# Septicemia??



## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

I just can't believe this. I'm afraid it looks like my angel has got septicemia, I am just having a hard time admitting it. I don't understand how he could have got this? I need someone to slap me in the face and confirm. OR tell me it's not and it's something else (prefer the latter). 

The water's all great in the tank where he got sick. 
ph=7.2
kh=3
gh=4
0ppm ammonia, nitrite
<5pmm nitrate

*There may have been some kind of parasite in the tank (however), which I am dealing with. His hospital tank has been de-wormed as well.
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=424178&stc=1&d=1409608971
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=424186&stc=1&d=1409608971
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=424194&stc=1&d=1409608971
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=424202&stc=1&d=1409608971

If it turns out to be septicemia, I have already finished dosing with Kanaplex (kanamycin) in the tank water, and feeding him Maracyn-2 medicated food. Is he doomed, is the infection incurable? Is there *anything * else I can do? Is it contagious if I put him back with his friends? Is he suffering? 

He seems ok, he is eating good, has a good response reflex, sustains equilibrium. I already lost his mate 3 weeks ago to dropsy, I just don't get how this all happened??


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

So very sorry, Angel. We've had more than our share of problems lately haven't we? When I had a mystery disease in my tank, some of the fish did have red markings like this. Never did find out for sure what it was, and still don't know. But when mine had the red streaks, they were already not eating, and listless. Let's hope someone comes along who can help. Sounds like you're doing all you can for the moment.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

Hi RackinRocky. This is the male angel (once belly bloated with bulging eyes), I think that looks better now. He is the one I moved into the hospital tank, So I have been dealing with something for a while, yes  I hope to get some answers here.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

So, for an update.

I've been keeping the water very clean and trying my best not to stress him out. I was feeding him normal food for a week or two because I didn't know what else to do. I decided to medicate his food with triple sulfa as of late, since I heard that sulfa drug works sometimes when other meds fail, and was particularly good for treating bloating. I didn't dose the whole tank since it is harsh and sometimes I feel using strong meds can do more damage than good. 

So, bad news. This is day 3 of using the sulfa doped pellets I made for him. He looks worse. Sometimes his redness would fade, sometimes it would look more intense, but right now, I am concerned with his bloating. He looks much more bloated, even in his eyes. I think he is even having a little difficulty swimming, he is slower getting his food.

The only thing I know to do is continue using the sulfa pellets, try to give them to him 3 times a day and maybe add epsom slats to the tank again. I added them before, but they will be w/c'd out by now. I know it will raise the ph a bit, and I wanted to keep things as consistent as possible, but idk what would be better.

Anyone? If I hear nothing, I will add the salts.


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

So sorry, Angel, to hear this! I haven't kept up on this thread, and forgot about it. I've heard the triple sulfa is excellent, as its a broad spectrum antibiotic. But you're right--how is one to know which med might help, and which might do more harm than good? Goodness, but your boy has been fighting this for a while!

I think I would do what you are doing--continue the triple sulfa and add epsom salts for the bloating. Sometimes we need to stop antibiotics if there's a bad reaction, but its also a bad thing to stop them too soon, when they might do some good if used for the entire course. You have certainly put forth a great effort for that lucky little fish.

I hope someone else has some light to shed on this. Its too bad animals and fish can't talk, and tell us how they feel, or if something seems to be helping them. Please keep us updated, and thinking of you...


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

It's all good RackinRocky, I know you care. I think I will do the epsom salts again, see if the bloating goes down tomorrow. I made him some new food, not as strong, same med, because he was spitting the other stuff out. If he doesn't eat, there's nothing I can do. I already tired kanamycin in the water and it did nothing. Thanks for your vouch and thoughts


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

Yeah, Kanamycin didn't help when I used it either. I even used it with Furan II, which is supposed to be SUPER broad spectrum, and still lost the fish I was treating. Sometimes I think some of them are just not cut out for life here on earth, unfortunately.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

I'll just say, I was told by a few (including 'my fish guy' at my LFS) that I would not be able to cure him. I could only alleviate the symptoms. Someone else told me once they bloat, it's terminal. So I may have to make the decision soon, but not until I am sure I can't make life comfortable again for him or I am convinced he will not make it through.


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

Yep, been there, and I HATE making that decision. Especially if its a favorite fish. Its a bummer. I think you'll know when its "time." Somehow, they let us know, whether they are a horse, dog, cat, bird or fish.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

He won't eat the medicated food, just lets it sink to the bottom. I put the epsom salts in, but he is still as bloated as before I put them in. I fed him regular food last night (since he wouldn't eat the medicated stuff anyway) and I think it might be over tonight. Well, I tried, I would be curious to find out if anyone ever really *cured *their fish of septicemia, I sure gave it a shot. Thanks for all your support, RackinRocky, you were the only one that gave any help at all. Guess septicemia has people stumped........


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## Tolak (Nov 13, 2012)

What temperature are you keeping this fish at?


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

About 1 1/2 months ago, I raised the temp to 82f in his hospital tank, and added aeration (water surface disruption). Recently, the last two weeks, I put the temp down to 78f after keeping it at 80f for for about a month. The ph in his hospital tank is 7.6. Where he got sick, it was 6.8. I can't get the ph in his hospital tank down. I don't know why, could be the epsom salts.


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## Tolak (Nov 13, 2012)

Drop the temperature, get it as low as 70F, and don't feed at all. The idea is to make as inhospitable an environment as possible for the bacteria, at that temperature the fish's metabolism will be way low, feeding will cause problems.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

hmmmmmm. Thanks for the instructions. I could try that I guess, depending on how cold I can get the tank. Although, I do feel bad about the stress I will be putting my fish through. I should post a new pic of him, just in case there's no hope anyway. I should have done that a month ago. I just wouldn't want to put him through more stress to die.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

Here he is today. I thought you should have an updated pic. He is much more bloated and his bleeding is worse. I had already put my mind to euthanizing him, but my husband forgot the vodka when he went out. I could get him to do the rock thing, but I feel better using the clove oil and vodka method, he was a well liked fish and I feel he will die and suffer if I try any longer. I understand your logic, like keeping the water too warm for ich, but it's in his bood and I feel he'll die before conditions are too bad for the bacteria in him to die.


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

So, to let everyone know, I had to humanely euthanize him. He was not good  It was too late for the temp drop thing. He refused to eat at last and was becoming more and more bloated. I thought it was the most fair for both of us.


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

For some reason, I haven't been getting notifications, but just got one today. I'm so sorry to hear your guy lost the battle, after fighting for so long. So frustrating. When something like this happens, I always swear I won't get more fish, but I always end up replacing them. He was a very attractive fish. Hugs


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## angelcraze (Aug 31, 2013)

RackinRocky, thanks.

I actually hadn't been on in a while, but thought I should update the story, to document what worked, and what did not. I have some catching up to do. I 'put him down' almost 1/2 months ago now. Sometimes we win, sometimes we don't.


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## RackinRocky (Feb 11, 2012)

You were smart to make this thread, and keep it up, as I'm sure it will be helpful to others who have problems with their fish and illness. I wish everyone would do it.


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