# I couldn't save their poor little souls.... [32 gallon to stock]



## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Well, the friend that stuffed 28 fish in that little 12 gallon is no longer an aquaintance of mine. I went over to do my daily water change and all of the fish were on the bottom or at the top of a murky red tank; dead. He laughed when I confronted him about it. I feel horrible I couldn't save these fish.... I wanted to so badly.... Turns out he killed them all and enjoyed watching them slowly meet their demise. He put a slit in each one of their little throats and watched them die. I'm infuriated and sickened. I don't know how anyone could do that to a fish.. Sick, sick man.

On the brighter side of things, I now have a 32 gallon custom to stock. It's perfect for Angelfish and I'd love a mated pair. I would like more information on them doing so and how I can acheive this. How do you sex and Angelfish? Also, what would be good tankmates for Angelfish? I would only like two Angelfish, but do not want an empty-looking tank. Would this be okay:

2 Angelfish (Mated Pair)
2 Kribs (M/F)
1 Red-Tailed Shark
1 Powder Blue Gourami (M)
1 Betta (male or female?)

I think it would be a Beautiful tank with these inhabitants, but is it okay for these fish?
It has around 7.2-7.4 pH and an Undergravel Filter.

Sincerely,
British


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

That is absolutely disgusting. Just remember that you tried.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I still haven't stopped crying and it's been six hours since I found out. I just calmed enough to post this thread. I just can't believe what he did....


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I'm still trying to pretend I never even read your prior post! Just to satisfy my own curiousity, how old is this former "friend" of yours? 

On an up note I'm glad you'll be able to start your new tank and put this mess behind you.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

He's 14. 

Does that sound like a decent stocking list?


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

I *think* you can keep angels w/ kribs. I prefer to see bettas housed solo with only bottom dwellers for company, but that's just me. Everything I've read says red tail sharks are very territorial and that they require a 50g minimum. I'd think the gourami might nip the angels, or vice versa. Bottom line...I don't really know. Plenty of people here do and I'm sure they'll be chiming in shortly.


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## artgalnj (Jun 27, 2009)

So sorry to hear about what happened, that's just evil. The fact that your so upset about this speaks very highly of you who are. However, for a 14 year old to do that says something terrible about them. IMO, a person who kills animals for amusement has real issues. Today it's fish, tomorrow who know what.

BTW, as far as sexing angelfish goes, they sex pretty easily. I have 2 breeding pairs now in my 75g...guess what one pair is doing right at this moment??? My ph is typically 7.6 and I had one spawning pair in my 20g but now I've moved them into the 75g, so now I have 2 spawning pairs. But I don't want to raise angelfish fry.


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## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

artgalnj said:


> . However, for a 14 year old to do that says something terrible about them. IMO, a person who kills animals for amusement has real issues. Today it's fish, tomorrow who know what.
> 
> I agree totally. What a sick little boy. That posting made me sick to my stomach.
> 
> His parents should get him some professional help.


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## Romad (Jun 28, 2009)

British, I'm sorry you had to see that. It was nice of you to try to help and it says a lot about your character. 

You're a very kind soul.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

How do you sex them and how do you allow them to form pairs? I will be purchasing them at a rather young age. Bettas are sometimes okay in communities (maybe a female?) and Red-Tailed Sharks are listed as community fish. What bottom-dweller do you suggest? (I'd prefer to stay away from Cories, $5 a pop is $30 for six fish and I really don't have that kind of money.) I've heard it all depends on the personality of the fish. I'd like the Angels and Kribs to be the main focal point of the tank, though. My aquarium is completely sealed, and no jumpers can get caught behind a light, because the inside of the lid is a smooth surface. I'll post photographs of the tank if you'd all like. There are three little floating glass fish in there at the moment.

I am 14, going on 15 in October. I am a vegan (five years strong) and a proud member of PETA.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Thank you, Romad. If you look at my other board, you can see the fish he had in there and the effort I was making to save them. Located here: http://www.fishforum.com/freshwater-tropical-fish/pea-gravel-cycling-questions-27569/


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Here is the tank and the three glass fish.






































I'm sorry about the size, I have no idea how to fix that. Here are some photographs of my lovely boy, Castiel. (pronounced Cass-tea-L)










































He is to be moved into a 1 gallon vase this weekend and has an affinity for staring down the gravel. I love my little guy.


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

aunt kymmie said:


> I *think* you can keep angels w/ kribs.


I have a single krib in my 55g which has 3 angels with no issue. Krib was introduced several weeks ago.

I wouldn't recommend a pair of kribs though... if they pair up they could start attacking all their tankmates.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

It all depends on the personality of the fish, I guess. Are there any other fish similar to Kribs that would breed and are compatable with a pair of Angels?


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

So sorry to hear what you went through today. I am glad that you now, do not have a reason to go over there. Who knows what crazy thing that boy will do next! 

I know bettas and gouramis are not a good mix.
I have heard mating angles can get pretty nasty, so I think sticking with some type of bottom fish would be a good plan. You could just start out with three cory, then add the others later when you have the money.

Your tank looks very nice. When you said glass fish, I thought you where talking about alive fish. There are fish called glass fish, but your glass fish are very cute and I do not think they will give you any compatibility problems. lol

Also, that is one healthy looking betta you have, very pretty!


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Hmm, how does this sound?

3 Angels (they are the size of a dime at the moment)
1 Dwarf Gourami
2 Mystery Snails
5 Corydoras

Thank you, Twistersmom. I'm thinking about using my 10 gallon as a divided tank for my boy and a female companion for him. Then another male it is for the vase.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I have changed his name to Amaro. It means 'Strong' in Native American.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I'm very angry at this man. Thanks to him I just broke my hand. I furious. I'm shaking and about to be on my way to the ER to get a cast. I punched a solid cement wall out of my anger. I feel so ignorant for not rescuing these fish sooner. I'm having a very hard time living with myself at the moment. I don't understand how someone could do that to the poor creatures! Ugh this makes me so angry. I've never been angry like this in my life. I'm a calm person believe it or not and am anti-violence. This is just on my last nerve, though!


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

British said:


> I'm very angry at this man. Thanks to him I just broke my hand. I furious. I'm shaking and about to be on my way to the ER to get a cast. I punched a solid cement wall out of my anger. I feel so ignorant for not rescuing these fish sooner. I'm having a very hard time living with myself at the moment. I don't understand how someone could do that to the poor creatures! Ugh this makes me so angry. I've never been angry like this in my life. I'm a calm person believe it or not and am anti-violence. This is just on my last nerve, though!


If you broke your hand you wouldn't be able to type a coherent paragraph like that. Doesn't hurt to get it checked out though.

Don't take it personally... you did what you had to do.


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## Tetra4life (Mar 1, 2009)

Whoa, three ceramicus decorachromis is way to much for that tank! Plus they will need brackish when mature.

And on a seirous note don't be to hard on your self, there is nothing you can due to end ignorance in the world. hope your fist heals fully and good luck with the angels!


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## artgalnj (Jun 27, 2009)

British, I didn't try to pair up the fish. I had a 20g and I adopted 4 angelfish (long story). One of the angelfish died a couple of days after I adopted them, but the other 3 lived. They were kind of small when I got them, maybe quarter-sized. I kept the 3 angelfish and eventually 2 of them paired up (I had them for about 10 months before they paired up). I had always wanted to upgrade to a larger tank, so that was my opportunity to do so. The two paired angelfish became VERY VERY aggressive with the 3rd one. I got the 75g up and cycled, then I transfered them in. They've been in the new tank for 3 weeks now. The spawning pair were always aggressive towards the 3rd one, even after I put them into the larger tank and even when they weren't spawing. I ended up buying 3 more angelfish from a breeder near me because I heard it may slow down the aggression. So now the 3rd angelfish paired w/ one of the new angelfish. Now I have 2 pairs of fish that are just vicious.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Maybe I'll just get the three angels, and give one away when/if they pair?

And I'm on an iTouch so I can use one hand.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I've never heard of Angels requiring brackish.


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## Tetra4life (Mar 1, 2009)

I was refering to the ceramicus decorachromis (the "glass fish"), it's a joke.


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

Tetra4life said:


> I was refering to the ceramicus decorachromis (the "glass fish"), it's a joke.


I thought it was a cute Joke! Made me laugh!


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## aunt kymmie (Jun 2, 2008)

And to think I almost googled ceramicus decorachromis :lol:


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I thought it was the Angels scientific name. XD I'm slow.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

As far as my stocking goes, I will be removing the Ceramicus Decoramicus and adding four juvenile Angels and two Apple Snails. Once/If two pair off, I will give the other two to my LPS for free. My ten gallon is going to Amaro, my Betta.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Although, I don't know if I want such an agressive fish.... If I can find a pair of Kribs at my local LFSs what would be good tankmates? I'm so indecisive when it comes to these things. Or are there any other fish you would suggest? Keep in mind this is a 32 gallon 36'' x 14" x ? (Sorry about the ? But as you can see, the width varies due to the shape.) I'm working with a budget of anywhere from $55-$40 to purchase these fish.


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## aquariangel (Aug 12, 2009)

I just read this thread for the first time. What a horrible person that is! And only 14 years old??!!?? Unbelievable....so, so sad


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## SubAtomicScope (Jul 30, 2009)

Hi there British (and others...)

Just read about your incident and although I do sympathize with you regarding these fish, I do feel you are possibly taking it a little too personally. At 15 years old this will be one of MANY time you will encounter people who JUST DONT CARE. You need to find a way to deal with it because you only have one good hand left...LOL...which brings me to my next more serious issue...How is your hand? What did the x-rays show? Going to be difficult to work on your tanks and not get your cast wet...


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## Little-Fizz (Aug 19, 2007)

Off topic: You went vegan when you were 9??? What got you into that, I thought I was hardcore because I went vegetarian at 11 but I've only been vegan for two years and I'm 18 now. I would be careful about how you associate your self with peta, Ingrid is insane and everyone knows. Usually once you say you're a proud member of peta your argument gets thrown out the window, it's better to fight the eco way. More people listen when you say the beef industry pumps out more green house gases annually then all the cars in the world. A lot of people truly don't care about farm animals, just my two cents anyways, peta doesn't know how to get peoples attention without offending them therefore turning them off of our lifestyle.

Edit: Out of all my years punching holes in walls and the odd concrete one, I've never managed to break my fist. I do have some misshaped knuckles though... Lol wait maybe I did do something to it I never actually get it checked out, ice does wonders.


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## zomblue (Aug 25, 2009)

Hate to hear that about the 14yr old serial killer in the making - seriously someone should report him to a doctor!
Hope all goes well with your new tank tho


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

aunt kymmie said:


> And to think I almost googled ceramicus decorachromis :lol:


:roll: Kymmie, I thought I was the one losing it... lol...:lol: Love it.;-)

That was a good post Tetra4life, I really howled. After such sickness earlier it was a bit of relief. Thank you sincerely.

British, on with the tank. Best wishes, Byron.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

Reading through previous posts, to sum up I think you (British) are now thinking 4 small angels and a bottom fish? Good idea in my view, although I would go with five angels. And corydoras are excellent tankmates, 3 now and 3 later would work (minimum 3 is best, they are very social and do not do well singly). 

Plants like vallisneria and saggitarria, and/or amazon swords, would be good with the angels. The vertical stripe on the angels is camouflage, in their native habitat they live in quiet water among tall plants and twigs, roots, etc., a clue to acquascaping, and in groups.

I concur with earlier suggestions not to mix gouramis or kribs with angels.

Byron.


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## Tetra4life (Mar 1, 2009)

Byron said:


> :roll: Kymmie, I thought I was the one losing it... lol...:lol: Love it.;-)
> 
> That was a good post Tetra4life, I really howled. After such sickness earlier it was a bit of relief. Thank you sincerely.
> 
> British, on with the tank. Best wishes, Byron.


 
Glad I could help!


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

My hand is completely shattered along with my wrist. Dislocations, snaps and complete shattering. The list of specifics is too long to post. I can manage working on tanks with my left hand. I'm just so indecisive about stocking.


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## Gav (Aug 22, 2009)

I'm sorry to hear about what happened, if I asked someone to look after my tanks and they did that, well I don't think i can say what i would do to them (for legal and morale reasons).

From my experience with gouramis and angels they don't get along unless your tank has alot of swimming space. As for a pair of kribs they would be ok until they try to breed then they will get very aggresive. Red tailed sharks are very aggresive aswell, i don't know why they are 'community' classed fish because my girlfriends sister had a 6.5 foot tank and it was still territorial in that. 

Easiest way to sex angels or get a pair is to get 6 to 8 wait for a pair to come from them then return the rest to your lfs, you should probably speak to the manager first about the angels and explain you are tryin to get a pair.


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## MXS (Jul 13, 2009)

This is a joke, right?


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

MXS said:


> This is a joke, right?


What is?


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I've decided. Saturday when I go to the petshop I will buy four angels. Do you all think a few (three-four) Mollies would be alright with them? When a pair forms I'll give the others to the petshop for free. I'm going to wait off on getting bottom fish, unless I can find a bristlenose pleco. Would this be okay until they form a pair:

4 Angels
4 Mollies/Platies
(1 Bristlenose Pleco?) 

Sincerely,
British


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## Twistersmom (Dec 9, 2008)

I think the pleco would work.
In my opinion, it would be best to avoid any other fish that would swim at the same level.
I have not kept angle fish, so maybe wait on some more replies from angle fish keepers.


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

British said:


> I've decided. Saturday when I go to the petshop I will buy four angels. Do you all think a few (three-four) Mollies would be alright with them? When a pair forms I'll give the others to the petshop for free. I'm going to wait off on getting bottom fish, unless I can find a bristlenose pleco. Would this be okay until they form a pair:
> 
> 4 Angels
> 4 Mollies/Platies
> ...


Swordtails do very well with angels. I would lean towards swordtails or platies over mollies


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Ill try to look for some swordtails and platies. Four is good; one male, three females. Can platies and swords interbreed?


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

British said:


> Ill try to look for some swordtails and platies. Four is good; one male, three females. Can platies and swords interbreed?


yes


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

We don't have swords at our Petsmart, but I'll look around. I'll maybe get a single female sword and three platies. (one male)


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## artgalnj (Jun 27, 2009)

FYI, a fish stores will not be able to distinguish a female vs. a male angelfish...trust me! I just bought 3 adult angelfish from a breeder and even he couldn't distinguish male from female. You can't be certain it seems until they spawn. And if they're not fully grown, it's impossible to tell. In fact, I would have SWORN that one of my angelfish was a male...but then she spawned eggs. I was convinced she was a male for several months, turned out I was wrong.

As far as breeding them goes, there's ALOT of work that goes into it. I was just reading a post on the angelfish forum (angelfish.net) about someone who was successfully breeding angelfish for a while, so he knew what he was doing. All of a sudden his fry is dying off at a certain stage and the possible causes to this seem endless. I personally pull the eggs because I don't have what it takes to raise fry. I know alot of people will argue that angelfish make great parents, but they're held in captivity so you have to be very involved in the process and for providing perfect conditions so that they survive.

And one last note if you are going to try breeding. If you buy 3 of the same type of angelfish from the same batch, you most probably will be interbreeding them. The breeder that I bought my fish from was telling me about some of the issues that arise from relentless interbreeding (even physical characteristics). Just some food for thought.

BTW, bristlenose plecos are supposed to be better for angelfish as opposed to common plecos. If your angelfish lay eggs however, you'll have to move the eggs into a breeding tank because the plecos and other fish may have caviar when the lights go out.


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## Byron (Mar 7, 2009)

British said:


> We don't have swords at our Petsmart, but I'll look around. I'll maybe get a single female sword and three platies. (one male)


Just a caution, if you have a male and female platy or swordtail (they will interbreed as NCFrank correctly said) you will have hundreds of fry for months. I just finished a post in another thread on this topic. Livebearers can mate very young before it is even possible to differentiate males from females without very close observation, and once impregnated, a female stores the sperm and can deliver dozens of fry every 2-3 months for several times. And during this period, it is best to separate her from the male(s) as they will hound her attempting to mate again and frequently the female dies as a result. All males or all females avoids this--provided you find females that have not been impregnated which in a store tank of males and females would be next to impossible.

Byron.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Thank you everyone. I have bred Livebearers before, so I know. As far as the angels go, I'm still uncertain. /:


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## MXS (Jul 13, 2009)

British said:


> What is?


The whole slit their throats thing


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Why would I joke about such?? That isn't something to be taken lightly. I can't believe such a remark would be made that it's not true.


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## mags2313 (Nov 25, 2008)

Yeah, what that kid did is pretty disgusting and sounded like he knew exactely what he was doing putting twenty eight fish into a 12 gallon.. And the slitting their necks? That means he had to catch each and every one and get an exacto knife or something... Probablly took him more than a few minutes... What a jack ass.

I have 4 Angelfish in my 55g right now, they get along great with my Blue Dwarf Gourami. Right now they are also with a full sized Siamese Algae Eater and 4 Burmese Zebra Loaches.....


In my opinion, do not put the betta in with your angelfish...


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## NC Frank (Aug 24, 2009)

MXS said:


> The whole slit their throats thing


I find the whole "broke my hand and am going to the emergency room yet I continue to post on a fish forum" less believable than the already unbelievable story about the fish assassin. :shock:


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## 1077 (Apr 16, 2008)

I don't know, I managed to type this with just one hand and with the exception of capitalizing,,Found it not to be all that difficult and only took me slightly longer than otherwise. I might add ,that my typingskills I would imagine,,are only slightly better than a monkey's.
I do find it troubling that someone would go to all the trouble of slitting the throats of the fish. T he others prolly died from shock after witnessing the fate of the first fish thus,,, making it unnecessary to repeat the deed on the others.


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## Little-Fizz (Aug 19, 2007)

NC Frank said:


> I find the whole "broke my hand and am going to the emergency room yet I continue to post on a fish forum" less believable than the already unbelievable story about the fish assassin. :shock:


Seems fishy... especially a nine year old vegan.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

Believe me or not, I know what I saw and did. This board seems to be making it's way to the rubbish bin. I wish to cause no issues. Thank you. 

Sincerely,
British


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## Little-Fizz (Aug 19, 2007)

British said:


> This board seems to be making it's way to the rubbish bin. I wish to cause no issues. Thank you.


Um how do you figure? Then why are you on here asking for our advice? That doesn't make much sense to me.


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## British (Aug 8, 2009)

I was asking for advice regarding stocking. I was giving an update to my other board.


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