coming up. LFS said the dirtier the water is, the more bubbles I would get. So, I am hoping that once the water starts getting cleaner the bubbles will settle down somewhat. I can already see a little bit of scum sticking to the collection cup also. Something that struck me as odd when I bought the cured live rock today was that they had it sitting in a box, wrapped in some type of foam paper. Would that be cured live or just live. Also, some of this rocks have some type of white, long stuff on it, looks almost lie a worm. Would you know what that is? Thanks for all your help and the prompt responses.


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## cocolodecorazon

Since I have that live rock in there and the protein skimmer, do I need the HOB filter? How long should I wait before I can add some new fish to it?


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## Reefing Madness

No filter, throw that thing away.
Adding fish would all depend on your Tank cycling time. And being as you infact did not get Cured Live Rock, you will have to re-cure it, and your looking at roughly 4-6 weeks. The white tubes are probably from old worm canals.


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## RSully

I got to agree with RM here. You may get lucky with some live organisms still on the rocks but not what is fully needed. It all depends on how long that rock was out of the water. Was it at least still moist or had it pretty much dried up?

Watch those rocks and see if you get anything coming out of them. Look for little feather dusters.


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## cocolodecorazon

*The first 20 lbs were taken out of a running tank. He said it had been there for at least 2 months. So I am guessing it is pretty safe that it was in fact cured. The 50 lbs I got yesterday were in a cardboard box and wrapped in some type of styrofoam paper, but it was still somewhat moist. Either way I am guessing I will have to start my cycle/curing process all over again. Hopefully the three fish I have in there wont hate me for it. Today when I did my testing I noticed that for the first time in a while I actually noticed a change in the amonia level and ph level. Ph = 8.4 and Amonia = .25 - .50. Nitrite and Nitrate were at 0. I can tell you that the three little fish love the rock and seem to be more outgoing. the protein skimmer seem to have settled and the foam is not as bad as it was yesterday and the day before. It was pretty nasty in that cup when I emptied it this morning. Slowly but steadily I think my tank is coming together. Once again, thanks for all your assistance and quick responses. Will keep you posted.*


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## cocolodecorazon

*Just Wondering*

It's been about three weeks since I added the rock to my tank and I must say that aestethically it looks 100 times better than it did without it. My cycle is still going and I have noticed some spikes on the numbers although they are starting to stabilize now. My amonia has been 0 for a few days, nitrites peaked at about 5 and it has gone down to 1 where it has been for the last 4 or 5 days. Nitrates climed and went back down and it is now at 10 where is has been for the last 4 days. I added a canister filter to my tank which helps whith the water flow. Should I be concerned that the nitrites are not going any lower than 1 and the nitrates not going any lower than 10. I still haven't added my clown fish which are still in the QT and I am doing water changes in it every other day. Haven't done any water changes in my display tank since it is still cycling. Should I be doing water changes in my display tank? Thanks for all your input.


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## RSully

I don't think water changes will speed anything up. Maybe weekly water changes at most until you're cycled.


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## Reefing Madness

You'll want to let the water cook some. Meaning, let the bacteria grow some, before changing out the water.


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## cocolodecorazon

*Parameters*

So for the last four days the numbers have been where I think they should be. Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate all read at 0. Specific Gravity is at 1.025, PH is at 8.2 and temp at 76. I am thinking the cycling has taken its course. Probably will add my clownfish next week. I was looking at the rock in the my tank and noticed that there are spots of bright green stuff growing on it and I am not sure what it is. Don't know that coralite algae looks like this. I have enclosed some pictures to see if anyone can tell me what it is.


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## cocolodecorazon

Also there are those white, worm like things on the rock that I don't know what it is. The rock came with it and I haven't seen it do anything, but it intrigues me to know what it is and what they do.


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## wake49

Is it slimy? I have seen green coraline, but I don't remember it being that neon. Or is that an effect of the camera?


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## RSully

If it's hard, it's corraline Soft or slimy, you got something else going on. Oh, and white tubes are some type of worm/feather duster, nothing to worry about there.


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## cocolodecorazon

*So far so good*

I have been checking the parameteres in my display tank and so far they have been maintaining well. SG = 1.025, ammonia, nitrite = 0, nitrate = 10 and phospate = .25 (I am doing water changes to rectify nitrate and phospate), temp = 78 *. As a mistake I had added some fish already to the tank before it had cycled through (2 damsels, 1 sand sifting starfish and 1 purple dottyback [please don't hate me for that]). Been that the water had maintained for a few days, two weeks ago I added my two clowns (Ocsillaris) which I had in quarantine for about 4 weeks. I then added 1 cleaner shrimp to the tank and they all seem to be living it up so far. I also added 6 snails to help with the cleaning. I hadn't add anything else until yesterday, when I came in possession of 1 pulsating xenia and 1 green bubble tip anemone which were gonna be taken back to the store by an old friend. I took them instead. Placed the xenia in a small rock in the corner of the tank as I don't want it to spread too much and the anemone I just dropped on the rock. They both took to the tank prety quick. The anemone spread its tentacles all day, but when I woke up this morning I couldn't find it. I finally found it attached to the underside of the rock. It is not spread. Now, I know they move around to find the best spot for them, but as of right now it is unreachable. Is this a normal practice and if so how do I feed it way under there? Shoud I try to move it out of the spot where it is now? I would have to disturb the rock and everything in it. Will it come out when it needs to feed?


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## Reefing Madness

Yup, pretty normal for those things to go running around the tank, and hiding. If and when he's ready he will come out, but I gotta say, your Phosphates are a bit high for him. And i'd have to go back and check on your lighting, but they need strong lighting. But, you can't go chasing him down everytime he goes under a rock, that alone will kill him.


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## cocolodecorazon

*Live rock growing hair*

I have been going through a learning process while setting, cycling and stocking my 60 gal tank. Yesterday I added a few Mexican Turbo Snails and a Sailfin Blenny and they made quick work of getting rid of the green algae that was plaguing my rock. Today, however I noticed that one of the rocks is growing hair. As dumb as that may sound it is the only thing I can compare what's growing on the rock to. I am enclosing a photo to see if anyone can identify what this is and tell me if is good or bad. Thanks.


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## wake49

I can't really tell by the pics, canyou describe the hair?


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## cocolodecorazon

First of, I wanna thank everyone who have given me any advise or answered any of my questions as I am a newbie at this and any help is appreciated. My tank is doing very well so far. I have not added any livestock lately as I have now grasp the concept of maturing my tank. Here's what I have so far and will keep it like this for a bit longer. 60 gal tank with 100 lbs of black Hawaiian sand and Caribsea aragonite sand and 70 lbs of aquacultured live rock. I have a coralife HO light with 2 fluorescent and 2 blue lights for a total of 200 watts. I have an Eshopps psk 75h hob skimmer, 2 aqueon circulation pumps model 700 and a fluval 306 canister filter and the proper size heater. The reason I have the canister filter and the hob skimmer is because I am pressed for space and I can't fit a refugium anywhere next to or below the tank. Here are my parameters at last testing yesterday: SG = 1.025, Temp = 78*, Ph = 8.3, Ammonia and Nitrites = 0 ppm, Nitrate = 10 ppm and Phosphate = .25 ppm, Calcium = 460 ppm and Alkalinity = 232 ppm. At first I used tap water to set up my tank, but then I quickly learned how it will give you a lot of problems with algae. I now use RO/DI water and mix it with RedSea Coral Pro salt. I have been doing water changes once per week of 8 - 10 gal, but can't get rid of those nitrates and phosphate. In an effort to rid my tank of them I added RedSea's NO3;PO4X (Nitrate, Phosphate reducer) and run that for a little bit, but now my skimmer is acting like is brand new. I am taking about 1 cupful of water from my skimmer every 2-3 hours. I am guessing since I added the no3,po4 reducer the water composition has changed and the skimmer is just running through a new cycle. Is this something that I should be concerned with? As far as my livestock, this is what I have in the tank as of right now: 2 clown oscillaris, 1 blue hippo, 1 purple dottiback, 1 three stripes damsel, 1 yellow tail damsel, 1 sail fin blenny, 1 green, bubble tip anemone and 1 pulsating xenia. As for cleaning crew I have: 10 Mexican Turbo Snails, 5 hermit crabs and 1 cleaning/skunk shrimp. They all seem to be doing well. Even the anemone, who after moving in and out of sight have finally found a spot right in the front of the tank where is in full view. Again I wanna thank everyone for all your help, especially ReefingMadness for all your input and advise.


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