# Prime's effect on the fish-in cycle



## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

I was wondering, do you think that using Prime might have adverse effect on cycling a tank?

I have about 6 fish in my 50 gallon right now that is almost cycled. The Nitrites have been spiking for the past 10 days or so, and I have been putting in some Prime simply to keep my fish alive! By it detoxifying the nitrites, is it not letting my nitrites turn into nitrates, completing the cycle? 

Thanks for any input in advance.


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## dmuddle (Nov 14, 2011)

I know someone that specialises in prime. jfengler knows heaps


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

dmuddle said:


> I know someone that specialises in prime. jfengler knows heaps


Is jfengler in the house?


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## dmuddle (Nov 14, 2011)

Sorry?? Whats the house


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## dmuddle (Nov 14, 2011)

He's my friend add me then add him, tell him I told you to and he'll add you


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

I meant it home as here, on the forums, reading this lol..


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## Tazman (Jan 15, 2012)

For your information

HERE.


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## Tazman (Jan 15, 2012)

Prime will NOT affect your cycle, it will help reduce the adverse effects caused by high ammonia and Nitrite in your tank.

Use it each time you do a water change.


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

yeah thats me mate, prime is excellent, highly concentrated so you only need a small amount in the tank, works well getting rid of chlorinate, chlorides and heave metals, also will give some healthy bacteria to the water but not very much of it, Prime is one of the best products you can buy I highly recommend it


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

will it slow down cycling an aquarium?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

no it will keep it at the same pace, a good cycle of a week, even getting a feeder goldfish can quicken the process as they will put in the natural bacteria in the tank


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

Adamson said:


> I was wondering, do you think that using Prime might have adverse effect on cycling a tank?
> 
> I have about 6 fish in my 50 gallon right now that is almost cycled. The Nitrites have been spiking for the past 10 days or so, and I have been putting in some Prime simply to keep my fish alive! By it detoxifying the nitrites, is it not letting my nitrites turn into nitrates, completing the cycle?
> 
> Thanks for any input in advance.


With the number's of fish listed under your aquariums,(how many are left?) and the fact that the tank is not cycled yet,, along with possibly foods and waste in excess, You would benefit from daily 50 percent water change .
Prime, nor the water changes will slow down the cycle but both are only effective for a 12 to 24 hour period in tank's where biological filter is still developing.
Water changes with Prime are quickest way to reduce Nitrites and ammonia.
Would not add any more fish for at least the next month while bacteria is developing and would feed fishes a tiny amount once every other day until the tank has matured ,or (cycled).
You indictae Six Chinese algae eater's among the fish listed under your aquarium and these,,i would get rid of.
They aren't from China,are quite poor alage eaters as they mature,,and WILL become aggressive with each other and other fishes you have.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

jfengler said:


> no it will keep it at the same pace, a good cycle of a week, even getting a feeder goldfish can quicken the process as they will put in the natural bacteria in the tank


Not a good idea to add MORE fish to a tank that is already over stocked for cycling purposes.
Fishes don't add bacteria,,they add ammonia from waste produced, and as by -product of respiration.
It is the ammonia that feeds bacteria and OP has plenty without adding more fish to possible toxic condition's.
Feeder fish in general,, are quickest way I know to introduce parasites or pathogen's to otherwise healthy tanks.
These fishes are often kept horrid condition's in crowded tank's with many dead fishes or diseased fishes present.
Only takes one diseased fish to infect the whole tank of feeder's and then you bring home these fish and spread the disease to your tank.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

1077 said:


> With the number's of fish listed under your aquariums,(how many are left?) and the fact that the tank is not cycled yet,, along with possibly foods and waste in excess, You would benefit from daily 50 percent water change .
> Prime, nor the water changes will slow down the cycle but both are only effective for a 12 to 24 hour period in tank's where biological filter is still developing.
> Water changes with Prime are quickest way to reduce Nitrites and ammonia.
> Would not add any more fish for at least the next month while bacteria is developing and would feed fishes a tiny amount once every other day until the tank has matured ,or (cycled).
> ...


That is old. I had one day about a week ago where I lost 4-5 fish, the Nitrites were up and killing.

Now I have 4 Tiger Barbs, 1 Chinese Algae Eater, 1 Rhino Pleco, 1 BGK, and a few snails in the 50 gallon tank. It is very well planted, I never get readings for Ammonia (It always tests at 0ppm). I feed the fish every other day. The Nitrites read at 5 ppm, which is high. The Nitrites have been at 5 ppm for 10 days now, when will they come down to 0??


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

to lower it you can try aquarium salt and a product called 'easy life' , it is completly non toxic and works very well for me, i also use this same method at the aquarium i work at


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

jfengler said:


> to lower it you can try aquarium salt and a product called 'easy life' , it is completly non toxic and works very well for me, i also use this same method at the aquarium i work at


That is what you use to help cycle the aquarium?


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

use it to lower nitrite and nitrate


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

Adamson said:


> That is old. I had one day about a week ago where I lost 4-5 fish, the Nitrites were up and killing.
> 
> Now I have 4 Tiger Barbs, 1 Chinese Algae Eater, 1 Rhino Pleco, 1 BGK, and a few snails in the 50 gallon tank. It is very well planted, I never get readings for Ammonia (It always tests at 0ppm). I feed the fish every other day. The Nitrites read at 5 ppm, which is high. The Nitrites have been at 5 ppm for 10 days now, when will they come down to 0??


Nitrites usually fall pretty quickly compared to ammonia levels and should be dropping any day.
Is good that your are feeding every other day if not overfeeding, but I might try feeding every two days and perform the once daily 40 to 50 percent water changes any time levels are much above zero.
Larger water changes using Prime will not slow cycle but WILL lower nitrites more than smaller water changes.
Do be sure and leave filter material alone, and do not clean the material under tapwater which often contains chloramines that kill all bacteria both good and bad.
clean filter material in old aquarium water you take out during water changes.


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

1077 said:


> Nitrites usually fall pretty quickly compared to ammonia levels and should be dropping any day.
> Is good that your are feeding every other day if not overfeeding, but I might try feeding every two days and perform the once daily 40 to 50 percent water changes any time levels are much above zero.
> Larger water changes using Prime will not slow cycle but WILL lower nitrites more than smaller water changes.
> Do be sure and leave filter material alone, and do not clean the material under tapwater which often contains chloramines that kill all bacteria both good and bad.
> clean filter material in old aquarium water you take out during water changes.


be carefull that large water changes will higher the risk of white spot disease


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

1077 said:


> Nitrites usually fall pretty quickly compared to ammonia levels and should be dropping any day.
> Is good that your are feeding every other day if not overfeeding, but I might try feeding every two days and perform the once daily 40 to 50 percent water changes any time levels are much above zero.
> Larger water changes using Prime will not slow cycle but WILL lower nitrites more than smaller water changes.
> Do be sure and leave filter material alone, and do not clean the material under tapwater which often contains chloramines that kill all bacteria both good and bad.
> clean filter material in old aquarium water you take out during water changes.


I am just worried I am not producing enough bacteria to continue to produce Ammonia to produce Nitrites to finish the cycle..

I have been doing a lot of 50% water changes and the following day I test the Nitrites and they are still at 5 (Bright, Dark Purple on the API Master kit)


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

jfengler said:


> be carefull that large water changes will higher the risk of white spot disease


How so? So long as new water has been treated with dechlorinator,and is close to same temp as the tank, this is not likely to result in ICH.
Much more likely to appear with fishes stressed from nitrite poisoning which is often fatal.
If current level's of nitrites are indeed as posted..the larger water changes will bring much relief assuming nothing but tapwater and dechlorinator are being used.
Nitrites kill quickly and the larger water changes are preferred over dead fish.
A bit of salt can indeed reduce nitrite toxicity, perhaps one tablespoon per 10 gallons would be safe approach for fish and plant's on temporary basis.


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

1077 said:


> How so? So long as new water has been treated with dechlorinator,and is close to same temp as the tank, this is not likely to result in ICH.
> Much more likely to appear with fishes stressed from nitrite poisoning which is often fatal.
> If current level's of nitrites are indeed as posted..the larger water changes will bring much relief assuming nothing but tapwater and dechlorinator are being used.
> Nitrites kill quickly and the larger water changes are preferred over dead fish.
> A bit of salt can indeed reduce nitrite toxicity, perhaps one tablespoon per 10 gallons would be safe approach for fish and plant's on temporary basis.


it does seem unlikely but it is true a former employee had done too much of a water change in tanks and they all got white spot due to the stress of all the new water


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

jfengler said:


> it does seem unlikely but it is true a former employee had done too much of a water change in tanks and they all got white spot due to the stress of all the new water


Yes,this often happens when water changes have been neglected for some time,or,,fishes are being kept in water they are unsuited for with respect to GH,KH,pH.,sudden temp change.


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

1077 said:


> Yes,this often happens when water changes have been neglected for some time,or,,fishes are being kept in water they are unsuited for with respect to GH,KH,pH.,sudden temp change.


yeah the temperature went from 28 celcius down to 24 celcius, he had used one of the other fish tanks connected to the sumps, well lets say he in deep trouble for doin that


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

jfengler said:


> yeah the temperature went from 28 celcius down to 24 celcius, he had used one of the other fish tanks connected to the sumps, well lets say he in deep shit for doin that


Damn 82 degrees to 75, did he get fired?


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

Adamson said:


> Damn 82 degrees to 75, did he get fired?


no but he isnt getting paid for a fortnight and if he kills anything else hes fired, he cost us $450 in fish


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

jfengler said:


> no but he isnt getting paid for a fortnight and if he kills anything else hes fired, he cost us $450 in fish


Where do you work?


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## jfengler (Feb 28, 2012)

billabong aquatics at winston glades in ipswich QLD australia


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## twilk2012 (Feb 15, 2012)

*High nitrites*

I am having the same problem. 60g tank with:
3 swordtails
1 gourami
1 Cory
2 phantom tetras
Ammonia is at 0. Nitrites at 5ppm and Nitrates at 20. I am using the API master test kit. I've done water changes with Prime and have used Stability. The fish are all doing well but the nitrites won't come down and have been high for the last 2 weeks. When will the cycle finish? Could I have false readings on the Nitrites due to the Prime?


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## Geomancer (Aug 23, 2010)

1077 has offered some good advice.

I would just like to add that Prime detoxifies, but does not remove ammonia or nitrite. Thus, your water test kits will still show the presence of those substances ... because they are still there, just not in a toxic form.

This detoxification is only temporary, and with a cycling tank it is necessary to continue using it to keep it detoxified. While detoxified, it is still useable by the bacteria and thus will not affect your cycle in any way.

5 ppm Nitrite is massively excessive, and will actually hinder the development of the beneficial bacteria. As 1077 mentions I would be doing daily 50% changes to get that under control. I must say I have never heard of water changes causing any disease, however as said sudden changes in water parameters can, by inducing stress and thus weakening the immune system. If you keep your tap water as close as possible to your tanks temperature, there will be no issue. Do not do more than one water change a day.

One thing that has not been mentioned is, have you tested your tap water? Tap water can contain any of the three that we test for (Ammonia, Nitrite, and/or Nitrate). If it does, that can be the source of your problem, but using a water conditioner that detoxifies it is how you get around it, the beneficial bacteria will then take care of it before the water conditioner wears off (in a normally cycled aquarium).

The cycle takes 4-8 weeks to complete.


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## twilk2012 (Feb 15, 2012)

*High Nitrites*

I have tested the tap water and it is 0 for all. I set up the tank on 12/26 and much to my dismay added fish a week later. I am a newbie and did not know any better got a lot of bad info from the lfs. I lost a lot of fish along the way and am finally learning about cycling. I just wish the nitrites would go down.


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

twilk2012 said:


> I have tested the tap water and it is 0 for all. I set up the tank on 12/26 and much to my dismay added fish a week later. I am a newbie and did not know any better got a lot of bad info from the lfs. I lost a lot of fish along the way and am finally learning about cycling. I just wish the nitrites would go down.


They will go down so long as bacteria are present .(and have food source)
Some folks get nervous during the cycling period when cloudy water appears and tank's water no longer looks pristine.
This is most often caused by bacteria bloom and is normal, but some decide to remove,replace filter material and by doing so,,they throw out the majority of bacteria that resides on the filter material in newly established tanks.
Other's clean the material in tapwater at the sink, and chloramines in this water kills off a sizeable portion of the bacteria .
So long as bacteria have source of food,they will continue to grow and cycle will eventually happen but too much food,too many fish,or as mentioned,,tampering with filter,can cause the process to take longer than need be.
Plant's can help, along with patience.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

I have not touched my filter at all, all I have been doing is gravel vacs.
Could it be possible that since my fish are producing so little Ammonia, and that because I have so many plants (about 15 in the 50 gallons) that no ammonia is getting to the filter to help with the cycle?

I have tested my tap water, it had .25 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and 10 nitrates..


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Adamson said:


> I have not touched my filter at all, all I have been doing is gravel vacs.
> Could it be possible that since my fish are producing so little Ammonia, and that because I have so many plants (about 15 in the 50 gallons) that no ammonia is getting to the filter to help with the cycle?
> 
> I have tested my tap water, it had .25 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and 10 nitrates..


I checked the other thread on your issue; did you remove that straw filter item?


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Byron said:


> I checked the other thread on your issue; did you remove that straw filter item?


Yeah that has been removed for a week now.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Just tested the water, these were my results:

Ph: 7.2
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 5 (Very bright violet color)
Nitrates: 10-20


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## Maxillius (Sep 27, 2011)

hello adamson! here is what I read on prime and how to use it
Use 1 capful (5 mL) for each 200 L (50 gallons*) of new water. This removes approximately 1 mg/L ammonia, 4 mg/L chloramine, or 5 mg/L chlorine. For smaller doses, please note each cap thread is approx. 1 mL. May be added to aquarium directly, but better if added to new water first. If adding directly to aquarium, base dose on aquarium volume. Sulfur odor is normal. For exceptionally high chloramine concentrations, a double dose may be used safely. To detoxify nitrite in an emergency, up to 5 times normal dose may be used. If temperature is > 30 °C (86 °F) and chlorine or ammonia levels are low, use a half dose.

so using 5x the ammount of prime in your aquarium will make your nitrite harmless for your fish and will not slow down your cycle, and after you have added the required amount of prime you should read 0 nitrite even tho its still there but none toxic, monitor your aquarium each 2 days and on the day that you have 0 nitrite 2 days after adding prime you can be almost sure you are cycled to make sure test again the next day then the consequent day and if 0 again then you are cycled  do a water change to remove any unwanted chemicals from prime as you will dose at 5x the normal amount!


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

I know how to use prime and everything, and I know that even after you put the prime in, the Nitrites will still show up on the test even though they have been detoxified by the Prime. I am just concerned about getting the Nitrites down for good and this damn cycle ending!


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## Maxillius (Sep 27, 2011)

When I used prime to detoxify nitrite it would show over limit on chart then after using prime it would indicate 0
so if you are still seeing nitrite with your test means it is not detoxify well at least with the api test kit I have
and to answer the other question there is no way to speed up a cycle aside from uping your temperature to 30c
witch should help bacteria colonize faster, make sure your fish a comfortable at these temperature because high temp can be as harmful to some fish then ammonia or nitrite!


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## Chesh (Feb 17, 2012)

Been keeping an eye on this thread, as I also have the same questions about adding Prime to a cycling tank. Thanks for all the info here. . . I'm still feeling a bit skeptical about adding ANY extra chemicals to the tank, and am very worried about what happens after the 24 hour mark when the 'binding' on the nitrites and nitrates 'breaks' and the fish feel the true levels return very suddenly (as opposed to the slow building up of these toxins that allow their systems to somewhat adjust). I didn't realize that you have to dose at *5x the normal* *amount* in order for it to have an effect on anything other than ammonia, chlorine, and chloramine. This actually makes me feel better about the stuff, as I've never come close to dosing that high! I know that I read that nitrates and nitrites would still test positive after prime, which really worried me - I don't like not being able to trust my testing kit to show me accurately what the fish are feeling.


Maxillius said:


> When I used prime to detoxify nitrite it would show over limit on chart then after using prime it would indicate 0


I think I'll have to do an experiment on this, as my tank is cycling and I'm currently in the middle of a nitrAte spike. Tomorrow, if the numbers are still high, I'll separate 2 gallons of the dirty water when I do my water change, test it as a control, then do another test at 2.5 and again at 5x the two-drops-per-gallon amount called for in the directions. I'd really like to see this for myself! IF the numbers drop to zero, it will make me feel much more comfortable using this stuff, knowing that my API test IS still showing an accurate representation of whats in my tank. The problem with the muddy ammonia reading is a whole 'nother story, though.

The information they have on their FAQ didn't make me feel any better about using it - regarding the HOW aspect:


> The detoxification of nitrite and nitrate by Prime (when used at elevated levels) is not well understood from a mechanistic standpoint. The most likely explanation is that the nitrite and nitrate is removed in a manner similar to the way ammonia is removed; i.e. it is bound and held in a inert state until such time that bacteria in the biological filter are able to take a hold of it, break it apart and use it. Two other possible scenarios are reduction to nitrogen (N2) gas or conversion into a benign organic nitrogen compound.
> I wish we had some more "concrete" explanation, but the end result is the same, it does actually detoxify nitrite and nitrate. This was unexpected chemically and thus initially we were not even aware of this, however we received numerous reports from customers stating that when they overdosed with Prime they were able to reduce or eliminate the high death rates they experienced when their nitrite and nitrate levels were high. We have received enough reports to date to ensure that this is no fluke and is in fact a verifiable function of the product.


Basically *shrug* they have no idea how it works. . . how is this to inspire confidence!?? Still, as an emergency measure, I think the stuff is good to have on-hand!


Much to think on in this thread. . . thanks again! I'll be lurking around to see if there is any more information gathered here on the stuff!


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Honestly between using Prime, Stability, and water changes every day or two, I am not too worried about anything. I think my Nitrites may soon be coming down.


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## Tazman (Jan 15, 2012)

Patience is the key unless you have a heavily planted tank to help suck up the nitrites.

Prime is THE recommended conditioner that many people and have never had any problems with it.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Tazman said:


> Patience is the key unless you have a heavily planted tank to help suck up the nitrites.
> 
> Prime is THE recommended conditioner that many people and have never had any problems with it.


I have a heavily planted tank and I don't think they are sucking up any nitrites lol..


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## Chesh (Feb 17, 2012)

Adamson said:


> Honestly between using Prime, Stability, and water changes every day or two, I am not too worried about anything. I think my Nitrites may soon be coming down.


I'm sure they will, too! Sorry I kind of went nuts on your thread, I got excited because it was the only one I've been able to find with any information on Prime, and that's MY concern. Didn't mean to butt in with my beginner self! 
Good luck with your tank!


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## twilk2012 (Feb 15, 2012)

I'm still having high nitrite spike with some low nitrates. 5ppm nitrite anad 5ppm nitrates. Have been using Prime and waiting patiently for the nitrite to come down .


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Chesherca said:


> Been keeping an eye on this thread, as I also have the same questions about adding Prime to a cycling tank. Thanks for all the info here. . . I'm still feeling a bit skeptical about adding ANY extra chemicals to the tank, and am very worried about what happens after the 24 hour mark when the 'binding' on the nitrites and nitrates 'breaks' and the fish feel the true levels return very suddenly (as opposed to the slow building up of these toxins that allow their systems to somewhat adjust). I didn't realize that you have to dose at *5x the normal* *amount* in order for it to have an effect on anything other than ammonia, chlorine, and chloramine. This actually makes me feel better about the stuff, as I've never come close to dosing that high! I know that I read that nitrates and nitrites would still test positive after prime, which really worried me - I don't like not being able to trust my testing kit to show me accurately what the fish are feeling.
> 
> I think I'll have to do an experiment on this, as my tank is cycling and I'm currently in the middle of a nitrAte spike. Tomorrow, if the numbers are still high, I'll separate 2 gallons of the dirty water when I do my water change, test it as a control, then do another test at 2.5 and again at 5x the two-drops-per-gallon amount called for in the directions. I'd really like to see this for myself! IF the numbers drop to zero, it will make me feel much more comfortable using this stuff, knowing that my API test IS still showing an accurate representation of whats in my tank. The problem with the muddy ammonia reading is a whole 'nother story, though.
> 
> ...


Your proposed test will likely not help. Prime detoxifies ammonia and nitrite, but both still show with our aquarium test kits, so that won't tell you anything. After 36-48 hours, the ammonium and nitrite will be back to ammonia and toxic nitrite, so that won't show any different with tests. And being isolated in a pail, since both live in the water, there will not be sufficient bacteria on the pail surfaces to have any effect on either toxin.

With respect to overdosing, my view is that Prime is still a chemical and the less chemicals put in a fish tank the better. Now, this has a purpose, but as they themselves do not know how it works, how do they know it is completely safe when significantly overdosed for prolonged periods? It may or may not be. Water changes are still the safest way to reduce toxic ammonia and nitrite if it is present in high numbers. Live plants will handle it in normal situations.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Adamson said:


> I have a heavily planted tank and I don't think they are sucking up any nitrites lol..


I checked the photos in your other thread on this topic, and one might argue "heavily planted.";-) With that planted tank at day one, with a small group of small fish, and building up from there, I would not expect any ammonia or nitrite to appear on test kits. But once nitrite in particular is present at a high level, this is a very different situation.

I don't have the knowledge to come anywhere close to providing a full explanation, so all I can say is that several factors in an aquarium can cause nitrite to rise. The very complex bacterial cycle (and I'm not referring solely to the nitrification cycle we all mainly understand, but all of the bacteria cycle from start to finish) can take many "wrong turns."


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Byron said:


> I checked the photos in your other thread on this topic, and one might argue "heavily planted.";-) With that planted tank at day one, with a small group of small fish, and building up from there, I would not expect any ammonia or nitrite to appear on test kits. But once nitrite in particular is present at a high level, this is a very different situation.
> 
> I don't have the knowledge to come anywhere close to providing a full explanation, so all I can say is that several factors in an aquarium can cause nitrite to rise. The very complex bacterial cycle (and I'm not referring solely to the nitrification cycle we all mainly understand, but all of the bacteria cycle from start to finish) can take many "wrong turns."


Yeah I really don't know what to do besides riding it out, doing some water changes and using Prime/Stability..

I decided to cycle another tank, a 29 gallon, and I feel like that one will be easier. Did the raw shrimp thing for a while and now I threw in a bunch of gold fish.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

Just checked my water and finally my nitrites are down to .5ppm, victory!


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## Chesh (Feb 17, 2012)

Adamson said:


> Just checked my water and finally my nitrites are down to .5ppm, victory!


HOORAY FOR YOU! I knew you'd be there soon!
*dances*


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## ladayen (Jun 21, 2011)

Adamson said:


> Yeah I really don't know what to do besides riding it out, doing some water changes and using Prime/Stability..
> 
> I decided to cycle another tank, a 29 gallon, and I feel like that one will be easier. Did the raw shrimp thing for a while and now I threw in a bunch of gold fish.


Why throw in the goldfish?


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

Most here are opposed to killing fish if we can help it.
Throwing a bunch of goldfish in an uncylcled tank, will require daily water changes to prevent possible/probable deaths, with or without seed material from an established tank.
What plans are there for the goldfish that manage to survive?
Contrary to what many often post,,few reputable fish stores will take these fish back for fear of introducing who knows what to their tanks.
Nor are most of these stores willing to spend the money to medicate sick fish that may be harboring all manner of pathogens ,parasites.
Those stores that WOULD ,,are not stores that you want to buy fish from if healthy stock is what your after.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Agree. I am totally opposed to using any hardy (as some call them) fish to cycle. Do it with lots of plants, bacteria seeding of some sort, and a few fish you want in the tank, or do it fishless.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

1077 said:


> Most here are opposed to killing fish if we can help it.
> Throwing a bunch of goldfish in an uncylcled tank, will require daily water changes to prevent possible/probable deaths, with or without seed material from an established tank.
> What plans are there for the goldfish that manage to survive?
> Contrary to what many often post,,few reputable fish stores will take these fish back for fear of introducing who knows what to their tanks.
> ...


Well I am going to keep Piranhas so eventually it will just be food for them. I will never flush a live fish, I have plenty of places to keep the gold fish.

And having a bunch of gold fish in the tank actually does help a lot. Creates a large bioload, and that is exactly what I want in there right now. I am using Prime and Stability to make sure they are okay anyways.


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## Adamson (Feb 5, 2012)

In other news, my 50 gallon is completely cycled. 0 ammonia, 0 Nitrites, about 10 Nitrates.
Added a handful of hanging plants and it is looking good. I have my Red Belly fry in there.


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