# want to start a saltwater tank!!



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

i want to turn one of my 10gallons into a saltwater tank. i know it isnt that easy for such a small tank.i dont have room for anything bigger as ill be transferring fish over to my other 10 gallon.since i only have 2 fish in the tank and 3 in the other.

its going to be a simple setup. i will put 2 clowns in it.i have some sand i got from home depot i currently use in my 20g hex tank.so i got plenty of sand i can use for my salt tank if its good enough sand for it.i think 30 grit....

i have a small dried coral i want to place in it after cleaning it.

i will buy 1 or 2 big fake corals to put in as well..the tank has my stock filter to which i took out the carbon filter a long time ago and place a fluval sponge filter i cut up in the back.

i want to know whats the best way about setting it up?

could i use the media already in it to seed the tank as well as the filter int it?
is the sand i have good enough?
is AQ salt the same as marine salt or i actually have to buy the Instant Ocean salt or 1 of another brand?

not trying to go cheap.just want something simple to start out on as i seen on a few videos.something i can try as well as my dad and see how things go until we get a new place.


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

FW bacteria will not seed a SW tank. Sw will kill the bacteria growing on the FW media. Can't be used, your tank will have to cycle. I would recommend 10-15llbs of Base Rock, Macro Rock or Live Rock, as this is whats used for filtration in a SW tank. You can use your filter alone, but its alittle tougher to keep up with good quality water numbers. I'd check the sand and its ingredients, if it has any silicates in it, this will cause you problems with algae and cyano bacteria. I wouldn't use it. You might want to rethink it, and go Crushed Coral or Live Sand, or an Aragonite of some sort.


----------



## bshou77 (Dec 2, 2012)

hi not tring to over simplify start up of SW but ive always put live rock, then live sand, and any HOB media filter i had handy, let run till water cleared bout a day or 2, then hook up my lighting ang adjust my water from there and hi this is my first reply hope it helped


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> FW bacteria will not seed a SW tank. Sw will kill the bacteria growing on the FW media. Can't be used, your tank will have to cycle. I would recommend 10-15llbs of Base Rock, Macro Rock or Live Rock, as this is whats used for filtration in a SW tank. You can use your filter alone, but its alittle tougher to keep up with good quality water numbers. I'd check the sand and its ingredients, if it has any silicates in it, this will cause you problems with algae and cyano bacteria. I wouldn't use it. You might want to rethink it, and go Crushed Coral or Live Sand, or an Aragonite of some sort.


i didnt think FW bacteria work in SW tanks.i was at a LFS and asked a guy about starting a SW tank.and mentioned about using my BB from my FW tanks.he was hesitant answering.so its a big reason y i asked here.everything else hw knew rite away.i can tell he was pretty confident and knew exactly what he was talking about..

i had talked to my dad about setting my tank up.im actually debating rather or not to go ahead and spend the money to buy a new 10 gallon as my fish are all happy in their tanks.and since i took out the tube tv and replaced it with a small hdtv that i know i wont use.i have space for another tank.but its on debate.

i may go ahead and just buy new stuff for a SW tank as u have suggested.especially the live sand and everything.since the tank is small.i wont be spending every penny i have.i need to see if my LFS sells live rock for sure or not.i believe they do.considering its a small tank with only 2 clowns.i know i dont need much.

thank you for the advice.anymore u can give please do.i want to make sure its done correctly.and everything survives.im not rushing it...


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

bshou77 said:


> hi not tring to over simplify start up of SW but ive always put live rock, then live sand, and any HOB media filter i had handy, let run till water cleared bout a day or 2, then hook up my lighting ang adjust my water from there and hi this is my first reply hope it helped


actually yes it has helped..i had watched a video later on on youtube and fount that everything in a SW has a purpose.if i go without like live rocks etc.then i can throw of the balance and really have problems.i want to do it rite the first time.and every little bit of advice and tips is greatly appreciated and does help as i know nothing about SW other than they r salty and the fish are more colorful and its harder to startup at first


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Oh forgot, you'll have to use a Marine Salt. AQ Salt won't due.
Here is a list of things that will help you along. Now only going with a 10g tank, you won't need them all:

#1-Dry Rock, there are a few hitchhikers on Live Rock that people want to stay away from, so they opt for using Dry Rock, or Dead Rock. Macro Rock is a good place to start looking for that. Either way you go you will need a minimum of 1lb per gallon.

#2-Replacement filter media like filter floss and activated carbon (if you get a filter) Which is really not necessary.

#3-Multiple Power heads (2 or 3) 10x your water volume for just a Fish Only With Live Rock, and at least 20x your water volume for a Reef Tank. So lets say your going reef, and you have a 100g tank, you would need flow in that tank at minimum of 2000gph, or 2 1000gph power heads.

#4-Protein Skimmer, rated at 2 times your water volume. Unless your tank is under 30g, in which case you can do 10% water changes a week to rid the system of detrius. But, you'll have to watch the water parameters close, if things go haywire, you'll have to do more water changes.

#5-Saltwater Test Kits. Reef Test Kit. Test for Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates, PH, Phosphates, Calcium, ALK and Magnesium.

#6-Saltwater fish food. Mysis Shrimp, Squid, Cyclopease, Algae Sheets, Romaine . Flake food is not really a good food to feed your marine fish.

#7-Aquarium vacuum. This one is iffy. Most don't use one, if you have enough flow in the tank you won’t need one

#8-Rubber kitchen gloves

#9-Fish net

#10-Two, clean, never used before, 5-gallon buckets

#11-Aquarium thermometer, digital being the best.

#12-Brush with plastic bristles (old tooth brush) - needed for cleaning the live rock if you don't get Fully Cured Live Rock.

#13-Power Strip, possibly GFCI outlets by the tank.

#14-Optional but definitely recommend getting a Reverse Osmosis or RO/Deionization filter for the make-up water, and a barrel for storing the water.

#15-Possibly a Quarantine Tank for your new fish. They sit in here for a few weeks to kill off parasites and bacteria, to keep it from getting in your main tank

#16-Heater rated for your size tank.

#17-Saltwater Mix. Marine Salt. Instant Ocean is the cheap Salt that beginners and Advanced use alike.

#18-Saltwater Hydrometer or even better a Refractometer, which is more accurate. There is also a Digital Meter that is way advanced if you have the cash.

#19-Aquarium filter (not absolutely necessary if running with adequate amounts of live rock, but nice to have if you need to use a mechanical filter or activated carbon, or GFO and such)

#20-Aquarium substrate such as live sand or crushed coral. Some go bare Bottom, others choose the 2-3" bottom, others, more advanced will try the Deep Sand Bed, which is over 6" deep.

http://znnea.rmuvx.servertrust.com/default.asp

http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Nitrogen_Cycle.html

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=aquarium+heater&_sacat=20754&_odkw=power+heads&_osacat=0

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=power+heads&_sacat=0&_odkw=salt+water+refractometer&_osacat=0

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-0-10-Sa...905?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a792587d1

http://www.marcorocks.com/

http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/bulk-dry-live-rock.html

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/aquarium-fish-supplies.cfm?c=393

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/fish-supplies/aquarium-substrate/ps/c/3578/9805

http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Aquarium_Lighting.html

http://live-plants.com/

http://successfulreefkeeping.com/learn/what-your-coral-needs/

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=t-5+lighting&_sacat=0

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=cree+led+aquarium&_sacat=0&_odkw=t-5+lighting&_osacat=0

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/fish-supplies/saltwater-aquarium-salt-water-mix/ps/c/3578/4685


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

i actually forgot to mention that again as i didnt see an answer earlier.but looks like u got that covered for me and ansered it  again thank you..any tips.ideas etc plz throw them at me..


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Sounds like you've done your homework. 10g is not really that hard to keep, unless your going with a Reef. Just need to watch your water parameters is all thats needed, weekly water changes, and your pretty much safe. 10g tank your using a Mechanical Filter just like a FW tank, only diff in the 2 at this point is, one uses Salt the other does not. The correct amount of Live Rock is the key. No special lighting is required for a Fish Only Tank. 
Just for a heads up, if your LFS guy was hesitant about telling you it was not ok about using FW bio media in a SW tank, I'd say he doesn't know what he's talking about, and just guessing. Thats not a good thing.


----------



## beaslbob (Oct 17, 2012)

IMHO if you start the tank with macro algae like chaetomorphia then do the rest it will be much more easier to maintain. Best to protect the macro in a refugium but that can just be a tank partition to keep the fish and crabs away from the macros.

I wait a week then add a single common male molly. Then wait another week before starting feeding 1 flake per day.

IMHO when you get the molly to live for a couple of weeks you are well on your way to the expensive marine only fish.


my .02


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

beaslbob said:


> IMHO if you start the tank with macro algae like chaetomorphia then do the rest it will be much more easier to maintain. Best to protect the macro in a refugium but that can just be a tank partition to keep the fish and crabs away from the macros.
> 
> I wait a week then add a single common male molly. Then wait another week before starting feeding 1 flake per day.
> 
> ...


Here we go again. So, you still advising people to partition off a 10g tank, thats already to small for most Marine Fish!!! NO! And I do not advocate using a Live Fish to cycle a Tank, even though Mollies are quite hardy. IMO, you need to update your advice Bob.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> Sounds like you've done your homework. 10g is not really that hard to keep, unless your going with a Reef. Just need to watch your water parameters is all thats needed, weekly water changes, and your pretty much safe. 10g tank your using a Mechanical Filter just like a FW tank, only diff in the 2 at this point is, one uses Salt the other does not. The correct amount of Live Rock is the key. No special lighting is required for a Fish Only Tank.
> Just for a heads up, if your LFS guy was hesitant about telling you it was not ok about using FW bio media in a SW tank, I'd say he doesn't know what he's talking about, and just guessing. Thats not a good thing.


ive been looking up on it a while.its not something i wanna rush into.ive made mistakes and dont want to go through them again.it being SW, i want to learn more before starting to be more prepared  and yes u are rite...when he was hesitant..i kinda knew it wouldnt work..then he suggested about the bottles of BB...im not sure i wana use that.of course ill have 2 clowns in there so it wont be so bad


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

every1 thank you for the replies and tips/advice...i really appreciate it.i want to do it rite the first time..any help is greatly appreciated


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

prodrumernate said:


> ive been looking up on it a while.its not something i wanna rush into.ive made mistakes and dont want to go through them again.it being SW, i want to learn more before starting to be more prepared  and yes u are rite...when he was hesitant..i kinda knew it wouldnt work..then he suggested about the bottles of BB...im not sure i wana use that.of course ill have 2 clowns in there so it wont be so bad


Who was it that you went to and got this Advice from here in Phoenix?


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> Who was it that you went to and got this Advice from here in Phoenix?


wahhh ur in phoenix also? i got it from "the ocean floor" out on 20th ave and thomas...some huy i had asked in the store.1 of the associates


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Those guys don't know anything!! I wouldn't send my worst enemy to that dump. Just guys are off the street, and they believe it or not work off commision. See Don at Tropical Treasures, he's a good guy, never stear you wrong, won't tell you need something you don't, very knowledgeable.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> Those guys don't know anything!! I wouldn't send my worst enemy to that dump. Just guys are off the street, and they believe it or not work off commision. See Don at Tropical Treasures, he's a good guy, never stear you wrong, won't tell you need something you don't, very knowledgeable.


it think tropical treasures is far from me.i looked up places around me several times before..im just north of sky harbor.ocean floor is on my way back from work.i work out at 75th ave and buckeye.i stop taking I10 and 202 due to tranny problems in my car.so i hit mcdowell all the way down until 32nd st then go to thomas rite next to where i live...isnt tropical treasure in north phoenix?like around bell road or further north?


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Yea, its up on Glendale and 35th ave, he recently moved. Shame Ocean Floor is yiur only choice. That place sucks. Crap. Sorry man.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

i will be out in that area tomorow.actually past that..work christmas party tomorow afternoon..out in surprise..litchfield and waddel..i guess a weekend wouldnt be bad though to check out tropical treasures..especially since im looking into buying a few new things to start a SW tank..still trying to decide if i wana get a 10 gallon or 20 gallon to do it.20 gallon not much room for that if any..i can make room for a 10 gallon no problem..my dad and i are very interested in starting a SW tank..

how do the prices at tropical treasures compare to that of petsmart and petco?


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

well, if a 10 is all you can do right now, id wait. 10g is really tough to do, not much you can put in there.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

im not wanting to put a lot.since it will be my first SW tank.i want something small to start out with.i know it can be difficult.but its about all the room i have for.i might be able to squeeze a 20 gallon in here.but id have to move my tv.and put the tank on top of my entertainment center.


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

I hear ya.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

what would be the difficulty on starting a SW tank with a 10 gallon?thats something i need to know before i do attempt it


----------



## RSully (Nov 22, 2012)

Pro,

Not neccesarily difficult but it limits you very much on what you can keep. Smaller size equals less fish or possibly only one fish depending on what you want. I started with a 20 and set-up a 10 as a QT tank for future additons. It turns out with my initial fish being a yellow tail damsel that my qt is pretty useless since there's really nothing fish wise I can put in my 20g with a damsel in there without risking some serious turf wars and possibly death of fish. So I've relegated myself to working with soft corals for now until my wife has said I pas the test and can get into something say in the 75g corner tank size.

A 10g isn't that tough but just restricting. ALso remember that at that size, when things start to go wrong, they go wrong very fast because of the size. In a larger tank you may catch small spikes in your water parameters earlier and be able to fix them easier than in the smaller tank size. I'm a newbie so I hope I havent confused you.


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

Not tough, its just that your not going to get much in there.


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

RSully said:


> Pro,
> 
> Not neccesarily difficult but it limits you very much on what you can keep. Smaller size equals less fish or possibly only one fish depending on what you want. I started with a 20 and set-up a 10 as a QT tank for future additons. It turns out with my initial fish being a yellow tail damsel that my qt is pretty useless since there's really nothing fish wise I can put in my 20g with a damsel in there without risking some serious turf wars and possibly death of fish. So I've relegated myself to working with soft corals for now until my wife has said I pas the test and can get into something say in the 75g corner tank size.
> 
> A 10g isn't that tough but just restricting. ALso remember that at that size, when things start to go wrong, they go wrong very fast because of the size. In a larger tank you may catch small spikes in your water parameters earlier and be able to fix them easier than in the smaller tank size. I'm a newbie so I hope I havent confused you.


all we are wanting is a couple clowns...since they are small and"easy" to take care of, of the SW species..its something id like to go with.plus i like them anyways..once i have established enough knowledge on SW tanks.and have the room.ill eventually get a much much larger tank.a 10g is just a start.id hate to spend a lot of money on a large tank.then have all these problems and loose all my fish.i dont want to loose any fish no matter the cost or kind.but atleast with a couple clowns they would be i guess more hardy and easier to take care of.i also have a coral.its dead though.came with some stuff i bought a while back.its very small.size of a softball.plus for me i think it would be neat having a small SW tank.normally they are large.so something different to see something small  and thank you for the help


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> Not tough, its just that your not going to get much in there.


ah i understand..i was thinking like cycling would make it hard...something along those lines..but its just a starter tank.something my dad and i can do,we work a lot.especially with the holidays.even for me i only get the 24th and 25th off.go rite back to work the 26.


----------



## Reefing Madness (Jun 26, 2011)

prodrumernate said:


> all we are wanting is a couple clowns...since they are small and"easy" to take care of, of the SW species..its something id like to go with.plus i like them anyways..once i have established enough knowledge on SW tanks.and have the room.ill eventually get a much much larger tank.a 10g is just a start.id hate to spend a lot of money on a large tank.then have all these problems and loose all my fish.i dont want to loose any fish no matter the cost or kind.but atleast with a couple clowns they would be i guess more hardy and easier to take care of.i also have a coral.its dead though.came with some stuff i bought a while back.its very small.size of a softball.plus for me i think it would be neat having a small SW tank.normally they are large.so something different to see something small  and thank you for the help


Suggested tank size for a Clown is 20g. one possilby in a 10g, not 2.
Clownfish for Sale: Clownfish Species for the Home Aquarium


----------



## prodrumernate (Jun 22, 2012)

Reefing Madness said:


> Suggested tank size for a Clown is 20g. one possilby in a 10g, not 2.
> Clownfish for Sale: Clownfish Species for the Home Aquarium


thank you  that will help me decide on the size of tank now


----------

